That David Gergen has been making the media rounds hardcore about this case worries me slightly...

Not only was Chalabi responsible.....He and Michael Ledeen had several CIA agents forge them!!!!!

Justin Ramiando reports on entire NIGER forgery scam
Make sure the entire media reports the truth on that fact and the charade blows up all over Washington.....

Justin has been on top of the Niger documents since Day one, alongside Jason Leopold.

Doug E.

Good catch David. It is a good thing that prosecutors bring down corruption ... but actually absolutely nothing of the kind has been done ... YET.

We should be careful and wait for this thing to play out.

There is great evil afoot and I do not want any of us to build our expectations up to such a level that we can be damaged by disappointment.

Desperate things are done when animals are cornered, and if these neoCons are truly cornered expect some desperate things to happen.

Dredd You got it....and they already have...

They've attempted to obstruct justice twice....

They've issued fake terror alerts....

The fake Israelis/Likud spies know they're going down...

But the only way to ensure their downfall, is to keep the media spotlighted on them at every turn. If they got nowhere to run to, and if all focus is on them, they will become restless and throw themselves to the end of their demise.

Doug E.

Can somebody fill me in on David Gergen?

Thanks!
Kira

Can someone explain this to me? I mean, this being the Niger thread..

Aren't the wing-nuts saying we can't trust anything the UN says, yet now we're supposed to invade -another- soverign country.. only this time, based on what the UN says? but they said "don't go into Iraq".. we did anyway..

:confused:

Wonder if any average Republicans will catch that, Savanster.

Depends....is the average republican that stupid to think Syria will "invade" everyone now?

Are they that easily fooled by Zionist Likud propaganda?

If they are, its their demise. The US forces who enter Syria will never return. It will be a bloody hell-hole, and as Fitzgerald's investigation winds down.......the hell hole will engulf the entire Likud party and the republicans.

The evidence in the case for Syria was manufactured in the same way Cheney's lovely dual agents have manufactured everything.....

Was Syria ever a threat to "America"? Of course not..but it was a threat to Israel, and according to them is "absolutely out of control" (Shocker)

Doug E.

Please forgive me for going off-topic, but it's just...
just FREAKING UNBELIEVABLE & this just CANNOT be freaking happening in my country.

From WaPo, today:
Aide Says FEMA Ignored Warnings
Testimony Covers Communication as Levees Breached

By Spencer S. Hsu
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, October 21, 2005; Page A01

WaPo Article

"For 16 critical hours, Federal Emergency Management Agency officials, including former director Michael D. Brown, dismissed urgent eyewitness accounts by FEMA's only staffer in New Orleans that Hurricane Katrina had broken the city's levee system the morning of Aug. 29 and was causing catastrophic flooding, the staffer told the Senate yesterday.

... About 7 p.m. Aug. 29 [Monday], Bahamonde said, he called Brown and warned him of "massive flooding," that 20,000 people were short of food and water at the Superdome and that thousands of people were standing on roofs or balconies seeking rescue.

Brown replied only: "Thank you. I'm going to call the White House," Bahamonde said.

It is unclear what Brown told his superiors or the president's aides. He has testified to receiving "conflicting information" about 10 a.m. Monday that the levees had broken and at noon or 1 p.m. that "the levees had only been topped. So we knew something was going on between 10 and noon on Monday."

Bahamonde contradicted accounts by Brown that FEMA had positioned 12 staffers in the Superdome before the storm, that Bahamonde's reports Monday were "routine" and that FEMA medical personnel were on hand before Tuesday.

At 11:20 a.m. Aug. 31, Bahamonde e-mailed Brown, "Sir, I know that you know the situation is past critical . . . thousands gathering in the streets with no food or water . . . estimates are many will die within hours."

Mr. Fitzgerald, people need to go to jail for this. Whatever else they are guilty of---bush, brown, chertoff, rice & cheney---
NEED TO GO TO JAIL FOR THIS. FOR THIS!!!

GENOCIDE IS AN IMPEACHABLE OFFENSE!!!

