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GOP Voter Registration Fraud Scandal 2012...
VA GOP VOTER REG FRAUDSTER OFF HOOK
Felony charges dropped against VA Republican caught trashing voter registrations before last year's election. Did GOP AG, Prosecutor conflicts of interest play role?...

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State investigators widening criminal probe of man arrested destroying registration forms, said now looking at violations of law by Nathan Sproul's RNC-hired firm...

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Arrest in VA: GOP Voter Reg Scandal Widens
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ALL TOGETHER: ROVE, SPROUL, KOCHS, RNC
His Super-PAC, his voter registration (fraud) firm & their 'Americans for Prosperity' are all based out of same top RNC legal office in Virginia...

LATimes: RNC's 'Fired' Sproul Working for Repubs in 'as Many as 30 States'
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'Fired' Sproul Group 'Cloned', Still Working for Republicans in At Least 10 States
The other companies of Romney's GOP operative Nathan Sproul, at center of Voter Registration Fraud Scandal, still at it; Congressional Dems seek answers...

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The Secret Koch Brothers Tapes...

Johns Hopkins Professor, E-Voting Security Expert Goes on Record Against Electronic Ballots at Congressional Hearings on Election Integrity...
By Brad Friedman on 3/9/2007 9:35am PT  

E-Voting expert, Johns Hopkins computer science and security professor, Avi Rubin, once again stated for the record, this time in his testimony before a House subcommittee hearing on "Ensuring the Integrity of Elections", that Direct Recording Electronic (DRE, usually touch-screen) voting systems --- with or without a paper trail --- are "not reasonable" for use in a democracy.

Period.

From his blog item Wednesday discussing his testimony (which also includes a link to his complete formal statement):

Finally, I was asked if I thought that a DRE with a paper trail was an adequate voting system. I replied that when I first studied the Diebold DRE in 2003, I felt that a Voter Verified Paper Audit Trail (VVPAT) provided enough assurance. But, I continued, after four years of studying the issue, I now believe that a DRE with a VVPAT is not a reasonable voting system. The only system that I know of that achieves software independence as defined by NIST, is economically viable and readily available is paper ballots with ballot marking machines for accessibility and precinct optical scanners for counting - coupled with random audits. That is how we should be conducting elections in the US, in my opinion.

So between Rubin's beliefs, and those of most every other computer scientist I've heard from, why do we (meaning Congress and their public-advocacy group supporters such as PFAW, Common Cause, MoveOn, VoteTrustUSA and others) continue to play this DRE game???

It's madness...

Take action to amend the Holt Election Reform Bill!
DEMAND A BAN ON DRE/TOUCH-SCREEN VOTING!
- Email Congress!
- Call your representatives!
See www.BradBlog.com/Holt for more details, coverage, talking points & information on all of the above!
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Role of Cheney and Bush in CIA Leak Scandal to be Probed in Hearings...
By Brad Friedman on 3/8/2007 9:15pm PT  

Impeachment, it seems to us, gets closer to "the table" every day now. From Truthout:

Congressman Henry Waxman, chairman of the House Oversight Committee, said Thursday he wants Special Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald to testify before his committee about his investigation into the leak of covert CIA operative Valerie Plame-Wilson's identity. Plame-Wilson, Waxman's office said, has agreed to testify before Congress on March 16.

The announcement comes on the heels of a story first reported by Truthout on Wednesday, which stated that some members of Congress were engaged in discussions Tuesday about the possibility of holding immediate hearings and asking Fitzgerald to provide evidence he obtained during the course of his three-year investigation about the roles Vice President Dick Cheney and other White House officials played in the Plame leak.
...
Waxman's letter [to Fitzgerald] states..."As a result of your investigation, you have a singular understanding of the facts and their implications that bear directly on the issues before Congress.... Your investigation had a narrow legal focus: Were any federal criminal statutes violated by White House officials?"
...
Waxman said the Libby trial raised important questions about whether "senior White House officials, including the vice president and senior adviser to the president Karl Rove, complied with the requirements governing the handling of classified information" related to Plame's classified status within the CIA.

Lest anyone think the buck stops in the Office of the Vice-President, however, it looks as if the not-insignificant evidentiary revelation concerning Cheney's hand-written note referring to "this Pres." may also be revisited by Congress.

