READER COMMENTS ON
"Robert Parry Catches Bush Lying ..."
(52 Responses so far...)
COMMENT #1 [Permalink]
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unirealist
said on 11/16/2005 @ 8:40 pm PT...
The new issue of Newsweek has a cover story on TORTURE. Inside is an excellent editorial by John McCain, on the subject he is so very familiar with. I recommend it.
COMMENT #2 [Permalink]
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Doug Eldritch
said on 11/16/2005 @ 9:02 pm PT...
Game set, match Bush.
You are lying through your teeth for the final time.
Tell everyone the truth, including the investigators and perhaps....perhaps one day the consequences won't be so severe.
You are deliberately lying again and this is dealing with treason.........no one shall tolerate it.
Doug E.
COMMENT #3 [Permalink]
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jpentz
said on 11/16/2005 @ 9:15 pm PT...
NO HE DID NOT LIE!!!!!!
NAH UH . . .SAY IT AIN'T SO!
COMMENT #4 [Permalink]
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Kira
said on 11/16/2005 @ 11:08 pm PT...
Great blog, WP.
I remember exactly, clearly, when the inspectors were yanked out of Iraq by the Lyin' King. Of course I was watching closely because I already knew about the stolen election of 2000 and I was aware of the coverups and lies about 9/11.
Those of us who weren't sucked in by the yowling Ministry of Disinformation were (and still are) beyond furious.
Dunno if there's much hope for this country even if the criminals are prosecuted. The DC players seem to think they're above the law. The only way to save the country financially would be to make them pay back the money they've stolen. It'll probably be a cold day in Hell.
COMMENT #5 [Permalink]
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Terri Schiavo
said on 11/17/2005 @ 2:15 am PT...
{someone claiming to be the late Terri Schiavo wrote an obscene and repetitive rant and posted it in this spot, but it has been removed by WP}
COMMENT #6 [Permalink]
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onyx
said on 11/17/2005 @ 5:23 am PT...
BTW, Fitzgerald actually said that Libby was the first KNOWN leaker and I don;t think he said "known" accidentally.
The only MSM to point this out was - guess who? - Keith Olbermann
COMMENT #7 [Permalink]
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Robert Lockwood Mills
said on 11/17/2005 @ 5:44 am PT...
Not to disparage Robert Parry, but catching Bush in a lie is a bit like finding pebbles on a beach.
COMMENT #8 [Permalink]
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Lemmethink_not
said on 11/17/2005 @ 6:22 am PT...
RLM....you mean like finding pebbles,shells,or sand?
To watch this poor excuse of a man(Bush) talk simply nausiates me, I'm not one bit proud, to say the least.......throw him out !!!!!!!!!
COMMENT #9 [Permalink]
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bibi
said on 11/17/2005 @ 7:32 am PT...
DOWNING STREET DOCUMENTS.
COMMENT #10 [Permalink]
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MarkH
said on 11/17/2005 @ 8:17 am PT...
It's a bit early for "game set and match". We need to inform the public and get their votes on record to throw da bums out.
Then, at least, there won't be more Bushit and we can begin to uncover and document all of what happened in order to deliver justice to those who so roundly deserve it.
Naturally, all the Bushistas have faith in the ability of Congress to quickly put behind them everything from prior administrations ("It's time to move on and begin the healing."). They also have faith that Congress will seek to protect themselves by downplaying it all, including their involvements.
The battle for us hasn't even ended the first phase (getting rid of Bush & Co.). We have a long long way to go.
COMMENT #11 [Permalink]
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Winter Patriot
said on 11/17/2005 @ 8:29 am PT...
good point, RLM # 10 ... you figure I could have gone a little stronger on the headline?
COMMENT #12 [Permalink]
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Dredd
said on 11/17/2005 @ 8:32 am PT...
MarkH #13
Good point. Parry pointed out something interesting that supports your concern:
"Bush appears to be counting on the powerful right-wing media and his allies in the mainstream press to browbeat anyone who doesn’t kneel before Bush’s version of reality, a strategy that worked wonders in 2002-2003" (link here).
