READER COMMENTS ON
"CHRIS FLOYD: The Nightmare Comes True: WMD Terrorists in Iraq"
(46 Responses so far...)
COMMENT #1 [Permalink]
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Paula Bushkoff
said on 9/7/2005 @ 10:50 am PT...
Thank you, thank you, thank you for posting this article. I read about it on Buzzflash last week and emailed it to Kat - best way I knew to get an article here.
I hope Cindy Sheehan is made aware of this. She has such a good way of staying on message and a gift for communication. She is simple, honest and compelling. She is to truth what Dubya is to lies. I hope this will be part of the demonstration on Washington later in September.
I know the hate mongers won't care - not even for our own soldiers and their families - but enough hearts and souls in America - when they see the proof with their own eyes........
COMMENT #2 [Permalink]
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Nana
said on 9/7/2005 @ 3:31 pm PT...
Thanks so much for this information. I eagerly read and print everything I can find on the topic.
I have reason to believe my youngest son was exposed to this poison, and recently began asking him questions. He is a vet, a tanker, who came home with mysterious symptoms. He is not getting better, despite VA treatment and hospitalization. Each new symptom gets him another pill or x-ray.
I'm going to demand he be tested for DU exposure, and I'm going to be armed with information.
We must get this information out there! This is so wrong.
COMMENT #3 [Permalink]
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Reg
said on 9/7/2005 @ 3:45 pm PT...
The criminal coporate media is as guilty of murder as the Bush crime family. Here's an imporant quote from a noted NY journalist long gone from the scene:
There can be no higher law in journalism than to tell the truth and to shame the devil. - Walter Lippman
The devil has not been shamed...but there's a way to do it. Good read here: SHAMING THE DEVIL:
CLICK HERE
COMMENT #4 [Permalink]
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MMIIXX
said on 9/7/2005 @ 4:12 pm PT...
This is just a cheap way of disposal, how much would it cost to safely dispose of 3,000 tons of depleted uranium.These people ONLY think in US$ ,they will brag about how much money they saved their friends (who own the power stations) .
Vets will file a class action when they start producing deformed off spring ...hold on didn't the Admin limit that path already .Surprise ,Surprise ,Surprise.
COMMENT #5 [Permalink]
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Peggy
said on 9/7/2005 @ 6:06 pm PT...
Yes, Bush's "Christian" Republican Conservatives want to repeal Roe vs. Wade because "they don't want the unborn children killed." But it's okay for Bush's "Christian" Republican Conservatives to poison and kill and maim with DU the unborn children, the children who are already born, their fathers, mothers, grandparents, Americans, Iraqis, anyone in Iraq --- that's different! And there is no end to their lust for the suffering and deaths of others.
COMMENT #6 [Permalink]
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Peggy
said on 9/7/2005 @ 6:08 pm PT...
Yes, Bush's "Christian" Republican Conservatives want to repeal Roe vs. Wade because "they don't want the unborn children killed." But it's okay for Bush's "Christian" Republican Conservatives to poison and kill and maim with DU the unborn children, the children who are already born, their fathers, mothers, grandparents, Americans, Iraqis, anyone in Iraq --- that's different! And there is no end to their lust for the suffering and deaths of others.
COMMENT #7 [Permalink]
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Peg C
said on 9/7/2005 @ 6:21 pm PT...
Thanks. I LOVE the anger! When it boils up all over this country, perhaps something can be salvaged.
COMMENT #8 [Permalink]
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David L. Griscom
said on 9/7/2005 @ 11:34 pm PT...
I have been somewhat of a student of both poisoning by radioactive materials AND the military uses of depleted uranium (DU).
DU is essentially pure uranium-238 (U-238), which is left over when all the uranium-235 (U-235) has been extracted from natural uranium ore for use in nuclear weapons or as reactor fuel. The natural abundances of these two uranium isotopes are 99.3% U-238 and just 0.7% U-235, so by now there is lots and LOTS of U-238 left over. What to do with it?