Those two words were scratched out on Cheney's note, but were still clearly visible and discussed during trial testimony. Had they not been scratched out, Cheney's note would have read: "not going to protect one staffer & sacrifice the guy this Pres. asked to stick his head in the meat grinder because of the incompetence of others."

To be honest, we're amazed that detail was overlooked as much as it was when it originally appeared. According to Truthout:

The revelation that Bush may have known all along that there was an effort by members of his office to discredit the former ambassador raises the question: Was the president also aware that senior members of his administration compromised Valerie Plame's undercover role with the CIA? That is a question that very well may be answered if and when Fitzgerald testifies before Congress.
...
If Bush did indeed play an active role in encouraging Libby to take the fall to protect Karl Rove, as Libby's lawyers articulated in their opening statements, then that could be viewed as criminal involvement by Bush.

See the complete Truthout report for much more detail...

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And Another Reminder That 'Problems with Recent Elections Resulted in Loss and Miscount of Votes'
And Another Reminder that the both the U.S. Elections Assistance Commission (EAC) and the Mainstream Media Alike Have Utterly Failed in their Missions...
By Brad Friedman on 3/8/2007 2:14pm PT  
"Election officials, computer security experts, citizen advocacy groups, and others have raised significant concerns about the security and reliability of electronic voting systems, citing vague or incomplete standards, weak security controls, system design flaws, incorrect system configuration, poor security management, and inadequate security testing, among other issues. These security and reliability concerns are legitimate and thus merit the combined and focused attention of federal, state, and local authorities responsible for election administration."
-- GAO Report on Elections, 3/3/07

Whaddaya know? Yet another confirmation by the non-partisan GAO on Wednesday, in yet another sure-to-be-ignored report, that our voting systems across the country are a hellish patchwork of un-overseen technological mayhem and disaster. This latest is entitled "ELECTIONS: All Levels of Government Are Needed to Address Electronic Voting System Challenges" [PDF] and was presented at a Congressional oversight hearing yesterday on "Ensuring the Integrity of Elections."

But what are the chances that anyone will bother to notice either the report or the hearing? (We're talking to you, Mainstream Media!)

So far this article, and the one I've published over at ComputerWorld this morning, are the only ones to have done so.

My report opinion piece over there today offers details and analysis of that new report, and how it underscores --- yet again --- that our increasingly complicated system of voting in America would be immeasurably and immediately simplified by doing away with all dangerously disenfranchising, demonstrably unreliable, historically inaccurate, and easily hackable Direct Recording Electronic (DRE, usually touch-screen) voting systems.

(Sidenote: If you haven't already, take action to demand that Rep. Rush Holt's new, but dangerous, Election Reform bill be amended to ban all DRE voting systems by emailing Congress here and calling your legislative members here!)

My CW article today also points to earlier ignored GAO reports --- covered only by The BRAD BLOG when they were released --- but again referred to in the latest GAO report and worth underscoring here again, since few noticed the first time. To wit:

We concluded in 2005 that these concerns have caused problems with recent elections, resulting in the loss and miscount of votes.

Hello? [Thump-thump] Is this thing on?...

One last point to recommend my piece over there today: It offers fresh criticism of the EAC's latest woeful claim ("We can't decertify something we didn't certify"), and a related hint or two at an upcoming long-in-the-work investigative report we've been working on at The BRAD BLOG.

There's your tease. My full ComputerWorld article is here...

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So Much for 'Supporting the Troops'
MSNBC Doesn't Have Much to Be Proud of Either...
By Brad Friedman on 3/7/2007 6:36pm PT  

Pounding on several deadlines at once, so for the moment, here's something to chew on...

References to Anna Nicole and Walter Reed on cable networks on March 2:

NETWORK ANNA NICOLE WALTER REED
FOX NEWS 121 10
MSNBC 96 84
CNN 40 53

Courtesy of ThinkProgress, with more details here...

Discuss.

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By Brad Friedman on 3/7/2007 1:19pm PT  

heheh...


(Hat-tip Josh Marshall, who claims he's "been assured that the creators are not connected to the Obama campaign.")

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The First Amendment Wins Again...
By Brad Friedman on 3/6/2007 6:35pm PT  

Still more good news today! The appellate court in Missouri agrees with The BRAD BLOG!

The stories that were censored in Kansas over the weekend, regarding allegations of wrongdoing by the Kansas City Board of Public Utilities, have now been un-censored:

On Friday, a Jackson County judge barred The Kansas City Star from publishing an article based on the document and ordered the newspaper to remove an article from its Web sites Friday night.

