Somehow I suspect the Moscow Times didn't give the same objective coverage to the Ukraine election fraud.

Maybe someone should start a New York Moscow Times newspaper. That way all election fraud will be covered. Call it "glasnost on vote-flipping."

Yeah, "election fraud", in our increasingly sick political system, is when the other side wins.

Not much anymore is able to be handled objectively and in an unbiased manner.

What is so clearly not a partisan issue, vote machine integrity, is a political football.

It is not the use of machines that is bad, but the use of bad machines.

So Moscow would not have complained about the original Ukraine election which Moscow favorites won, and which exit polls showed was fraudulent, but did complain when they lost in the second election.

It is the same in the US. When anyone mentions vote machine fraud what comes to the winners mind, like Moscow did and the republicans here did, is to think "sore looser" or "conspiracy theory".

In that climate integrity goes down the drain and partisan politics raises its ugly head on a non-partisan issue.

Exactly right. My congressman, Chris Shays, said he didn't go along with challenges to the 2004 election, and didn't attend the Conyers hearings a few days after the election, because he saw them as "partisan in nature."

Conyers had invited every Republican on Capitol Hill to participate, and not one showed up. So by boycotting the "partisan" meeting, Republicans in effect created a self-fulfilling and self-interested scenario...that the meeting was in fact partisan. So by not going along with what he called a partisan effort (and thus remaining above the fray in a non-partisan posture), Chris actually made Conyers look like a partisan Democrat.

And Congress wonders why its approval ratings are even lower than Bush's, difficult as that is to attain.

As long as we vote with machines. it doesn't matter what "We the People" think anyway, why does Bushco say "Polls don't matter" now?
Because they don't matter

I'm beginning to think, that the only way to stop the Bush regime, is to refuse to serve in the military. They can keep stealing elections, but without the military to do their bidding, they would be powerless.

I continue to find it incredible, the American MSM blackout on reporting vote fraud on electronic machines.

On Democracy NOW! news last night, their guest was a British militaryman who quit the British military, and is urging others to do so.

It is so frustrating, seeing the obvious danger to our country's integrity, in insisting on keeping these machines, as they are, in our voting process.

I'm reminded of "The Boston Tea Party". It was a time when our forefathers protested by throwing over-taxed tea into the bay.

Is the country being forced into a "Boston Diebold Party"? These crooked machines have been exposed as being unreliable and unaccountable, and yet, on they go!

Remember JFK's haunting comment: "Those who make peaceful revolution impossible make violent revolution inevitable".

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"It is not the use of machines that is bad, but the use of bad machines."

When it comes to elections, I disagree. We gain NOTHING by having these machines in place. There is no point in using a machine when the machine provides no benefits.. that is, using machines "just because we can" is part of what's wrong with America today.

Laziness and arrogance are the root of all our problems.. and if those 2 afflictions weren't rampant in our soceity, we'd never allow "those in power" to behave like they do.. Empathy (even denied) is a powerful mitigator.

Not sure what to make of "some other country" pointing out our "flaws".. since MOST Americans want to say "so what! we're #1!.. fuck you! WE did for in the past, YOU OWE US!".. etc etc.

I think the pertinent point was that we no longer, as a soceity, care to look at things objectively. Everyone seems to be content to grind an axe for their agenda and facts be damned. Libs do it on occasion and that's what the Repugs use as ammo.. course, the Pugs do it a LOT more, but are more vicious and vocal in their attacks on Libs, and Libs tend to be more rational and try to argue the points [that should be ignored, for the most part]. Pugs get Libs in a spin with distortions and lies and misinformation, then walk away saying "see? look at that crazy mess! they don't even know what we're talking about anymore!".. all according to plan..

We could begin dumping crates of mangoes off ships.

Well I'm glad (and ashamed) our fraudulent voting system is being mocked worldwide! It seems like shaming them is the only way to get a reaction and even that don't work for the king with no clothes continues to believe he is well dressed.

Have a National Strike Day! That's what we need to do and soon!

F'g GOP refuses to investigate the NSA domestic spying, so what if the pres and cronies broke the law....is this what we want representing us? Idiots that accept fraudulent voting, spying, lying to congress and citizens, manufactured lies to bring us to war, cronie deals to enrich their friends while bankrupting the USA! Enough....let's stop the country STRIKE, STRIKE, STRIKE!

RE: Hacking and controlling electronic votes

Wonder if anyone else has done research on an amazing book VOTESCAM by James & Ken Collier?
Began in 1988 and finished in 1992 on the book shelves for 1 week prior to being pulled.

It chronicles everythign that is happening now with our electronic voting.

Another interesting site Kris Millegan re: Skull & Bones Society frm 1996 and how the people in power feel the masses can be mind controlled by controlling media.

Two sites worth googling. Astonishing that what is happening now was predicted more than 10 years ago.

Savantster #8

So, have you heard of the Amish voting system?

Seriously, there is a time for all things. Perhaps now is not the time to use machines for voting.

But I know machines and the software that controls them can be made safe and sound.

Software runs the Mars Rovers (stilllll gooooinnnngggg), casini at saturn, airliners - autopilot, missiles, automobiles, ATM machines, and just about everything else ... even Brad Blog.

Yet I can agree that there is a time not to use them and a time to use them. It depends on the facts and circumstances.

I also oneself something would want to find out on this theme. Very attentively I will read every post.