Joan - how are you doing? I'm concerned about Wilma's impact on your area. Let us know ...

This info re: Bahamonde's emails and phone call to Brown is truly awful. I'm posting another article with a comment by Francis Townsend:

Bush Adviser Acknowledges Lack of Preparation for Katrina

[snip] Townsend delivered a sharp message in President Bush's name to tamp down internal criticism amid a swirl of House and Senate investigations, saying: "It's clear we want to quickly identify and fix problems and not play a blame game. . . . Lessons are what the president wants, not finger-pointing," she said. "He is less interested in last time. . . . His concern is with the next time." [snip]

Shit --- this is like a murderer who gets caught and then says - "hey! Let's not play a blame game ... let's not worry about the murder I just committed ... let's just make sure it doesn't happen again."

But what I want to know is WHY all this happened. I do not believe it happened because they got confused. Oh no. If it's true they got confused --- they are TOO STUPID and INEPT to be leading our country. On the other hand --- it looks like they had another reason to IGNORE the information that all of us who had a TV or COMPUTER or CELL PHONE already knew.

Re: Ever broadening investigations

There are too many crimes committed by the Bush administration. Those of us who've watched, listened and read are shocked. This is beyond politics. This is beyond reason.

The American people have to respond if they want to restore some semblance of civilization to our government.

It's in the hands of the public. I know they aren't fully informed. Even we who read a lot are struggling to be well informed. But, the public have to say "Enough!" or their Republican Congress-critters won't respond. Congress has already made it clear they side with Bush. Only the threat of their own job loss, of if it comes to the election, the actual loss of their job, will bring change.

Re: What's behind it all?

I watched a History Channel show this evening about the Bosnian war. It was amazing to me to be reminded of the timeline, of how Bush I allowed the slaughter of the Muslims in Bosnia to go on and on and on. It seems George HW decided to wage a Holy War beginning way back then. Clinton tried in lage measure to stem the tide, but too much had already been allowed.

What happened to begin this awfulness? Why are the Bush family adamant about a Holy (or perhaps more accurate is Unholy) War? Has the Religious Right got that much hold? I doubt it. Has the Jewish lobby got that much influence? I doubt it. Was there that much money to be made through black market activities? It's hard to say. What is it with the Bush family and destruction? Are they secretly 'end of time' believers?

Re: DeLay

DeLay says a Dem judge isn't fair. But, even a moderate Repub was too easy on Clinton. They demanded a more radical right-winger (Ken Starr). Is he smiling because they've paid good money for the "right" judge? Is justice available anywhere in America so long as the Republicans are in charge?

Kira,
Thank you, my dear! We're waiting to see what Wilma does, if it weakens or gets stronger. My daughters & I were thinking of maybe driving to Georgia & staying in a hotel, but for right now we're watching how it progresses.

Mark,
"The American people have to respond if they want to restore some semblance of civilization to our government....It's in the hands of the public. I know they aren't fully informed..."

It's not in their hands & they can't respond because, as you say, they're NOT informed.
The people who rely on tv & newspapers don't KNOW about this stuff! I talk to people all the time who've never heard of Fitzgerald, Tom Delay, Valerie Plame, Jack Abramoff, Clint Curtis...hell, some of them don't know who Cheney is.
And even if they did, what action could they take?
Write their congressman?
I really don't mean to sound like a snotty bitch, but really, what avenues do We the People actually have?
All the ones I can think of have been done & are still being done. If the media doesn't cover the real news & Congress is part of the problem....then WHAT?

Just a reminder about another Chalabi connection:

"In a May 1 e-mail to Times colleague John Burns, The Post reported, Miller said: "I've been covering Chalabi for about 10 years, and have done most of the stories about him for our paper. . . . He has provided most of the front page exclusives on WMD to our paper." "

LINK

Rats!

Here's the link:

LINK

I give:

This Link To WaPo Article Works Now

Joan,,

You hit the target dead center!

The whole system is currupt. Jefferson said that we shouldn't be timid about making necessary changes in and for our country.