But on Tuesday the Missouri Court of Appeals Western District ruled that the Friday action was unenforceable, and that had the effect of allowing publication.

Late Sunday night, The BRAD BLOG exclusively ran the censored stories in full --- in First Amendment solidarity with the two censored papers --- in the belief that the stories are in the public interest. Looks like the appellate court agrees with us.

As we've got our hands more than full, we'll leave it to the folks in Kansas now to deal with the substance of the story itself (which was/is quite troubling). In any case, we'll consider this a happy ending. For a change.

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CONYERS: 'It is time to rein in this President and his Administration'
SÁNCHEZ: 'DoJ acted behind closed doors to intimidate appointees...Had no effective oversight during previous majority'
By Brad Friedman on 3/6/2007 5:15pm PT  

Sent to The BRAD BLOG by the House Judiciary Democrats concerning this morning's oversight hearings on the U.S. Attorney firings (full statement posted at end of this article):

"Our country decided after the Watergate scandal that ideological partisanship has no place in our system of justice," said Chairwoman Sà¡nchez. "Unfortunately, the firings of these attorneys indicate that the Bush Administration has once again acted in the interest of its political party instead of the good of the nation."
...
"Today's testimony signals that it is time to rein in this President and his Administration before they do any further damage to our democracy," said Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers. "Today, we received strong evidence that the firing of these U.S. Attorneys was politically motivated, and we clearly need to follow up on these developments with further investigations."
...
David Iglesias, former U.S. Attorney from New Mexico, testified that U.S. Senator Pete Domenici and U.S. Representative Heather Wilson called him in the days before the close 2006 elections to discuss issuing an indictment against a local Democratic official. Mr. Iglesias said that after Senator Domenici abruptly hung up the phone, "I had a sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. Six weeks later I got the call that I had to move on."

H.E. "Bud" Cummins III, a former U.S. Attorney from Arkansas, testified that Michael Elston, Chief of Staff to Deputy U.S. Attorney General Paul McNulty, called him with a warning that any of the fired prosecutors who publicly discussed their cases would be targeted by negative information campaigns.
...
"The Department of Justice, which had no effective oversight during the previous majority, has been acting behind closed doors to empower political cronies and intimidate its own appointees," said Chairwoman Sà¡nchez. "This thuggish behavior is beneath our democracy and underscores the importance of Congressional oversight, a function that Chairman Conyers and I are committed to continue."

In regard to the alleged threats of retaliation against the attorneys for speaking out on this, an email from Cummins, published by Sacramento Bee, gives contemporaneous specifics. According to SacBee...

Former U.S. attorney Bud Cummins, who resigned in December and was replaced by Karl Rove assistant Timothy Griffin, sent this Feb. 20 e-mail to five other fired U.S. attorneys after receiving a phone call from the Justice Department following comments he made to The Washington Post for an article published Feb. 18.

Of course, Gonzales today said none of it ever happened, these aren't the droids you're looking for.

The complete statement issued by the Judiciary Committee Democrats follows below...

--- Click here for REST OF STORY!... ---

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The Republican Senator, Decorated Vietnam War Vet, Puts the I-Word 'Back on the Table' in Esquire Interview...
By Brad Friedman on 3/6/2007 2:20pm PT  

SEN. CHUCK HAGEL (R-NE) IN ESQUIRE TODAY...

"The president says, 'I don't care.' He's not accountable anymore," Hagel says, measuring his words by the syllable and his syllables almost by the letter. "He's not accountable anymore, which isn't totally true. You can impeach him, and before this is over, you might see calls for his impeachment."
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By Brad Friedman on 3/5/2007 5:36pm PT  

Out this morning from the National Security Whistleblowers Coalition...

Two FBI Whistleblowers Confirm Illegal Wiretapping of Government Officials and Misuse of FISA

State Secrets Privilege Was Used to Cover Up Corruption and Silence Whistleblowers
...
William Weaver, NSWBC Senior Advisor: "These abuses of power are precisely why we must pay attention to whistleblowers. Preservation of the balance of powers between the branches of government increasingly relies on information provided by whistleblowers, especially in the face of aggressive and expanding executive power. Through illegal surveillance members of Congress and other officials may be controlled by the executive branch, thereby dissolving the matrix of our democracy."