Back in the days when the "Red Menace" (a.k.a. the Soviet Union) threatened us all, we were sensitized to the "balance of terror" associated with "mutually assured destruction." That is, it was supposed that no one would start a NUCLEAR war knowing all of ICBM-mounted nukes made of U-235 or plutonium-239 pointed at them. But less well remembered is the conventional war scenario where vastly superior numbers of Soviet tanks dash across the flat lands of Germany heading for the English Channel. How to stop them without nukes?
One approach was the qualitatively superior, but badly outnumbered, M1A1 Abrams tank. Perhaps the best of the M1A1's many superior qualities is its ability to kill an opposing tank at a range exceeding the enemy's ability to return the fire. As a rule, this is a job for "kinetic-energy" (KE) munitions. Kinetic energy is defined in physics as the mass of an object multiplied by the square of its velocity. So a small-mass "dart" fired at very high velocities can carry much more kinetic energy than a larger-diameter shell fired at lower velocity. With its slimmer profile, the KE projectile would also have the greater range, but in order to kill the tank it hits it should still have as much mass as possible packed into its slim cross section. That's where DU comes in. Uranium is twice as dense as copper and nearly two and a half times as dense as iron – AND we have lots of it.
But the Abrams tank wasn't the only weapons system using DU developed to defeat the Red Menace in the European theatre. The A-10 ground-attack aircraft was literally designed around the GAU-8 seven-barrel, 30-mm Gatling gun. Four out of every five rounds it fires comprise a DU-titanium alloy "dart" embedded in light-weight aluminum shell.
The A-10 is the ugly looking plane (nicknamed the "Warthog" by its pilots) that we see constantly flying in and out of Davis-Monthan on training missions. Thus, Tucsonans have a largely unimagined – and certainly unintentional – link to the DU problem. During the first Gulf War, the Air Force expended a total of 259 tons of DU, most of it shot by A-10's.
When these DU munitions strike an armored vehicle, the huge kinetic energy is instantly converted to heat, melting both the armor ahead of the dart and the DU itself. A military advantage of DU is that it is pyrophoric, that is, it burns spontaneously when exposed to air. Thus, if the molten DU fully penetrates the armor, the vehicle's occupants are instantly incinerated. But the ash of burned uranium is a fine powder that is both toxic and easily airborne. It is also radioactive.
Most Americans have an almost irrational fear of nuclear radiations, but few seem to understand the phenomena. We are constantly being irradiated every day, usually inconsequentially. Cosmic rays are mostly absorbed in the atmosphere, so they are not too serious at sea level but become significant when we fly. Today, our doctors and dentists minimize our exposures to x rays by using more sensitive film plates and weaker x-ray doses. Even the occasional chest x-ray is a small deal. So, let's leap ahead to the REAL dangerous stuff…
The SECOND-most hazardous nuclear radiation, so far as our health is concerned, has long been radon-222 (Rn-222) (http://www.atral.com/U2381.html), which is a decay product of the tiny amounts of U-238 naturally present in all rocks and soil. Since radon is a gas, we are in danger from breathing it if there is an above average amount of U-238 in the ground under our houses AND the radon leaks in to our basements.
But the NUMBER-ONE radioactive threat to human beings (before DU made the scene) was polonium-210 (Po-210). Its story also goes back again to U-238. U-238 has a radioactive half life of 4.5 billion years (about the age of the solar system). This snail's pace release of radiation is not particularly threatening – at least if we keep the material more than an inch away from ourselves (since alpha particles have a limited range in air). But some of that Rn-222 due to U-238 decaying underground gets into the mineral apatite, where it decays into Po-210 – an isotope which has a half life of just 148 days! This means that Po-210 is 12 billion times more radioactive than the same number of atoms of U-238. You wouldn't want to have Po-210 in your lungs! But the problem is that this is exactly what happens to smokers. That apatite mineral is mined for fertilizer that is used to grow tobacco plants, which happily suck up whatever Po-210 there is in the soil (http://www.webspawner.com/users/radioactivethreat/). So smokers beware!
It is the Po-210, not the tars or nicotine, that causes lung cancer. For U-238 to cause lung cancer with the same probability, there would have to be about 12 billion times more of it in the lungs than the Po-210 ingested by smokers. Until very recently, this "12 billion" number convinced me that DU, even as KE munitions, is relatively harmless. But no more. I've now seen some pretty convincing evidence that DU is almost certainly responsible for the majority of the cases of "Gulf War Syndrome."
