Oh,.. my God,..

He just left us his whole dossier,.. for us to paw and claw thru.

Have fun during your mini beach getaway,..

eat plenty of ice-cream and snow-cones,.. to keep the chill on.

Safe travels,.. Hurry back.

THIS ONE IS MOST SIGNIFICANT:

AUGUST 20, 2003: Attack on United Nations Headquarters in Baghdad.

The U.N. special representative in Iraq [Sergio Vieira de Mello] and at least 16 others died Tuesday in a bomb explosion that ripped through the organization’s headquarters in Baghdad. … At least 100 people were wounded. [CNN, 8/20/03]

{from: http://www.thinkprogress.org/iraq-timeline --99}

Think like a criminal.

What was the result of this attack?

The UN Pulled out.

Then What?

Other nations pulled out of the coalition over time - as each of these countries were threatened and attacked.

By whom?

Cui Bono?

Who else do we know that brazenly attacked a UN observer position just recently?

Israel.

On whose behalf are we in Iraq?

Israel.

How many Mossad Operatives are operating within Iraq? Hundreds?

Who blew up the Mosque that lit the spark for the civil war?

Cui Bono?

Open your mind.

FALSE FLAGS AND SPIES:

Think like a criminal.

Isn't it interesting that Lieberman's name pops up in the case of two similar-looking tarts, who were "Honey Pots" (or "Swallows" - the term used to describe women in the employ of Israel whose job is to compromise US Officials) for Israel's Mossad?

Note that his article dated less than TWO MONTHS PRIOR TO 9/11.

Police to return to parks in Levy case
Experts: Condit damaged own reputation

July 22, 2001 Posted: 6:07 PM EDT (2207 GMT)

Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-Connecticut, said it wouldn't be productive to focus on Condit's conduct. In 1998, Lieberman was the first prominent Democrat to criticize Clinton for his affair with Monica Lewinsky.

Lieberman said the two matters are different and he declined to say whether Condit should resign, as two Republican lawmakers have said.

"The Chandra Levy case is a missing persons case. And I think we all ought to let the law-enforcement authorities focus on finding Chandra Levy and relieving the terrible trauma and nightmare that her family and friends have gone through," Lieberman told Fox News Sunday. "And when that is over, politicians can begin to speak out."

Saturday, a spokeswoman for Vice President Dick Cheney, said Cheney met with Condit around the same time Levy was logging off her computer in her apartment May 1.

Juleanna Glover Weiss said the meeting happened between 12:30 p.m. and 12:50 p.m. in Cheney's office in the House of Representatives. The meeting was "at Condit's request," she said, and included Cheney and some of Cheney's staff discussing the California energy crisis.

http://archives.cnn.com/...issing.intern/index.html

CHENEY ORDERED THE HIT TO PROTECT THE 9/11 OPERATION?

http://www.aztlan.net/israeli_sexpionage.htm

Israeli Sexpionage : The McGreevey, Condit and
Clinton Affairs

Chandra Levy and Monica Lewinsky, which I will discuss later, can be called "Swallows".

All 9/11 Airports Serviced by
One Israeli Owned Company

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/ICTS.html

Who provided protective coverage for 9/11 operation?

General Hamid Gul, a former Director of Pakistani Intelligence hit the nail on the head with his analysis:

"The attacks against New York and Washington were Israeli engineered."

So who tipped off Zim? Who tipped off Odigo? Who tipped off those Pentagon officials? Who tipped off those Israeli workers in New York? I think it's safe to say it wasn't Osama Bin Laden.

http://www.aljazeera.com..._theory/fullstory.asp?id

http://adlusa.us/israelis_evacuate.htm

Scores dead in three Amman hotel bombings; Israelis evacuated before attack

Explosions In London - Who Stands To Gain? Israel Warned, Cover-up In Progress

Propaganda Matrix | July 7 2005

BREAKING: Scrambled cover-up to try and change prior knowledge story.

Original reports stated that Binyamin Netanyahu was warned BEFORE the first blast, now all the Associated Press reports are being changed to say he was warned AFTER the first blast, for example this article.

The article linked below that we saved in our own format (and the website that carried it has strangely since crashed) said that Netanyahu was warned before the first blast.

Israel are now denying they got a warning.

http://www.propagandamat...ly2005/070705standstogai

LONDON SUBWAY BOMBINGS 2005 - "FALSE FLAG" TERROR?

http://www.indymedia.org/en/2006/05/839272.shtml

RECENT BOMBINGS IN EGYPT - "FALSE FLAG" TERROR?

EGYPTIAN ANALYST: CAN'T RULE OUT THAT MOSSAD WAS INVOLVED IN ATTACK
http://www.ynetnews.com/...30;506,L-3243397,00.html
http://www.ynetnews.com/...out/CdaArticlePrintPrevi

"The Mossad's ability to penetrate the Bedouins in Sinai is known," Salim said in an interview with al-Jazeera. (Roee Nahmias)

General Allam, former deputy head of the Egyptian Domestic Security Agency says the group behind yesterday's deadly bombings in Dahab is not Arab Terrorists --- it's Israel.

