Well, it’s a long time between tonight and the end of Rush’s show tomorrow. So don’t count any chickens. It’s even longer between the end of Rush’s show and November 2nd.
But before they figure out how to turn Bush’s crushing loss tonight into a victory, here’s a few words from the Wingnuts (who’ve been conspicuously quiet on the BRAD BLOG here tonight).
On PowerLineBlog (one of the blogs instrumental in “breaking” the CBS Document Scandal of the Millenium), their “Live Debate Blogger” was Hindrocket, who said:
Kerry continue to attack the Iraq war effectively. Was the Bush campaign mistaken in thinking that they wanted the first debate to be on foreign policy?
…And though Hindrocket’s bizarre scoring system ended in a victory for Bush somehow of “107 – 103”, even he had to admit the obvious:
In Powerline’s late-night item, posted an hour or so after the debate, another of their bloggers, deacon, opened his piece with this:
Meanwhile, on Rightwing Cable…even they were having a tough time spinning for Bush:
Mort Kondracke on Fox: “This is the President’s turf, this is the place that the President is supposed to dominate, terror and the war in Iraq. I don’t think he really dominated tonight. I think Kerry looked like a commander-in-chief.”
Kate O’Beirne, National Review Online’s the Corner: “I thought the President was repetitive and reactive.”
But as Hannity likes to say, “let not your heart be troubled”, you can count on one Rightwinger to never let an intellectually honest word cross his lips:
(Mmm….the cherry Kool-aid is extra good!)
Thanks to all who participated in tonight’s Open Threads! We’ll do ’em again for the next 3 debates! Next date, 5 days from tonight! The Veep Debate in Ohio on Tuesday, Oct 5th! Hope you’ll join us! And you Rightwingers better show up too! In the meantime, hopefully they’ll ring in on Comments to let us know how Bush didn’t really lose, or how it doesn’t really matter…or something. Stay tuned. Wingnuttery on it’s way!
WHAT A GREAT DEBATE!!!!!!
Holy crap I’m impressed!! I hope you’re all around today cause I have a dying itch to talk about it.
My observations:
1) Kerry is a fantastic public speaker and I take back everything I said about him being dull.
2) At first I thought Kerry was talking a little too specifically and thought Bush was winning the debate because he was talking "dumb" (if you get my drift)..But that changed quickly.
3) I also was under the impression that Kerry was going to be the one with the negative facial expressions and the sighs, the eye rolling and what not, but guess what? Not so!
4) Kerry did a FANTASTIC job of putting pressure on Bush. And the outcome was stuttering, more stuttering, repetition and more repetition.
5) How many times did this happen?
Bush: Kerry is inconsistent.
Kerry: No I’m not. I have always had one position on Iraq.
Bush: Oh yeah. Right. Um,…uh….duh…..But you’re inconsistent!!!
Kerry: No…Actually, I’m not. Here was my position two years ago and this is my position NOW.
Bush: Oh, ok. Well..um…uh……..you know what?! Aha!!! I got it !!! You’re *inconsistent*!!!!
*LOL* My fiancee and I laughed out loud so many times!!
6) I have a question. Remember when Bush complimented Kerry personally and then Kerry did the same? Kerry mentioned something about the Bush Twins and Bush laughed and said something. Now, neither of us heard it correctly, but I could have SWORN he said, "I need to put a leash on them." I might be TOTALLY wrong, but did you guys catch what he said?
I have so much more to say!! :)))
Brad,
i am not sure what Hannity was drinking last night BUT it had more proof than cherry kool aid. last night Hannity was in rare form even for the right wing kook he is. for some reasons i see him burnt out in big 70s style sun glasses, sitting in a large wooden chair, bellowing into a microphone: "Come to the pavillion people,come to the pavillion." My review of Hannity: more Jim Jones than Powers Boothe.
Although i do agrre with him. Fredo was in rare form last night. i don’t think, however, that is necessarily a compliment to Fredo.
The debate was good. I liked the lights which showed both guys followed the rules. The audience behaved themselves, which was nice for once.
Both of them did good but I do not think it will change things that much in the polls of people who are likely voters. The online polls that Brad shows in a previous blog all come from liberal sources – CNN, MSNBC, etc. You cannot count on internet polls because each site is either liberal or conservative, and their audience vote accordingly.
Winning a debate doesn’t mean that same person wins an election.
The key in the debate was that one cannot say they will build a coalition and at the same time, criticize our allies and the PM of Iraq.
Bush did miss some opportunities but I did like the "global test" line.