But there is one terrible difference between smokers and Gulf War I and II veterans. When a smoker gives up smoking, one half of the Po-210 already in his/her lungs is gone in 148 days, by 296 days ¾ of it will be gone, and within two years 97% of it will be gone. But with U-238 having a half life equal to the age of the solar system, 100% of it will stay with our veterans who have ingested it FOR THE REST OF THEIR LIVES. The use of DU munitions – and the deplorable cover-up of the health problems it is costing our veterans and their children – MUST BE ENDED NOW! And all veterans suffering from the Gulf War Syndrome should be given, FREE, every aid known in medicine. Their country owes them this much.
COMMENT #9 [Permalink]
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Chris Floyd
said on 9/8/2005 @ 5:47 am PT...
Many thanks for all these comments, particularly David Griscom with some scientific background. With DU, as with so many issues, the Bush Faction and its sycophants have managed to muddy the waters --- "Is it safe? Unsafe? Who knows? It's just like that global warming stuff" --- and prevent the truth from coming out.
COMMENT #10 [Permalink]
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Nana
said on 9/8/2005 @ 10:23 am PT...
Yes, a sincere Thank You to David Griscom for your valuable time and expertise, on this controversial and complex subject.
Great website Chris Floyd, I wasn't aware of Al Gore's rescue efforts. What a contrast to the fake president, can't help wonder, what if...
COMMENT #11 [Permalink]
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ben
said on 9/9/2005 @ 6:30 pm PT...
Thanks, David. Great write up. I, too, have developed an interest in DU, however, your knowledge dwarfs mine. This will be the most lasting, and most serious legacy of our "pre-emptive war." Most of the public hasn't yet heard of it.
COMMENT #12 [Permalink]
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David Joyce
said on 9/24/2005 @ 10:22 am PT...
During the gulf war of 1991 the allies tossed just under 770 pounds of potentially bomb making U235, including in big chunks, over the battlefields of Iraq. And this could be much more dangerous than indicated by the simple implication that somebody might enriched it, and makes a bomb.
From the AP, "Pentagon: Depleted Uranium No Health Risk", March 14, 2003, we learn that 320 tons of depleted Uranium (DU) was used in the gulf war in the form of large caliber rounds.
But wait-- that was depleted Uranium, with no bomb-worthy U235 in it, right?
Actually, it simply doesn't have quite as much of the bad stuff in it. The isotope concentration folks might do a good job of ultimately getting relatively pure U235, but that doesn't mean that there isn't a good bit of U235 still left in the waste material. It may be true that mere enrichment may be adequate for nuclear reactors, but fairly high concentrations are needed for a bomb.
Presumably, they stop trying to get more out of the raw material as soon as overall efficiency of such a process drops to some unproductive level. Although the AP stories only reveal the DU is 40% as radioactive as is natural Uranium, we learn from: http://www.iacenter.org/depleted/duupdate.htm, that "Natural uranium contains 99.2% by weight U238 while DU contains 99.8% by weight U-238".
So the enrichment process has merely taken the percentage of U235 down from 0.7 % to 0.2 %, in order to get a small amount of concentrated U235. Now 0.2% of 320 tons is 0.64 tons, therefore nearly 1300 pounds of U235 was distributed in Iraq.
But wait again-- everyone says the munitions turn to dust on impact-- even burns, converting to Uranium Oxide-- so are we talking about a difficult "mining" operation for someone to gather some Uranium ? Or is the battlefield concentration so low that it is not as good as a mine ?
Perhaps the terrorist's gold nuggets are just lying in the streets, waiting for them to pick them up. From the same iacenter website, "During an impact approximately 40 % of the penetrator forms DU oxides which are left on the terrain, within or on impacted equipment, or within impacted structures. The remainder of the penetrator (60%) retains its initial shape. Thus we are left with a solid piece of uranium lying someplace which can be picked up by children or adults"
If you used gloves and a dust mask, you could find the chunks with metal detector and/or Geiger counter without getting into too much trouble. And a chunk of DU would be quite distinctive-- it would seem so incredibly heavy for its size that most people would recognize it as very unusual. It is three times as dense as steel. So 60% of the 320 tons of the 0.2% of the DU, or 768 pounds of U235, is available in big chunks, but at concentrations that would be rather inconvenient, depending on what kind or how much technology is applied to it.