Details, including new information in the case of gag-ordered FBI whistleblower Sibel Edmonds, and her attempt to tell her story posted by RAW STORY right here...

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'Conservative' Bloggers Call on CPAC to Exclude Ann Coulter, But Give Themselves a Pass for Enabling Her For Years
The Sad, Discredited Republican Clown's Long Documented History of Vile Hate Speech and Rhetoric Conveniently Ignored by Newly Converted 'Conservatives' Only Now Declaring 'the Age of Ann Has Passed'
By Brad Friedman on 3/5/2007 2:13pm PT  

Credentialed "Conservative" bloggers from last weekend's CPAC have created a petition calling for "speaking invitations [to] no longer be extended to Ann Coulter" at the conference.

They declare that "the Age of Ann has passed."

You'll pardon us if we're less than impressed by the call. The "Age of Ann" has been in full swing for years, in no small part, due to folks like the ones signed onto this "open letter," and only now that she's uttered a line that even they can't apologize for --- in calling John Edwards a "faggot" --- are they hoping to protect themselves by disassociating.

Where were they after she referred to Arabs as "ragheads" at last years conference and joked about "taking a shot" at killing Bill Clinton?

Or when she joked about assassinating Justice John Paul Stevens? Blowing up the NY Times building? Bludgeoning Democrats with baseball bats? And claiming that 9/11 widows were "enjoying" their husbands' deaths?

Where were they when Coulter posted the private, unpublished family phone number of BRAD BLOG Guest Blogger Lydia Cornell in retaliation for our having posted her responsible, journalistic article which was critical of Coulter? (Coulter was able to run Lydia's phone number on the front page of her website for days, since Lydia mistakenly offered her the courtesy of commenting on the charges prior to running the article and so had emailed her private phone number to make responding easy. The death threats and visits to Lydia's house received in return thereafter, we suppose, are thanks for that professional courtesy.)

In February of 2006, The BRAD BLOG posted a short video, revealing Coulter's long-documented record of hate-speech, as compiled by a true conservative, Daniel Borchers of Citizens for Principled Conservatism. Prior to that, in 2005, we posted his Powerpoint presentation documenting her hypocritical claims of "Christian Values." Borchers has been calling on conservatives to rid the poison that is Coulter from their movement for years, long before it's now gotten so hot that these "conservative" bloggers have little choice but to do so in order to save themselves.

All throughout, these phonies have been welcoming her, and apologizing for her, as one of the GOP's top draws at political fund raisers from coast to coast.

Where are the mea culpas from these newly-ashamed "conservative" bloggers for having given Coulter a pass themselves all of these years? Why is it that they've suddenly discovered Christian and/or Family and/or Human Values? Will they be issuing their own apologies for enabling such a vile person for so long?

And while we're at it --- since it's been shown, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Coulter committed felony Voter Fraud down in Florida, will these "law and order conservatives" be condemning her for that as well? Even while they support legislation supposedly meant to curb such fraud (but in actuality devised solely to help keep legally-registered voters away from the polls)?

Somehow, we doubt it.

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In Support of the First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America...
[NOW UPDATED: To Include 'The Pitch' Version of the Story in full, along with the Kansas City Star's]
By Brad Friedman on 3/5/2007 12:40am PT  

UPDATE 3/6/06: Appellate judge overturns ruling! Story now un-censored! Glad we were right on this one from the get-go! Details...

===

Ed Note: Since running this story originally, the Google cache has also now been purged of the censored documents. Fortunately, we screen-captured and ran the text in full for each story below, as we believe them to be in the public interest. We have retained all of the original links to the locations of the story, despite their having been scrubbed.

A judge in Kansas City, Kansas, on Friday issued a temporary restraining order requiring that two area newspapers remove articles from their website which reported on alleged malfeasance by the Board of Public Utilities (BPU).

Jackson County Circuit Court Judge Kelly Moorhouse found in a 3-page order [PDF] that the stories were based on privileged attorney-client information, which was leaked to the newspapers, and that publication of any portion of it would cause "irreparable harm" to the BPU.

The Kansas City Star and The Pitch, a local news weekly, both reported about the forced removal of the material and their intention to appeal the rare judicial decision to censor their reporting. A story was also run about the matter by AP.