We need to keep the pressure on and compliment MSM folk like Chris Matthews who has done an about face and come down hard on the admin.
Same with K. Olberman ... gotta keep hammering the puppet factions in the MSM who wouldn't know journalism if it was on their desk.
COMMENT #13 [Permalink]
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Snoop
said on 11/17/2005 @ 8:37 am PT...
Throw the bums out, I’m tired of republicans lying, I just wish that one republican out there can tell the truth just one time. When the democrats are back in power sanity will be restored to the whitehouse.
COMMENT #14 [Permalink]
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Pat
said on 11/17/2005 @ 8:42 am PT...
Let's talk about independent commissions and the assertion that they have already examined this issue. Not to use Whitewater as an example, but didn't we have "independent examinations" of this real estate deal with the Resolution Trust, the Pillsbury commission, Al Damato's Senate committee (which introduced us to Skellator Chertoff), Dan Burton's committee in the House to be topped off by Ken Starr. Was that an attempt to rewrite history???
COMMENT #15 [Permalink]
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Jose Chung
said on 11/17/2005 @ 9:11 am PT...
Kaboom! Game, set and match!
1) Yes, the president does see more information than the senators. It's called the daily briefing. By law, the daily briefing is classified and is for the eyes of the president and the national security advisor. And what were those briefings telling the president? That the situation in Iraq was even more potentially dangerous than indicated by the intel the senators were receiving. How do we know that? By statements of White House officials.
2) Is George Bush and the CIA the only source of information in the world? Is that what I am to infer from statements by Democrats?
3) If the cream of the Democratic party was hoodwinked by this dumb Texas cowboy, wouldn't that make THEM appear dumber still. I mean, how stupid do you have to be to be bamboozled by a dumb Texas cowboy?
4) If the cream of the Democratic party played the role of rubes for this White House, then they are obviously too stupid to be president of the United States, correct? That would include Hillary Clinton, Evan Bayh, Joe Biden, John Kerry and John Edwards.
5) Now these courageous and upstanding Democratic senators such as Diane Feinstein and others are using the If-I-had-only-known-then-what-I-know-now defense--which the vacuous Nancy Pelosi called a good argument last night on Neil Cavuto.
6) Newsweek? Can anybody explain to me how you flush an 800-page book down the toilet?
7) Lying? In the Clinton White House there was a CULTURE of lying--but all the lies by all the king's men were designed to obscure the crimes of one person: Bill Clinton. Nobody was lying to save the world or protect America or kill our enemies or spread Democracy. Nobody was lying for noble reasons or for the greater good or to win the war on terror or to protect our grandchildren. They were all lying to save Bill Clinton's butt.
8) The cream of the Democratic party is now saying they are victims--or victocrats. They are certainly not statesmen; these lightweights are playing politics.
9) The inspectors were taken out three days before the war started.
10) You like my name? My name Jose.
COMMENT #16 [Permalink]
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Ram
said on 11/17/2005 @ 9:59 am PT...
Winter:
Re:" If it feels like 1984, that's because it is. We're 21 years late but we're there all the same. "
Keep in mind that these absurdists began their campaign right on schedule. It was the 80's and the criminal element from the Reagan era and the Gingrich contract-on-America group that set this lies-are-truth system into place. Orwell was right on in his prediction.
For the entire Bushevik regime, the mouthpieces have been saying "We can't analyze this today. History will judge us." and "That's for future historians to analyze."
Well, History is judging them. Historians are analyzing. History isn't just 20 years ago or the study of an ancient civilization; it's what happened yesterday.
The Busheviks are angry that someone is looking into their records before they have had a chance to re-write them all. They believed that they would be judged favorably because that is all that would be left on paper --- after they had destroyed all of the evidence. That's why they are so angry that these investigations are happening NOW.
Dems aren't re-writing history. We are trying to preserve the accuracy of the events by getting the records out of obscurity.