I cannot believe that Kerry brought up that stupid Global Warming Kyoto treaty again, which was shot down by all senators under Clinton. The liberals love to bring that up. Even Russia was against it.
Signing that treaty is not going to make France like us or send troops to Iraq.
There are more debates and more commercials including some more good ones from the swifties.
Kerry still has a chance to change his mind again on his core? "beliefs," if he is still losing as election day nears.
Paul said: "I cannot believe that Kerry brought up that stupid Global Warming Kyoto treaty again"
Enough said.
Johanna – the US Senate voted 100-0 against the Kyoto treaty while Clinton was in office. What more do you want? Can’t the US determine our own policies and laws? Of course we can!!!!!!!
One important thing I forgot about the debates-
Bush said the military will stay voluntary, which means no draft for you liberal. See previous blog on the (fake) draft.
"Bush said the military will stay voluntary, which means no draft for you liberal. See previous blog on the (fake) draft."
But Bush also said "…my opponent said where he worked to put sanctions on Iran — we’ve already sanctioned Iran. We can’t sanction them any more. There are sanctions in place on Iran."
Is it me, or is the "righting" on the wall with respect to Iran?
Paul, the US can do whatever they want. The thing is , you come across as an ignorant prick when you use the words "Global Warming" and "Stupid" in the same sentence.
The Kyoto Protocol was designed to fight a VERY serious problem. If you think that’s stupid, then you’re stupid.
Paul,
Step AWAY from the keyboard. You have several issue wrong is your post.
1. The Hyoto Accord was NEVER submitted to the Senate for ratification.
2. The vote you are referring to (Sen res 98) was not for ratification of the Amendment. It was taken on 25 June 1997 BEFORE the protocol was negotiated. the accord was formalized between 1-12 December 1997. This was six months after the Senate vote. How could the Senate have voted against Hyoto 1. if it was never submitted and 2. before the document itself had been formalized?
3. It was a "sense of the senate" vote and declared that the US should not be a signatory to a treaty that did not have timetables and binding agreements for developing nations.
Come to the pavillion Paul; come to the Pavillion.
> Is it me, or is the "righting" on the wall with respect to Iran?
Ah, yeah. "If" Iran is building nukes for Israel and if we do not destroy them, Israel will!
> The Hyoto Accord was NEVER submitted to the Senate for ratification.
ahh..because it will still go down in defeat.
> It was a "sense of the senate" vote and declared that the US should not be a signatory to a treaty that did not have timetables and binding agreements for developing nations.
100 to 0
J – Global Warming is a crock of crap! When it gets cold, blamed on Global Warming. When it gets hot, blamed on Global Warming. THE SKY IS FALLING, THE SKY IS FALLING!
Hole in ozone layer shrinks
http://news.scotsman.com/scitec...?id=1147332004
A GAPING hole in the ozone layer over Antarctica appears to have shrunk by about 20 per cent from last year’s record-breaking size, scientists said today.
Experts in New Zealand said their measurements backed up satellite data showing the hole peaked at about nine million square miles compared with 11 million square miles in 2003.
Scientist Stephen Wood said: "We need to see smaller ozone holes over a number of years before we can say for certain that ozone is recovering."
Holy sweet mother of God! The ozone has shrunk by 20% ! QUICK QUICK! Alert the authorities! Our prayers have been answered! Everyone can polute the air again! Go on, do it ! It doesn’t matter anymore, the GAPING hole is not GAPING ANYMORE!!!! It’s only a GIGANTIC HOLE NOW!!!
SCREW THE ENVIRONMENT! SCREW OUR CHILDREN! SCREW EVERYONE!!!
> Our prayers have been answered
Who are you praying too?
One blast from one volcano does more damage to the ozone than all cars combined.
I have a different perspective. I believe that God made the earth to sustain itself for as long as God wants. As long as until God destroys it by fire.
The debate reminds me of a song. Kerry said he had a "better plan" but really never spelled it out. How about this for a comedy routine:
Kerry in a dress –
Kerry: I can do anything better than you
Bush: No you can’t
Kerry: Yes I can
Bush: No you can’t
Kerry: Yes I can
Bush: No you can’t
Kerry: Yes I can, yes I can
Paul, your thoughts (if we can call them such) on the idea of how to deal effectively with Global Warming are inane.