AT LEAST 7 OF THE 9/11 HIJACKERS ARE STILL ALIVE
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/hijackers.html

WHO GAVE THE LIST OF "19 MUSLIM HIJACKERS" (PHONEY BY AT LEAST 7 NAMES) TO OUR FBI JUST DAYS AFTER 9/11?
In the Scottish Sunday Herald, Nov, 2, 2003, Neil Mackay investigated...
http://ww1.sundayherald.com/print37707
Excerpt only...
"In August, 2001, the Israelis handed over a list of terrorist suspects - on it were the names of four of the September 11 hijackers."

ON 9/11, CHENEY CONFUSED AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS AND NORAD BY RUNNING WAR GAMES DRILLS WITH MULTIPLE HIJACKED AIRLINERS - RUNNING AT SAME TIME AS THE REAL ATTACKS WITH HIJACKED AIRLINERS!
http://www.prisonplanet....ber2004/080904wargamesco

A number of people apparently knew to stay clear of the World Trade Center on September 11th, 2001.

Privileged Companies

Another group of people that received warnings in advance of the attack were employees of Odigo, the instant messaging service. Two employees received e-mail messages two hours before the first World Trade Center assault, predicting the attack. 7

According to reporter Christopher Bollyn, Zim American Israeli Shipping Co. broke a lease in order to vacate the World Trade Center just days before the attack. Bollyn's source claims that Zim's lease extended through the end of the year and that the termination cost $50,000.

http://911research.wtc7.net/sept11/warnings.html

Israeli Owned Odigo says workers were warned of attack
By Yuval Dror

Odigo, the instant messaging service, says that two of its workers received messages two hours before the Twin Towers attack on September 11 predicting the attack would happen, and the company has been cooperating with Israeli and American law enforcement, including the FBI, in trying to find the original sender of the message predicting the attack.

http://911research.wtc7....ept11/haaretz_odigo.html

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/spyring.html

http://www.antichristcon...Pages/ABCNEWS_com_Were_I

http://ww1.sundayherald.com/print37707

Now can you help me out with a plausible explanation for this:

http://www.informationcl...use.info/article7545.htm

And this official DEA report:

http://www.whatreallyhap...reportisraelispying.html

http://www.whatreallyhap...ed.com/fiveisraelis.html

http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/Artstudents.htm

http://killtown.blogspot...ing-israelis-on-911.html

.

The disinformation continues...

Alleged spy's target 'not Israel'
The "foreign nation" cited in espionage charges against a U.S. Navy sailor is "definitely not Israel," a Navy official said.

The official told JTA on Wednesday that the country named in a charge recommended against Ariel Joseph Weinmann, a 3rd class petty officer, is not Israel.

CNN named the country as Russia. The Navy concluded its investigation against Weinmann on July 26, and its Judge Advocate General is considering what, if any, of its recommended charges to bring against Weinmann, 21.

The Navy concluded that Weinmann, who allegedly deserted in July 2005, attempted to sell sensitive information to a foreign nation. The maximum penalty is death.

Once papers in Norfolk, Va., reported the case, which is being treated with unusual secrecy, Arab media reports and conspiracy theory blogs immediately speculated that the target nation was Israel, apparently because of Weinmann's name.

http://jta.org/page_view...ing_story.asp?intid=4111

Yes, of course, no clear minded individual could possibly deduce that someone named "Ariel Joseph Weinmann" might just be Jewish.

You'd need to belong to some "conspiracy theory blog" to come up with that wacky conclusion.

I watched the report on CNN - and when they said that RUSSIA was the country that "Ariel Weimann" was caught spying for - I laughed out loud - did a Google search - and found that in Israel - they know that Weinmann was spying for Israel.

Report: US sailor spied for Israel
David Keyes, THE JERUSALEM POST

Aug. 9, 2006

A US Navy sailor, Ariel J. Weinmann, is suspected of spying for Israel and has been held in prison for four months, according to an article published Monday in the Saudi daily Al-Watan. It reported that Weinmann is being held at a military base in Virginia on suspicion of espionage and desertion.

According to the navy, Weinmann was apprehended on March 26 "after it was learned that he had been listed as a deserter by his command." Though initial information released by the navy makes no mention of it, Al-Watan reported that he was returning from an undisclosed "foreign country." American sources close to the Defense Department told Al-Watan that Israel was the country in question.

.

Plunger those long posts are sucky, not because of content (I didn't read them) but because of blog rules ... unless those have changed.

WP, it was great hearing your frozen voice on the Collins show. I too am highly skeptical about the recent "terror plot". In fact, it's totally preposterous!

Problem-Reaction-Solution

Make something it happen....
http://infowars.com/arti...player_cia_isi_asset.htm

Get this....
http://infowars.com/arti...travel_fingerprinted.htm

http://infowars.com/arti..._tougher_terror_laws.htm

http://infowars.com/arti...ighborhoods_gonzales.htm

http://www.baltimoresun....oll=bal-attack-headlines

Bring to a boil and simmer on low for instant tyranny.

Dredd #4: I'm not sure which blog rule you're thinking of --- can you be more specific?