The efforts of bloggers such as you and Brad are a vital part of this effort to uncover truth!
COMMENT #17 [Permalink]
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Savantster
said on 11/17/2005 @ 10:05 am PT...
Hey Jose...
Not gonna bother with a point by point, as you have no "valid point" in your post.. sorry.. Same old tired "BUT BUT, YOU DEMS SUCK!!!".. that doesn't cut it here, we're not all Dems or Liberals, so your retarded bitch-fight of "you suck you suck you suck" to try and procure a "valid position" is .. well.. retarded and pointless.. and fruitless, sorry.
There's no point in even picking apart the totally ignorant comparisons you are making in 1/2 of your list there. You are -intentionally- trying to make stupid assertions look "credible", and if I stoop to your level and try to show how pathetic they are, I would admit your laughable attempt at distraction and disinformation and false logic were somehow.. compelling.. Yet, I find your trolling amaturish (yet refreshingly not overly abusive.. just ignorant and mildly abusive).
*waves to the troll*
COMMENT #18 [Permalink]
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Winter Patriot
said on 11/17/2005 @ 10:25 am PT...
re #19 Ram: I see what you're saying and I agree with you, at least in part. It has been going on for a long time. But I still think it feels like 1984 right now.
It feels like 1984.
It has always felt like 1984.
It will always feel like 1984.
We are at war.
We have always been at war.
We will always be at war.
and so on.
COMMENT #19 [Permalink]
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Winter Patriot
said on 11/17/2005 @ 10:29 am PT...
Jose wrote:
9) The inspectors were taken out three days before the war started.
which clearly contradicts Bush's assertion that Saddam Hussein never let the inspectors into his country at all.
I warned you, Jose. This is a dangerous thread.
COMMENT #20 [Permalink]
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tomz
said on 11/17/2005 @ 12:19 pm PT...
Forget what Bush says. Keep telling everyone else what the truth is. Copy and paste the statements for later comparison. As long as WE keep driving home the truth (even to our representatives), their lies cannot solidify. This venue of blogging is turned the journalism world on its ear and it will only get better - that is unitl the government decides to control it...for national security purposes you undersand!
Write truth, copy and paste truth, scream truth and teach your kids the truth. Only We can make a difference in this country. Surely you don't expect THEM to do it, do you?
COMMENT #21 [Permalink]
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Doug Eldritch
said on 11/17/2005 @ 12:42 pm PT...
They can try screaming for control of the internet while the United Nations takes over soon.....they will own all the servers, and the USA won't have even a cut of it.
:D
Doug E.
COMMENT #22 [Permalink]
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Dredd
said on 11/17/2005 @ 12:57 pm PT...
Speaking of truth and coverup. Has anyone noticed that the Woodward connection is getting a lot of press?
Woodward indicates he heard about Plame from an administrative official (evidently Hadley) before Novak heard about it from Libby.
The MSM is making this out to be huge because it is said to show Fitzgerald was mistaken. Fitz is said to have indicated that Libby was the first to release the Plame info to reporters.
I can't find in the indictment (Fitzgerald website) where it is alleged that Libby was the first to tell Plame's name to reporters or that it even matters who was first.
Anyone notice that?
The MSM seems to want to free itself from a lot of guilt and they want the Iraq story to be like they said it was. So they want the admin story to be true and they therefore side with Libby.
But that dog won't hunt as long as reporters like Parry and prosecutors like Fitzgerald are at work.
Hopefully we can help keep the stories straight.
COMMENT #23 [Permalink]
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Kira
said on 11/17/2005 @ 1:30 pm PT...
Hose-a #18:
6) how [can] you flush an 800-page book down the toilet?
Hoser, your rabid rightwinger pals made up the part about the book being flushed. Nowhere was it reported by serious media sources, using accurate quotes, that the book was flushed. The actual quotes are always that the book(s) was (were) "thrown into the toilet."