Private capitalism or state capitalism has always led to state fascism/totalitarianism. Money is power. It's concern's have never been the welfare of the governed. The people are tired and distracted from living without the dignity that they know is theirs by birth right.

It's time to re-examine the other possibilites that the elite have historiclly denied the people from pursuing.

I tell by children not to vote for businessmen, lawyers, the wealthy or professional bureaucrats.

My children have been to Europe and feel that America is finished as an example of greatness and a society concerned about the well being of it's elderly, poor, young, let alone for it's working people.

We need a new paradigm.

Throw out the Republicans and Democrates out of office and encourage good working people in our cities and towns to step forward for public office and bring us back to our senses. Support them and demand that we reexamine the system we live it.

Let's throw the gansters out!

Don

Joan,

You hit the target dead center!

The whole system is currupt. Jefferson said that we shouldn't be timid about making necessary changes in and for our country.

Private capitalism or state capitalism has always led to state fascism/totalitarianism. Money is power. It's concern's have never been the welfare of the governed. The people are tired and distracted from living without the dignity that they know is theirs by birth right.

It's time to re-examine the other possibilites that the elite have historiclly denied the people from pursuing.

I tell by children not to vote for businessmen, lawyers, the wealthy or professional bureaucrats.

My children have been to Europe and feel that America is finished as an example of greatness and a society concerned about the well being of it's elderly, poor, young, let alone for it's working people.

We need a new paradigm.

Throw out the Republicans and Democrates out of office and encourage good working people in our cities and towns to step forward for public office and bring us back to our senses. Support them and demand that we reexamine the system we live it.

Let's throw the gansters out!

Don

Kira, #5

I've been trying to sort out all the information coming out about the Plame case; why it was air tight for a year and a half, then information started to trickle out through anonymous sources and lawyers, until becoming the 24/7 soap opera it is now. Are the leaks meant to create a buzz so that if no major indictments are handed down, the whole thing will die out quickly?

Gergen was an advisor to nixon, reagan, bush, and clinton. To say this guy knows his stuff (not to mention the skeletons that must be in his closet) is probably a bit of an understatement. So when I see him all over the networks saying this thing can destroy the administration, I have to wonder why and who will benefit.

I'm just cautious in general about the days to come.

Talk about changing the subject

You should stop by Fuxed-up News, their blasting
"Able Danger" over the airwaves now, you know their motto, "We Distort You Decide"

Heh....the more Fox does it the more it blows up in their face....

Let them pull the thread of Able-Danger like a rabid dog........the fun begins.

Doug E.

OT, but its a doozy,

Marvin Bushes maid
squished by her own car, like right out of a Satanic movie

Chalabi was Judy Miller's source, remember.

So, what this boils down to, is the "security administration" again let us down, by being duped by some clown?

Nice work, Bush/Cheney "security administration" making us all safer (picture me doing the sarcastic "slow clap" as I'm saying this).

Kira,
I just checked out that article you linked to (#10). This made me laugh (though not exactly in a FUN way!):

from Ms. Townsend...
"Lessons are what the president wants, not finger-pointing...."

Oh, really? Funny how they say "let's not play the blame game" and then point fingers with the next breath. These guys pass the buck so often I'll bet they all have carpal tunnel syndrome.

"...He is less interested in last time.... His concern is with the next time..."

I'll BET he's not intested in last time, hahaha!! You know WHY, Ms. Townsend? Because people go to JAIL when their actions result in DEATH.

Somebody please help me out here. Where are all you lawyers on a Saturday morning?
Is it 'negligent homicide'? 1st, 2nd, 3rd degree manslaughter? What?

"...His concern is with the next time..."

Believe me, Ms. T, we are all out here fervently praying that there won't BE a next time.

Kira #5

BVAC #18 explains some about David Gergen. He is sorta like the conservatives that are exposing Ann "the man" Coulter and who were featured in a thread here recently.

In other words he strives to be an american first. Clinton had him as an advisor for a while, even tho he is a republican.

He is more in touch with truth and more against crime than those in the current white house. He has a website (link here).