At the end of this article The BRAD BLOG will run the Kansas City Star's short article in full since it has been ordered removed --- foolishly in our opinion, particularly in the Internet age when such stories are instantly archived, as was this one, by Google's cache engine --- and appears clearly to be in the best interest of the public and their right to know about how their public utilities are being run...

--- Click here for REST OF STORY!... ---

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Presidential Candidate Becomes First to Join Growing Movement When Queried About Issue at Campaign Event in California
Edwards Becomes Second Politician in a Week to Announce Support for the Election Integrity Movement After Being Asked About it at Public Event
By Brad Friedman on 3/3/2007 11:05pm PT  

While it's unlikely to get as much attention as Ann Coulter calling him a "faggot" during her speech at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) last night, The BRAD BLOG has learned that John Edwards is the first Presidential Candidate to announce his support for a growing movement calling for a ban on the use of all Direct Recording Electronic (DRE, usually touch-screen) voting systems in American elections.

The BRAD BLOG was contacted late last night by Progressive Democrats of America (PDA) Board Chair Mimi Kennedy with the news that during a campaign event in Los Angeles Edwards agreed to join her organization in calling for an end to electronic ballots in American elections.

PDA has been one of many groups calling for the ban and other important amendments to Rep. Rush Holt's (D-NJ) new Election Reform bill (HR 811), recently introduced in the U.S. House of Representatives.

Kennedy, an activist and actress well known for her role as Dharma's mother on ABC's Dharma and Greg, told The BRAD BLOG that during a Q & A period following his address last night, she asked Edwards whether he would join PDA in their campaign calling for "the complete removal of all Touch-Screen Direct Record Electronic voting machines from U.S. elections, with or without a paper trail."

Drawing an "X" in the air as the question was being asked, Edwards --- who was reportedly upset at Sen. John Kerry's decision not to contest the 2004 Presidential Election count, or lack thereof, in Ohio --- answered with a definitive "Yes!"

"Yes!" echoed Kennedy in response as the audience reportedly cheered and applauded.

Edwards's public support for a ban on DRE voting systems follows just over a week after Congresswoman Maxine Waters (D-CA) was asked a related question by an Election Integrity advocate at a public event at the University of California/Santa Cruz. Waters announced, in response to the query, that she would be withdrawing her co-sponsorship of the Holt bill in the wake of the growing concerns about several troubling shortcomings in the proposed legislation.

Kennedy attended the event, sponsored by the Pacific Palisades Democratic Club, with friend and former TAXI co-star Rhea Perlman, who unsuccessfully tried to video tape the Q & A session on her cell phone. The BRAD BLOG is attempting to locate a complete video of the event and we'll update this item if and when we do.

Before an audience estimated at 400, Kennedy rose and said to the former Vice-Presidential candidate...

--- Click here for REST OF STORY!... ---

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The Hate-Monger, Apparent Vote Fraud Felon Continues her Pathetic Downward Spiral Today in D.C. at CPAC...
By Brad Friedman on 3/2/2007 5:51pm PT  

In her increasingly embarrassing and desperate downward spiral, Ann Coulter, the once-respected "conservative" pundit, continues to morph into obnoxious circus clown. Kinda ala Don Rickles. Save for the funniness.

The Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) superstar, hate-monger --- and apparent vote fraud felon --- let fly with these gems in her packed headliner speech at the conference today, where she continues to retain her rock star status:

"What's Al Gore up to these days? Four hundred pounds....Did Al Gore actually swallow Michael Moore?"
...
"Obama is half-white and half-black....Clinton was half-white, half-trash."
...
"I was going to have a few comments about John Edwards but you have to go into rehab if you use the word faggot." (laughter, applause, cheers, whistles from the crowd)

Nice.

Hard to say whether it's an improvement over last year's Coulter CPAC speech:

"I think our motto should be post-9-11, 'raghead talks tough, raghead faces consequences.'" (followed by a boisterous ovation)

And on killing Bill Clinton, in response to a question from a Catholic University student about her biggest moral or ethical dilemma:

"There was one time I had a shot at Clinton. I thought 'Ann, that's not going to help your career.'"

We guess she feels that calling John Edwards a "faggot" will help her career. Judging from some of her fans, she may be right.

Apparently "hate" is a Conservative Family Value. Who knew?

(Hat-tip to RAW STORY who has more details and a video clip...)