Go back and read the reports yourself --- but you have to forget LGF, rush & hannity, & FOX news.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Here's the deal, Hoser --- if you're bright enough, you can connect the dots.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The CIA, with Bush41 at its head, hired & trained OBL and his Mujahedeen to covertly fight Soviets.
When bush41 was sitting president, high level gov't. officials ordered visas issued to unqualified applicants (from Saudi Arabia.) These recruits, rounded up by OBL, after CIA terrorist training were returned to Afghanistan to fight the Soviets.
Complaints were made to the GAO, State Dept., Bureau of Diplomatic Security and IGO - but there was no statement made by any of the above.
See Osama bin Laden:
[snip] With the active encouragement of the CIA and Pakistan's ISI [Inter Services Intelligence], who wanted to turn the Afghan jihad into a global war waged by all Muslim states against the Soviet Union, some 35,000 Muslim radicals from 40 Islamic countries joined Afghanistan's fight between 1982 and 1992. Tens of thousands more came to study in Pakistani madrasahs. Eventually more than 100,000 foreign Muslim radicals were directly influenced by the Afghan jihad.
The Islamic "jihad" was supported by the United States and Saudi Arabia with a significant part of the funding generated from the Golden Crescent drug trade:
In March 1985, President Reagan signed National Security Decision Directive 166,...[which] authorize[d] stepped-up covert military aid to the mujahideen, and it made clear that the secret Afghan war had a new goal: to defeat Soviet troops in Afghanistan through covert action and encourage a Soviet withdrawal.
The new covert U.S. assistance began with a dramatic increase in arms supplies --- a steady rise to 65,000 tons annually by 1987, ... as well as a "ceaseless stream" of CIA and Pentagon specialists who traveled to the secret headquarters of Pakistan's ISI on the main road near Rawalpindi, Pakistan. There the CIA specialists met with Pakistani intelligence officers to help plan operations for the Afghan rebels.
The Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) using Pakistan's military Inter-Services Intelligence (ISI) played a key role in training the Mujahideen. In turn, the CIA sponsored guerrilla training was integrated with the teachings of Islam:
[Did you get that? In other words --- Islam was corrupted by making it militant --- and sponsored by the CIA. Well --- the fundies over here who believe in the Crusades and Onward Christian Soldiers just helped fund and train their own current adversaries. /kira]
Predominant themes were that Islam was a complete socio-political ideology, that holy Islam was being violated by the atheistic Soviet troops, and that the Islamic people of Afghanistan should reassert their independence by overthrowing the leftist Afghan regime propped up by Moscow.
**Much more at the link above**
And, just as a last little tidbit:
Bush43’s first $million made with an oil company can be traced directly to Salem bin Laden. Bush43 was also a director of a subsidiary of Carlyle Corp. (a huge defense contractor) --- bush41 is a paid advisor to Carlyle. The Saudi Arabian bin Laden family held a stake in Carlyle Corp. but sold out just after 9/11/01.
COMMENT #24 [Permalink]
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Kira
said on 11/17/2005 @ 1:44 pm PT...
Oh heck. I forgot --- How do you flush an 800-page book down the toilet?
Just ask countless poor folks from the earlier years of the 20th century who flushed Sears & Roebuck catalogues ... page by page.
COMMENT #25 [Permalink]
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Jeff
said on 11/17/2005 @ 3:02 pm PT...
Jose --- "Nobody was lying for noble reasons or for the greater good"
LOL Damn that's funny! You should hit the road with that act!
COMMENT #26 [Permalink]
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bluebear2
said on 11/17/2005 @ 3:34 pm PT...
Kira #24
LTIH (Laughing 'til it hurts)
COMMENT #27 [Permalink]
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Savantster
said on 11/17/2005 @ 3:42 pm PT...
Well, no Jeff (#25).. he's right.. the lies aren't about noble or greater good, their about personal gain and religious persecution..
COMMENT #28 [Permalink]
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bluebear2
said on 11/17/2005 @ 3:47 pm PT...