It is significant that he is making damaging statements about this white house. I think his criticism may have the same basis or the same reason that George Wills had when he strongly criticized the admin.

I saw one interview where Gergen says we should follow this CIA outing all the way to the president. So it could mean that he has concluded that the special prosecutor is going to ask for indictments. The special prosecutor has put up a website (link here).

Another reason for Gergen's may be that it is another indicator that the sane republicans want rid of the insane neoCons that have attached themselves to that party.

Just as Justice Rehnquist feared what the neoCons were doing to the reputation of the third of American government he worked in, Gergen is afraid of them because he is aware of their depravity.

He is probably just trying to put America first, politics second at best, and is doing his civic duty when he criticizes the admin on the Plame outing and other crimes.

#21
Floridiot,
WOW! What a creepy, SUSPICIOUS story! GAD!!
And, gee, I'm shocked...SHOCKED!...to read that...

"...The Fairfax County Police....emphasized that Champagne's death was merely a quirky accident and no foul play was involved."

And at the end of that charming little story, there's THIS little tidbit:

"...As reported on WMR on October 14, Eric Miller, a Harvard Law School graduate and the Assistant Chief of Litigation for the SEC from 1999 to May 2005, was beaten to death on September 7, 2005 in the Alexandria Motel on Route 1, just around the corner from the Marvin Bush residence. Miller, an African American, was reported to have fallen on bad times and taken up with two white crack users."

Jesus in a white-washed jar!!

Thanks BVAC #18 and Dredd #25 for the info re Gergen. I noticed earlier that there is some discussion going on about him over at Huffington Post.

I agree with you, BVAC, about being "cautious in general." The game being played out is definitely a high-level RISK game with real lives and money at stake. I don't trust politicians in general and find myself in agreement with these words written by Mark Twain:

"It could probably be shown by facts and figures that there is no distinctly native criminal class except Congress." And, "Reader, suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." (Mark Twain)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Dredd - I hope Gergen will repeat his words (in the interview you cited) that "we should follow this CIA outing all the way to the president." I truly hope all these comments by influential Republicans will finally unhinge the unhinged and drop them into the bubbling indictment cauldron just in time for Halloween!!

This thread has so much information and leaves me with a very uneasy feeling. So many good points raised. I guess I am most disturbed by the fact that Fitzgerald is in D.C., more than likely in a room 'bugged' to the max. I saw here or somewhere, an artist's rendering of the old GJ's room, shabby, bugged perhaps, but D.C., don't doubt it for a minute.

All the hype leading up to this...I must agree with Dredd #3. Caged and cornered animals fight back.
Bush speaking at the Reagon library about breaking down this wall, what was he blabbering about, even the library officials rolled their eyes. What was that, a distracted mind? Syria is being targeted? Etc.,etc, etc.

Ohmigod, this is worse than a three ring circus. So much is happening that you just don't know which act to watch. Will this GJ end like the circus...where we just go home and life resumes as 'normal, whatever that is. M4

Merifour, from reading about Fitzie, I don't think he'd be dumb enough to think his office wasn't bugged. He's tried tough Mafia cases. I do pray for him every night, though.

What WAS that about bush and his off the wall comment? Did anybody catch that on video? I'd LOVE to see it. Anybody got a full transcript of the speech?

I agree that they will FIGHT back. Ghandi's words are so appropriate:

“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
More Ghandi:

- "The Roots of Violence: Wealth without work, Pleasure without conscience, Knowledge without character, Commerce without morality, Science without humanity, Worship without sacrifice, Politics without principles."

- The most heinous and the most cruel crimes of which history has record have been committed under the cover of religion or equally noble motives."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And finally this by Margaret Mead:

“Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has.”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

After the circus we will have a lot of nuts to sweep out.

#26 Joan,
As... somebody said, "You can't make this shit up"
(well I suppose somebody could)

Hurricane Patrick is coming! When those indictments start coming out it could go all the way to the top, he has after all spent an hour with Bush. Kira I share your concern for Fitzgerald who I sure hope is wearing body armor, has body guards, etc. As special prosecuter he has the full power of the Attorney General, the only level-headed person currently in federal government....that has to be a real threat to BushCo.