It’s interesting that the one moment I said, ‘Oh, the Right is going to use that’ — the Global Test, was exactly what you picked up on. Hmm. The only problem is if you watched the debate, and put that in context, it was very easy to understand EXACTLY what he meant. Yet I knew it would take all of five seconds for the attack dogs to come out. On cue, as though Karl Rove and Frank Luntz were microchipped into Bush’s brain, he inanely tried to bring it up. But it was inane, and remains inane.
Like the ‘tanning’ non-issue, like the ‘flip-flopping’ lies, like all of it. Inane, petulant, defensive, childish. But while we can’t expect any better from our Commander-in-Chief Paul, we have come to expect better from you.
Inane.
Mrs. J asked:
"I could have SWORN he said, "I need to put a leash on them." I might be TOTALLY wrong, but did you guys catch what he said?"
Yes. I had to watch it about 3 or 4 times before I could understand Bush at all (he was, after all, breaking the rules by talking during Kerry). But yes, that’s what he actually said.
To which Kerry replied "I learned long ago not to do that".
Well said, Senator.
Paul tried his best with:
"Bush said the military will stay voluntary, which means no draft for you liberal. See previous blog on the (fake) draft."
Yes, Bush also said "we’ve found the weapons of mass destruction".
Bush also said (last night, in fact) that Kerry said he wanted to pull the troops out in 6 months. That’s not, of course, what Kerry said.
Bush also said he would use every Diplomatic means possible before going to war.
Bush also said he was against Nation Building.
Bush also said he was against creating a Homeland Security Dept.
Bush also said he against creating a 9/11 Commission.
Bush also said the Intelligence Agencies mislead him with their pre-war Intelligence data.
In other words…Bush says a lot. None of it means it’s the truth for this "President" who has lost all credibility around the entire globe. And that’s a "global test" that this President has failed and failed hard.
Brad, thank you for confirming what I thought I heard Bush say ! Can we make a big deal out of this , please??!! He said he should put a leash on his daughters! Can you imagine if Kerry had said that? Honestly?
Paul…you really make me sad. You and another person I’ve had the misfortune of meeting on these blogs. You are both people that make me very very sad.
By your twisted and revolting logic by the way, you might as well smoke, drink, do drugs, and completely torture your body. Because God made your body to sustain itself for as long as he wants, so what the hell? Trash it!
Regardless, I’m not getting into another religious debate with you (if you can call it that). Its none of your business who I pray too, but just know, that they have reduced the hole in the ozone by 20% so hallelujah !!! On with the careless attitude we go !!!!
Johanna, you are dying. Every breath you take is one breath you have lost. The Ozone hole is normal and it is not going to kill you or destroy the earth. You have a better chance of getting killed while driving. Don’t leave home today!
Brad says:
> Yes, Bush also said "we’ve found the weapons of mass destruction".
When and where did he say that?
> Bush also said he would use every Diplomatic means possible before going to war.
Ahh…he asked the UN to do their job but they decided to be irrelevant.
> Bush also said he was against Nation Building.
Before 911
> Bush also said he was against creating a Homeland Security Dept.
I was against it too.
> Bush also said he was against creating a 9/11 Commission.
Could be used politically which it turned out to be. And, I know you guys hate the patriot act and you also want all recommendations of the 911 commission to be put in place, which means liberals, the patriot act needs to be expanded. So, which way do you want it?
Paul, a quick google search revealed.
http://www.rotten.com/library/h...ar/wmd/saddam/
30 May 2003 President George W Bush tells Polish TV: "We found the weapons of mass destruction. We found biological laboratories… we’ve so far discovered two. And we’ll find more weapons as time goes on. But for those who say we haven’t found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they’re wrong, we found them."
Hm. You don’t think he misLED us?
Ironically, on the SAME day…
30 May 2003 During a press conference, Lt. General James Conway, USMC declares: "It was a surprise to me then, it remains a surprise to me now, that we have not uncovered weapons… in some of the forward dispersal sites. Again, believe me, it’s not for lack of trying. We’ve been to virtually every ammunition supply point between the Kuwaiti border and Baghdad, but they’re simply not there… We were simply wrong."
Also, whether you were for or against a Homeland Security Department is irrelevant.
Once again, regarding your short-sighted Patriot Act nonsense, you can expand some of the points, and remove others. Just like Kerry mentioning that just because the President says something won’t work, doesn’t mean it won’t work. There’s work to be done there, and reasonable minds would incline to agree.