Jose Chung # 18
You lost me on your item #1. The daily briefing...
In fact it was during these daily briefings less than a month prior to 9/11 that all the info was laid out predicting the attack, but was summarily ignored.
Link Here
The remainder of your arguments are only rehash of the current round of repug talking points.
The fact is that congress was lied to regarding the iintelligence leading up to the war. Of course they supported while believing what they were being told and having no reason to assume otherwise.
COMMENT #29 [Permalink]
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bluebear2
said on 11/17/2005 @ 3:52 pm PT...
Jose #18 said
2) Is George Bush and the CIA the only source of information in the world? Is that what I am to infer from statements by Democrats?
You need to research other sources of information from the rest of the world to see just what a pile of bullshit they think our country has become under the Bushco regime!
COMMENT #30 [Permalink]
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bluebear2
said on 11/17/2005 @ 4:19 pm PT...
COMMENT #31 [Permalink]
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Jose Chung
said on 11/17/2005 @ 7:30 pm PT...
Kira,
From Newsweek:
Two weeks ago, in our issue dated May 9, Michael Isikoff and John Barry reported in a brief item in our Periscope section that U.S. military investigators had found evidence that American guards at the detention center in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, had committed infractions in trying to get terror suspects to talk, including in one case flushing a Qur'an down a toilet.
_____________________
Savantster,
Thanks for your lazy gutless post wholly lacking in content. Why even bother posting such blather, you little snot.
_________________________
Winter Patriot,
Please. It doesn't contradict anything.
_________________
bluebear2,
Hey, you mean they're not clapping for us in France?
Is that who you're talking about? Or Germany, who gave us the holocaust? Or Russia, who gave us Stalin? Who are you talking about? China? Venezuela?
The point is that many of these countries are saying, 'Down with America' with one breath, and asking 'How do I get a green card?' with the other.
"The fact is that congress was lied to regarding the intelligence leading up to the war. "
Which war are you talking about? Bosnia? Serbia? The Clinton administration was talking about 100,000 bodies in mass graves but they ended up finding what? 2,000? 8,000? More? Was Clinton lying? Or was the intel just wrong? I bet you there wasn't even a single story in the New York Times about Clinton's lousy intel.
COMMENT #32 [Permalink]
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Savantster
said on 11/17/2005 @ 8:33 pm PT...
"Winter Patriot,
Please. It doesn't contradict anything."
Exactly.. moron.. the reason NOT to bother posting to you is you are.. a moron.. The FACT that there were inspectors in Iraq when Bush decided to illegally invade is EXACTLY the point, yet it's lost on you.
When a psychopath want's to justify eating kittens, he'll justify eating kittens. Normal (read: sane and healthy people) can never fathom how the nut-job thinks. You, sir, have show by your post that you can not, will not, be reasoned with.
go away if you aren't willing to have a dialog. I could tell from your post, you weren't (well, and other inflamitory posts you've made here.. they show you have no interest in discussing FACTS or TRUTHS, just spit your spin and deception on people.. good day sir!)
COMMENT #33 [Permalink]
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Brad
said on 11/17/2005 @ 9:59 pm PT...
I don't have the time to start deleting posts here tonight. So if everyone could keep the personal insults down to a minimum (like none) it would be greatly appreciated by your host and the concierge.
Just one other comment, the National Intel Estimate, which contained quite a few "yeah, buts" was both redacted and finally only shared in parts from one to three days prior to the vote giving Bush authority to use force (if he needed, after exhausting all other available options, as he promised, but didn't mean apparently.)
The Dems who, yes, many of them were too stupid or foolish to stand up for themselves, simply did NOT have the same intel that Bush had. Anyone who says otherwise is a liar.
Whether any of those Dems should ever be voted for again, I will leave to others to decide. But it's a pity that Jose can't come up with an actual valid apology on his own and he has to steal from Savage, Goldberg and other reprehensible sorts.