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First Subpoenas Issued by Dems Since Taking Control of Congress...
By Brad Friedman on 3/1/2007 3:51pm PT  

As The BRAD BLOG reported yesterday would happen today, the U.S. House Judiciary Committee's Subcommittee on Administrative Law has today voted to issue subpoenas in the matter of the forced firing of U.S. Attorneys at the Dept. of Justice after pressure from higher-ups.

According to a statement just received by The BRAD BLOG (full statement posted below), the subcommittee voted to issue subpoenas requiring former U.S. Attorneys David C. Iglesias, Carol Lam, H.E. Cummins, III, and John McKay to appear at a hearing next Tuesday.

"The former U.S. Attorneys are alleging very serious charges against the Administration and we need to hear from them," Judiciary Chairman John Conyers (D-MI) says in his statement. "We want to hear their stories and we want the Administration to address the charges head on so that we can get to the bottom of this."

The subpoenas, issued as a "last resort" according to subcommittee Chairwoman, Linda Sà¡nchez (D-CA), are the first to be issued by the Democrats since taking control of Congress.

We must run, so we'll refer you to the full statement below for more details for the moment...

--- Click here for REST OF STORY!... ---

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Common Cause Election Issue Rep Relies on Same Old Discredited Talking Point Chestnuts to Avoid Calling for Ban of DRE/Touch-Screen Voting Machines
Link to Complete Text-Transcript, Audio...
By Brad Friedman on 3/1/2007 3:38pm PT  

Last Friday, during my regular weekly appearance on The Peter B. Collins Show, Susannah Goodman of Common Cause was invited to join us for a discussion of the Holt Election Reform Bill (HR811).

Common Cause is one of the groups which currently supports the bill as is, and doesn't believe it's necessary to amend it to require a full ban on DRE (Direct Recording Electronic, usually touch-screen) voting systems. As we've discussed here in some detail, a number of these large public advocacy groups, such as Common Cause, People for the American Way (PFAW), MoveOn, and VoteTrustUSA have been not only supporting the Holt bill, but using disingenuous and/or very weak and/or very naive talking points to back up their support for the bill.

Susannah used most of those talking points in our discussion/debate from last Friday. I take no particular joy in pointing this out, or the similar behavior of the other groups, or Holt's office themselves, in regard to all of this. I believe them to essentially be "good guys" on these matters, but on this point, they are dangerously and irresponsibly wrong, in my opinion. Heading into another Presidential Election, still using disenfranchising DRE systems is a recipe for potential disaster that America simply cannot afford after two previously questionable (putting it kindly) elections.

The entire text transcript may be read online, along with the full audio, posted here...

Here's a quick sampling of our discussion...

BRAD: Susannah suggested that someone here is calling for a hand count [of paper ballots]. I'm not. I know that there's a lot of folks who are and that's fine by me. There are some places that do do hand counting "“ up in New Hampshire, I believe, they do some hand counting. But the point is, she had mentioned going back and counting 3% of the ballots in an audit later on. My question is why Susannah, or anyone else, wouldn't be in favor of counting 100% of the ballots in the first place, using those optical scan machines or a hand count, either one. "¦ Why wouldn't we just count these ballots, these paper ballots, in the first place on Election Day? That's what we need. That's what Americans need"¦

PBC: And Susannah, in an ideal world I imagine you'd support elimination of the DREs. But do you think that's an achievable goal in the near term, either by '08 or 2010?

GOODMAN: Well, I actually think it's a bit of a red herring. I mean, I think that, as Brad was saying, you know, you could take 100% of those ballots and you still scan them through an optical scanner. That's still electronic.

BRAD: No problem. That's great.

GOODMAN: It's - the counting piece of this is electronic and it's, it will absolutely, 100%, there will be a time when it absolutely fails, because it's a machine and machines break.

BRAD: Well, that's right, but we'll have a paper ballot that's been marked by the voter that they'll be able to then go back and check, by any means necessary. We will not have that with the touch-screen system. And I'd be interested in - Peter said that you assumed that she'd be, Susannah would be in favor of banning those DREs. I'd like to actually know where Common Cause and Susannah is "“ would you guys be in favor of a ban on touch-screen voting machines?

GOODMAN: I, that's not where we are, and the reason is that, I really see this bill as, I mean, what you have in, for example in New Mexico, is there are people that can mark a ballot by hand, but there are people that cannot mark a ballot by hand, because they have a vision impairment, or they're blind, or they don't have use of their hands, and"¦

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