The atomic bomb lore says 15 to 30 pounds is what were are talking about for a fission bomb. A softball sized amount for Plutonium, a bigger one if it is U235.
(Note, from the 20Feb04 AP report, one only needs 7 pounds of Pu to make a bomb, and this can be CHEMICALLY separated. Quick, get my chemistry set.)
So we supplied the Iraq regime with perhaps 25 bombs worth, if only someone can enrich to fissionable concentrations enough U235 from the not spectacularly disadvantageous starting point of having only 0.2% instead of 0.8 % initial concentration.
I know-- run the enrichment machines longer. Get more of them. We are not racing the third Reich by the way, and we actually have a lot of time.
Great Caesar's Ghost-- we dumped enough to make an H bomb! (a "container" made of fissionable material, with fusion-capable Tritium in it that when set off, condenses the Tritium enough for the really big thing to happen-- raw sunshine in a can!)
Quick-- check the Tritium supply. Of course, that is something that in the ground water occasionally near reactors and experimental facilities, (and can be made on purpose!) and is easier to separate from regular Hydrogen.
But there is another issue. This Uranium is off the books as far as accounting for Uranium goes. Recall that one reason the Nigerian yellow cake story was debunked, is that the Niger operation was too tightly controlled for the alleged misallocation to occur. If on the other hand, a rogue operation at a nuclear facility was daring enough, they could alter the material by exposing it to the reactor, and make more readily fissionable stuff. This is how Plutonium is made in a breeder reactor. (The earth hasn't had any of its original Pu for billions of years since it lasts only a couple of hundred thousands years at best, until people made some)
"Don't worry Mr. Radioactive Material Auditor, were just practicing enrichment using dummy material…check the books for yourself…". If I were a demented leader of a ruthless communist country in Asia that begins with a K, I would pay top dollar for the chunks.
From the AP, "Libya Converted Small Amount of Plutonium" February 20, 2004":
"Libya used technology and know-how acquired
on the black market to process uranium into a small amount of plutonium, the U.N. nuclear watchdog said Friday. Diplomats citing a report from the International Atomic Energy Agency said the country was able to "separate a small amount of plutonium."
The report did not specify the amount, but it appeared to be less than the approximate 7 pounds required to make a nuclear bomb...."
We could also play really fun substitution games in our mining operation as far as just what kind of Uranium we have, only detectable if they suspected or were extremely vigilant. Basic radioactivity of DU is at 40% of natural, after all. Without careful checking, who's to know? Uranium has a lot of "self-shielding", and absorbs most of its own activity, so it heavily depends on the shape, etc.
But never mind that-- any Uranium would make a good radiological bomb, and a very convincing threat. How would an nuclear bomb squad, even using instruments applied to an actual terrorist bomb, know for sure that it was nowhere near the right concentration? Elaborate instruments could probably tell if a lot of U235 was present or not, due to signatures of its decay, and daughter products. However, the DU would make a very good bluff.
Now a terrorist bomb, even a crappy one, and depending on just how crappy, degenerates into a radiological bomb when it only partially achieves a "good" fission yield. I'll bet that terrorists couldn't possibly make a really good bomb. They would never get their paper published. What a disappointment. Of course, we'll have to close down metropolitan Milwaukee for 27 years.
I feel this DU has been handled like asbestos: there is a lot of it. Lets sell it. Lets start using everywhere we can. Who cares if it doesn't really help. (Why the hell is it in floor tile, for Pete's sake?) We don't know what to do with it, and it is a major hassle storing it, etc. Let's use it for balancing weights in airplanes (what happens in crashes?)
COMMENT #13 [Permalink]
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Karel
said on 3/17/2006 @ 4:37 am PT...
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Its very interessting for me
Regards
COMMENT #14 [Permalink]
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John
said on 3/23/2006 @ 7:52 am PT...
Hi, thanks for your site
Its very interessting for me
Regards
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