COMMENT #34 [Permalink]
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Uncle Bob
said on 11/18/2005 @ 1:05 am PT...
IRT JOSE CIUNG - above:
[ Hey, you mean they're not clapping for us in France?
Is that who you're talking about? Or Germany, who gave us the holocaust? Or Russia, who gave us Stalin? Who are you talking about? China? Venezuela? The point is that many of these countries are saying, 'Down with America' with one breath, and asking 'How do I get a green card?' with the other.]
Really? Who gave us:
1. "wipe out an entire civilisation and take it's land"? (that's native-americans, you dumb shit)
2. "deport 1/3 of Africa and enslave it to build the "great" United States for Fascism"?
3. "invade every piss poor neighbouring country or change it's regime so we can build bases whenever we want"?
4. "Hiroshima and Nagasaki"?
5. "Vitenam"?
6. "everyone must privatise basic human needs like water or housing, because making profit out of people's misery is a good thing - dogma"?
7. "pitted Iraq angainst Iran and sold them both weapons so they then can step in afterwards and pick them one by one at ease"?
8. "retarded embargoes that killed 500.000 children in Iraq alone"?
8. "Yugoslavian war"?
9. "Afghanistan and Iraq"?
So shut the fuck up. Your piss poor nation had concentration camps log before Hitler. If you'd had the technology back then prolly you'd gas native-americans but since you lacked that you just send in the cavalery to burn scores of women and children alive in their villages...
COMMENT #35 [Permalink]
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Robert Lockwood Mills
said on 11/18/2005 @ 3:34 am PT...
Medieval kings lied, because 1) No higher authority could enforce truth upon them, 2) They presumed to have "divine rights," meaning God granted had them their power, 3) Their word was truth by reason of primogeniture, thus the word "lie" had no meaning.
In a democracy or a democratic republic, there is no such thing as "lying for a worthwhile cause." If that were possible, there would be no perjury laws, because anyone accused of perjury could claim a noble purpose, e.g., "I lied to make sure the jury reached the right verdict."
Truth-telling is an integral part of an orderly society. If Bush can be excused for lying for the cause of freedom in Iraq (sic), then those excusing such lies are saying, in effect, "It's O.K. to lie to promote freedom abroad, even if it compromises freedom at home."
Anyone subscribe to that thesis?
COMMENT #36 [Permalink]
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Dredd
said on 11/18/2005 @ 5:32 am PT...
RLM #35
I do not subscribe to lies.
When a government official in the United States does so, it goes against american tradition. The lore tells us that George Washington told the truth. Not when it was comfortable, but when it was painful. The pain and shame were not seen as being enough to overcome the propriety of telling the truth.
That has even been taught in the past as a hallmark of character. When one is truthful that is said to be a sign of good character, and lies a sign of bad character. The neoCons and neoConvicts puzzle me when they demand that the ten commandments be placed here and there because one of them says "You shall not lie".
That truth telling is good is a primary social or societal concept from our history. It is even more critical, in my opinion, for government officials to tell the truth. That is our heritage.
However, as evidenced by the testimony of the Oil Barons before congress recently, there is a strong neoCon and neoConvict movement in america to destroy our value of truth.
These are the people who are in power in the white house and in congress. These are the people who have subverted our government and our economy.
Liars are at the helm. As Bob Dylan says to america "You got gangsters in power and lawbreakers making rules" (When You Gonna Wake up).
The culture is changing and lies are becoming the norm from head to toe. Deceit of the american people is the aim of government now days, and full blown blue chip companies earn millions of dollars as consultants to government teaching them the best ways to deceive the american people.
The only good thing I can mention is that the american public is not buying it as the polls show. I think that the liars have the power and they are challenging us. They are saying shut up and sit down.
Are we going to take this sitting down?
COMMENT #37 [Permalink]
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Uncle Bob
said on 11/18/2005 @ 7:16 am PT...
Yeah.. these pesky NEOcons are destroying the value of truth...