And your immature response to Johanna is petulant and prideful. Certainly it’s unhelpful. These are legitimate problems Paul, and you’re not considering any solution except God will take care of it in his own time? Well, God helps those who help themselves, and consider that he may not want to set the fire to the Earth the way you claim, but he may have to if he sees we’ve destroyed it beyond all reckoning. Global warming IS an issue, a tremendous issue, and a frightening one.
Thanks, Bryan. You handled most of Paul’s baloney. An even closer reference for Bush’s statements that "we found the Weapons of Mass Destruction" is right here, about 5 items ago on the BRAD BLOG: http://www.bradfriedman.com/Bra...s/00000640.htm
You also pointed out that whether Paul was against Homeland Security Dept or not, the point is that Bush — a man "who sticks with his convictions" — flip-flopped on that issue, on the issue of a 9/11 Commission, on the issue of a National Intelligence Director, and on countless others. It turns out the man has NO convictions, just confusions.
He also lied about going to the U.N. No matter what Paul thinks about the U.N. Bush simply lied. (and flip-flopped in the bargain!)
Lastly, Paul foolishly said in regards to Global Warming: "You have a better chance of getting killed while driving. Don’t leave home today!"
…And you have even *less* of a chance of being killed by a Terrorist. None the less, 9/11 apparently was a good enough excuse for George W. Bush to flip-flop on everything he ever said prior to 9/11, bankrupt our budget and kill thousands of human beings in order to battle this "scourge".
Paul and Bush: Wouldn’t recognize a "core conviction" if it came up and bit ’em on the Dick Cheney.
Paul,
Do you believe the senate voted against Kyoto six months before the accord was written? Your inane repitition of the 100-0 vote (which by the way was not 100-0) suggests that you are, in fact. stupid enough to believe this. If you aren’t stupid enough to believe this, then please, for once, admit you were wrong.
Brad,
"Paul and Bush: Wouldn’t recognize a "core conviction" if it came up and bit ’em on the Dick Cheney."
This is why mr. Bush let the following phrase slip last night: he referred to his strategic beliefs. He said "Of course, we change tactics when need to, but we never change our beliefs, the strategic beliefs that are necessary to protect this country in the world. " What are strategic beliefs? Are they the beliefs one must gave to attract the most voters and money only to be cast of in a moment of expediency as the name suggests?
On that topic, John, I should have also mentioned Bush’s "core belief" that states should determine their own laws in regards to Gay Marriage. Until the polls suggested to Bush that a Constitutional Amendment against it would be in order.
Just another in a looong line of facts that Paul would rather pretend didn’t exist. It must be difficult living with so few honest convictions.
Global Warming is a crock of crap like I said before.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS GAY MARRIAGE!
Marriage is a union between a man and a woman.
Paul,
i had no idea you were a climatologist.
Seriously, how could the Senate have voted against the Kyoto treaty (your words) six months before it was written?
Program on the emergence of civilization.
"14 species of large animals capable of domesitcation in the history of mankind.
None from the sub-Saharan African continent.
13 from Europe, Asia and northern Africa."
Favor.
And disfavor.
They point out Africans’ attempts to domesticate the elephant and zebra, the latter being an animal they illustrate that had utmost importance for it’s applicability in transformation from a hunting/gathering to agrarian-based civilization.
The roots of racism are not of this earth.
Austrailia, aboriginals:::No domesticable animals.
The North American continent had none. Now 99% of that population is gone.
Organizational Heirarchy
Heirarchical order, from top to bottom:
1. MUCK – perhaps have experienced multiple universal contractions (have seen multiple big bangs), creator of the artificial intelligence humans ignorantly refer to as "god"
2. Perhaps some mid-level alien management –
3. Mafia (evil) aliens – runs day-to-day operations here and perhaps elsewhere ("On planets where they approved evil.")
Then we come to terrestrial management:
4. Chinese/egyptians – this may be separated into the eastern and western worlds
5. Romans – they answer to the egyptians
6. Mafia – the real-world interface that constantly turns over generationally so as to reinforce the widely-held notion of mortality
7. Jews, corporation, women, politician – Evidence exisits to suggest mafia management over all these groups.
Survival of the favored.
Movies foreshadowing catastrophy
1986 James Bond View to a Kill 1989 San Fransisco Loma Prieta earthquake.
They can affect the weather and Hurricane Katrina was accomplished for many reasons and involves many interests, as anything this historical is::
1. Take heat off Sheenhan/Iraq, protecting profitable war machine/private war contracts
2. Gentrification. New Orleans median home price of $84k is among the lowest in major American cities, certainly among desirable cities.
3. Punish red states
Journal: 10 composition books + 39 megs of text files