Kira, yesterday, I went to several sites and saw the article. He evidently was in LA on friday to attend the opening of an annex or something at the Reagon Library. They shut down the freeway for his motorcade but instead he used a helicopter, didn't bother to tell those in charge of closing 405 so many sat for hours. I can't tell you where I read it, but some commenters were upset they were stranded and the comment about the wall was done while he was photo-oping in front of a piece of the berlin wall....speculation was he was trying to be capitalize on Reagon to help his ratings, but his comment made no sense. Others commented that he seemed confused, distracted, etc. Sounded similiar to what many have noted here. Wish I could tell you where it was. I am just writing this from memory.

I so hope you are right about Fitz, I hope he is well protected and this whole thing doesn't fizzle. All the 'leaked' info leads me to believe there is a fly on the wall in the GJ room. Also, the GJ just moved to DC and time is running short for Fitz to end his investigation, another reason for bush to be incoherant? (my mind working overtime as it often does) M4

Kira, I lied. I just found another piece at Buzzflash linking to the LA Daily News, regarding the motorcade. The helicopter was not used because of fog, so I guess the truth is the freeway was closed for his motorcade. I also found the article I saw yesterday at Huff Post, re: the wall quote. M4

Hi Merifour!
I did find several articles on the 'off the wall' speech. The AP (of course) made it sound like the whole crowd CHEERED after bu$hit's comment. Wish somebody had it on video. It's just hard for us dissenters to get into these bu$hit speeches.

About Fitz ... you know, I have so little faith in the entire bunch in DC, including the lawyers working on cases meant to expose this cabal. I do find myself sitting on the fence most of the time ... even with Fitzie. Until we see the outcome I guess we won't know for sure and maybe not even then.

If Fitzie doesn't bring them down, they will say - "ok, now it's been tried and we're exonerated." At that point I will be convinced he was a shill all along. Oh me of little faith.

I'm tired and I'm cranky about it all and I don't have any free passes left. We shall see.

Yank had enuf of Bushes, of hurricanes, of the last 5 years! NO MORE, Fritz please tell us there will be no more war, no more hurricanes, no more Bushit!!! I wish we could make a law to outlaw ANY Bush to run for anything , including dogcatcher. They have been nothing but a bloodlust badluck bunch ever since Prescott. Oh well, enuf ranting, here's some facts now. Bikemessenger provided these links of the Niger Uranium Forgeries at Afterdowningstreet.org:

http://cryptome.org/niger-docs.pdf

Translations and discussions here:
http://cryptome.org/niger-docs3.htm

http://cryptome.org/niger-docs.htm

Oops, I meant FITZ , not Fritz. I do not want to mess up MY HERO's name!

Joan...Thank you for saying the word so conspicuously not mentioned...Genocide. in NO Cynthia McKinny asked Chertoff in the Katrina hearings,"The owners of the nursing home that didn't evacuate are being tried for homicide, do you think you should be too?' Chertoff and his assistant smirked but "Duke" Cunningham when asked if he should resign over investigations said "Why should I?" I understand he's toast now. The similarity of the two is arrogance not seriousness of crime. The retired school teacher being beaten up on MSM sent the message,"Don't come back." Donna Brazille said her relatives in NO were sent info. on how to file bankruptcy and get through foreclosure and no help from FEMA. These power mad idiots did not take into account the love you have for NO by just visiting. I'll bet the whole MSM has been there and love the city. Without it's people it is nothing. They are just unique.

#34 Kira, I agree, I too, have little faith anymore.

OT..looking up some info on Marvin's dead maid. Looking at his picture, he looks just like w. I wonder if Jeb was switched at birth, he doesn't look like his brothers or Poppy, with their beady little eyes. (I am not implying jeb is not a criminal too).
Sorry, just felt the urge to tell someone what my mind was saying......(g) Oh, just thought of something else, maybe jeb isn't Poppy's kid...now there's a scandal. What's up Babs.