Too bad the army was telling the people of USF the "truth" about Hiroshima, how those sadistic japaneese would maime their own kind to make it look like nukes have side effects when, in fact they were absolutely harmless...
Or that native-americans are a savage, pagan race that wants to wipe out all the good colonists.
Or how the communists will take over the world and force a horrible economic model upon all living things...
or [insert here some fairytale propagnada made bu USF to justify slaughtering or enslaving a non-white population in countless conflicts]
Quite a legacy for truth, eh?
COMMENT #38 [Permalink]
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Uncle Bob
said on 11/18/2005 @ 7:30 am PT...
[That truth telling is good is a primary social or societal concept from our history. It is even more critical, in my opinion, for government officials to tell the truth. That is our heritage.]
Exactly, that's why USF's history is made in hollywood. With your history it is so very understandable to make up in studios what you are definetly not.
The primary social truth telling, like you need to own big cars and big muscles and get laid with gorgeous, thin women. Or the 3275679543796097543 idiothic consumeristic stereotypes that make out your "social truth" that is burned in the back of every child with idiothic movies and commercials.
Your heritage are things like native-americans living in camps, black people left to rot in NO, the fact that, after all these years you are still fucking racists, your capitalist dogma that destroyed entire nations subjugated in WTO/IMF "privatise basic human needs" craps, the worst terrorist attacks in the history of the WORLD performed at Hiroshima and Nagasaki and the proven fact of your countless wars agaist virtually every non-white humans on the planet.
You've NEVER been good or moral or crap. You had your "golden period" around 1900 - 1960, but that's that.
Your heritage is a racist crusade against those who don't look like you.
COMMENT #39 [Permalink]
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Jose Chung
said on 11/18/2005 @ 9:46 am PT...
Uncle Bob,
1) Most American Indians died from disease.
2) We fought a war to end slavery. Perhaps you didn't hear about it. It was called the Civil War. Besides, you may not like to hear this, but the descendents of those slaves are a thousand times better off living in America today than they would be living in Africa.
3) Yes, America stopped the spread of Nazism, Communism, Fascism, and now is stopping the spread of radical Islam and Terrorism. Sounds like a noble mission to me. Care to join?
4) Dropping the bomb on those two Japanese cities ended the war and saved one million lives. Now Japan
is a democracy with one of the world's strongest economies. By the way, were you aware that Japan attacked us first, or do they still teach that?
5) Vietnam? Why would you include Vietnam? That is the liberal's favorite war: because America lost.
6) You obviously love high taxes; and living off your brother man. It's working real well in France, I see.
7)"Pitted Iraq angainst Iran?" So America is responsible for the Iran-Iraq war where one million people died?
8) America as baby killers! Yes, it's America's fault that kids starved to death in Iraq? Explain that to me since Iraq was a rich country building hundreds of palaces? I see you love supporting the terrorist's arguments?
9) Setting 50 million people free. How horrible!
10) Hitler took the idea of concentration camps from Stalin. America has never had concentration camps and never will.
COMMENT #40 [Permalink]
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Jose Chung
said on 11/18/2005 @ 10:09 am PT...
Brad,
Yes, but not everybody voted for the war because of the threat of WMD.
You didn't need so-called pre-war intelligence to know that Saddam broke a bunch of UN resolutions. There comes a time when the rule of law needs to be backed up by force.
You didn't need classified intel to know that Saddam killed hundreds of thousands of his own people, did you?
You didn't need to know the contents of the president's daily briefings to know Saddam attacked Iran and Kuwait.
You didn't need CIA intel to know that Saddam paid $25,000 to the families of suicide bombers.
And so on, and so forth....
COMMENT #41 [Permalink]
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Ram
said on 11/18/2005 @ 11:43 am PT...
Winter: C&L has a cool picture referring to 1984:
Cheney
COMMENT #42 [Permalink]
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Robert Lockwood Mills
said on 11/19/2005 @ 3:32 am PT...
No one should talk about the "rule of law" in connection with the invasion of Iraq.
By the "rule of law," Mr. Chung must be referring to international law and U.N. sanctions. To the extent Saddam Hussein violated Iraqi law, that's a matter for Iraqis to prosecute domestically. No country may invade another because the leaders of the country being invaded broke their own laws.
So, Saddam killed his own people. True. If that justified an invasion by the United States, then we should long since have invaded the Philippines under Marcos, Indonesia under Sukarno, North Korea, Pakistan, and half the countries in Africa.
Saddam attacked Iran and Kuwait? Yep...and we supported him against Iran (and sold him weapons of destruction). We already fought him over Kuwait. So please explain what they have to do with our actions in 2003.
Suicide bombers? The allegation that their families received $25,000 from Saddam Hussein (personally?) sounds like one of those long since discredited Chalabi lies that sucked in Judy Miller and Cheney. Anyone have a cancelled check to prove this? Even if true, the money could have been some kind of government benefit (like life insurance or Social Security). Unless it could be shown that Saddam Hussein hired the suicide bombers in the first place, with the specific goal of killing Americans, an invasion of Iraq is not warranted.
As far as international law is concerned, our own invasion and occupation of a sovereign country that wasn't threatening us, and wasn't at war with any country to which we were bound by treaty, is a clear violation.
COMMENT #43 [Permalink]
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molly
said on 11/19/2005 @ 9:50 am PT...
Jose Chung, I was thinking great post until I read on...You guys are brilliant . I was educated. This is the best website for information from bloggers and civil discourse. Brad for being Brad.Can't say how much I appreciate you. Jose, just keep an open mind, learning is fun.
COMMENT #44 [Permalink]
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Jose Chung
said on 11/19/2005 @ 7:27 pm PT...
Robert Lockwood Mills,
Hitler is rounding up Jews and putting them in ovens? That would be an internal problem of Germany, which is a sovereign and democratic nation. We would have no legal justification to interfere. And how do we even know Jews are being burnt? Do they publish a bill of lading?
You demonstrate the difference, Mr. Mills, between left and right: The left thinks legally; the right thinks morally.
COMMENT #45 [Permalink]
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Mojo
said on 11/20/2005 @ 10:34 am PT...
Sounds to me like most of you folks are suffering from a diease commonly know as CNN syndrome!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maybe you need to get this checked out. You can use my doctor. ( Dr. Phil).
COMMENT #46 [Permalink]
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Lee Org
said on 12/2/2005 @ 2:05 pm PT...
Bush is lying again. This time about economics(contradicting Greenspan).
COMMENT #47 [Permalink]
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mojo
said on 12/7/2005 @ 2:00 pm PT...
lee org said bush is lying again!!!!!!!!! i am a democrat but not for long when people can not support our president just for political reasons i want nothing to with them. the economy is fine for me and would be for a lot of people if they would get off thier dead ass and go to work!!!!!!!!!!!
COMMENT #48 [Permalink]
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mojo
said on 12/7/2005 @ 2:02 pm PT...
lee org said bush is lying again!!!!!!!!! i am a democrat but not for long when people can not support our president just for political reasons i want nothing to with them. the economy is fine for me and would be for a lot of people if they would get off thier dead ass and go to work!!!!!!!!!!!
COMMENT #49 [Permalink]
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Waltr McGee
said on 12/26/2005 @ 3:59 pm PT...
It's not hard to catch Bush lying!
If his mouth is moving he lying.
COMMENT #50 [Permalink]
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Waltr McGee
said on 12/26/2005 @ 4:00 pm PT...
It's not hard to catch Bush lying!
If his mouth is moving he lying.
COMMENT #51 [Permalink]
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Walter McGee
said on 12/26/2005 @ 4:04 pm PT...
It's not hard to catch Bush lying!
If his mouth is moving he lying.
COMMENT #52 [Permalink]
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Walter McGee
said on 12/26/2005 @ 4:12 pm PT...
It's not hard to catch Bush lying!
If his mouth is moving he lying.