I remember Poppy had a girlfriend also, in the 70's-80's, her name..Jennifer Fitzgerald. Am I bad. Sorry Brad, you can delete this post...am having a meri moment....

Open message to the Administration from my daughter, age 10:

Bush, you stink.

You are dumb. And I hate you. All people in Brazil hate you.

Thank you,
Pretty Little Princess

It's all on Fitz and that grand jury now, isn' t it?

MORE IMPORTANT NOW: 60 Minutes Niger story that never aired... Let's get it aired

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/3966

#35 Yank Had Enuf,

Please tell me that you aren't blaming the hurricanes on Bush too...

Whatever gave you that idea, nit? It seems you have a problem either reading or understanding content.

OT Alert

Elmer Fudd launches fresh attack on George Galloway!

Chalabi forges documents.

Miller believes Chalabi, reports WMD are legitimate.

Times supports WMD rationale for Iraq invasion by printing Miller's reports as factual.

Chalabi revealed as self-serving phony, becomes persona non grata with State Department.

WHIG devises new rationale...uranium from Niger.

Wilson investigates, editorializes that no clear evidence exists to support uranium/Niger rationale, though it's possible.

WHIG decides to discredit Wilson, leaks story that his wife (a CIA operative) arranged the trip. Novak reports Wilson's wife works for CIA, refuses to reveal source, says "There's no story here."

Miller investigates for Times. Doesn't write story, but knows who tipped Novak off, refuses to say, goes to jail for refusing.

Times says Miller is upholding journalistic standards.

Rove's testimony to grand jury, and Libby's, found in conflict with each other's and with Miller's notes, which were only "found" near end of inquiry.

Times puts Miller on leave of absence. Public Editor Calame says it will be hard for her to come back.

Tierney, Times Op-Ed columnist, writes "What's the Point?" (sometimes a leak is just a leak).

On same day, Kristof, Times Op-Ed columnist, compares Fitzgerald to Inspector Javert of "Les Miserables." Column's headline calls Special Prosecutor (who has been praised by Bush)
"Hurricane Fitzgerald," even though no indictments have been sought and everything is rumor.

Yes, folks, we're still in a Gilded Age. In 1925, when Senators Walsh and Wheeler held hearings into the Teapot Dome Scandal (which disgraced the Harding administration), our friends at the Times referred to them as "Montana scandalmongers."

Liberal paper? Not.

What's been coming out this morning SOURCES: FITZGERALD DECIDES TO is kind of a bummer! So far no word on the bigger issue of going to war on false information and lies.

Keeping everything crossed though.

I know, Bluebear2. The only thing that gives me hope is that (according to the article) "they say that he will focus charges in the arena of lying to investigators." Well --- that's what they did to Bill Clinton. Is this really an area of hope or am I just a dreamer?

RLM --- wonderful timeline you put together. That's it in a nutshell.

My opinion of a huge segment of Americans keeps falling lower and lower. I cannot believe so many people I know personally or that I'm related to, continue to mouth the White House propaganda without a single bit of motivation to find out whether it is true or not.

I hope Fitz isn't just a Rovian diversion.

Hi Kira,

You said: "My opinion of a huge segment of Americans keeps falling lower and lower."

I am also amazed by this: Poll: Most Americans reject evolution

I thought this country was supposed to be the world leader in Science understanding.

Bluebear2 - I read that poll last night and just nearly went into shock. I really had more faith that we (as a people) had become much more enlightened, but I guess it's just the crowd I tend to gravitate toward. It's a sickening realization.

Unreal.

Kira,

Another interesting item today:

A new poll taken showed 90% of Americans feel that Bushco has acted illegally or unethically.

They asked the same people how they felt about Bushco's ethics and 51% gave a favorable answer.

In other words about 40-50% feel it is ok for our government to behave unethically and illegally.

Go Figure CIA leak probe has Washington waiting

A funny sideline - I ran across "Shouting" Sue at another blog's comment section. I think her caplock is broken. Folks there were telling her to calm down and suggesting various tanquilizers. One person had a good point in telling her that most people probably skim over her posts and don't find her message.