IMHO there's nothing "sucky" about the comments Plunger has been making ... I think they're quite bold, actually. Unless I'm missing something?

WP That's an interesting article about Nashville Democrats. The whole country music thing plays into the old "liberal" "conservative" fuzziness. What's it all mean? That if you believe in family values and country (although you're weak and spend too much time drinkin') you're a so-called conservative? Which means you support a lying corporate president and Congress who are doing all they can to undermine what you believe in? Doesn't make much sense.

The roots of country music are populist. Country musicians who are true to their roots - and doesn't tradition mean a lot in the country way of thinking? - should face the facts. (I respect Merle Haggard and some other real country people for honesty.)

Good to see some Nashville folks are thinking about it. (Yeah, that was a dumb headline.)

BTW, it is interesting that you brought up the subject because yesterday I was listening (on Rhapsody) to country music for the first time in a long time. A cousin of mine is in country band of which many of you have no doubt heard. I decided yesterday that I would check out its songs. No politics there, just the little human tragedies and joys and a lot of good times.

Another BTW, after my dad's cop days and after we moved to Colorado, we owned a feed and supply store where I had to work after school when the other kids were usually off doing fun kid stuff. Commercial country music was always playing in our store and I got sick of it! (Except for Patsy Cline ) When we moved to the Bay area I entered hippiedom/acid rock culture with enthusiasm. Now I realize much of the foundation of even acid rock is in country music.

Hi, Arry: Thanks. You make a lot of good points. I think a lot of musicians of all kinds are scared. Just like everybody else. And a lot of them were fooled five years ago, too, and it's taken them a long time to recover. Not meaning to rip anybody in particular, but I think it's instructive to see the splash Neil made with his newest, but remember he was one of the first to get on the war-against-the-rest-of-the-world bandwagon (with "Let's Roll"). At the time I couldn't believe that song was coming from the same man who wrote "Ohio". It looked to me like Neil got hijacked along with the planes. And it's nice to have him back, but we could have used his ... um ... voice ... working for us all those years rather than against!

Also, there's a deep tie between Country and Christian and a lot of American Christians have been hijacked too, via their churches, so there are some "hidden" pressures for a lot of these guys that they don't want to "buck" ... MVHO only but you can share it if you like.

And BTW we are on exactly the same page with respect to Patsy Cline.

Yikes! AdamT: those are some fine links! thanks very much!

Well, I say better late than never, as far as the Country music artists jumping into the fray. And a "tough row to hoe" might be putting it mildly.But I think these folks are up to the challenge. Loretta Lynn sang controversial songs, like the one about "the pill", back in the 70's,at a time when it wasn't "proper" to even talk about birth control. I don't believe it hurt her career at all. These artists need to continue to write and sing their conscience, and Toby needs to re-evaluate "the American way' and take his boot on up to the White House, IMHO.

Thanks, Plunger, for all the work you went to in compiling those posts! Right on!

And thanks, WP, for providing this Open Thread. I'm going to link once again to an essay I think is a must-read for everyone: Mike Ruppert's By the Light of the Burning Bridge, in which he outlines painstakingly his history with From the Wilderness and his reasons for leaving the U.S. permanently.

It's sad to see Mike Ruppert go but in a way it might be a blessing. He might be more effective working elsewhere. We'll see.

I have to claim negligence and admit that I misunderestimated him for a while last summer, when I was reading some people who were dissing him pretty regularly. I said something about it here and Dredd reminded me of some things I should have remembered all along, and I don't read those guys anymore. Maybe I never should have.

In any case, thanks and best wishes to Mike Ruppert; thanks also to Peg and Dredd for all the FTW links you've put up lately, and for much else too.

#8 WP Good points. What a time we went through when the top 1% in wealth influenced the culture to such an extent that the salt of the earth believed their interests to be the same. It will take awhile for historians to sort that one out. Something radical and disturbing happened in the '80's and '90's, culminating in the current administration, and I think much of it had to do with a conscious and widespread program of psychological conditioning. (Fewer people with more power and sophisticated tools of marketing and analysis.)

Neil's was a painful case. I thought so too.

#10 Nana --- Yes, anyone who wants to jump into the fray is welcome, late or not late. It's up to us to support those who do.

Oh, WP, your link to the great Patsy Cline has one too many "http's" .

WP -

I didn't remember that you had ever taken exception to Ruppert. I just thought that his essay, as well-presented and coherent as it is, needed to be read and digested. Especially this line from the end of the piece:

"In many lectures I have uttered another one of my trademarked lines: The human race is now being presented by a dispassionate universe with one test; either evolve or perish. I, for one, have chosen to evolve."

My sentiments exactly.

Not that I think the current administration is legitimate.

Plunger -I have always thought that Monica was some type of operative planted to take down Clinton. One photo sticks out in my mind - Monica in a crowd with her barret, staring at Clinton as he spoke. I tried to find it to post a link, but gave up after about 1/2 hour of searching.

Winter - in your second photo your aura is showing!

By the way - I clicked on your "down by the sea" link and got lost for about an hour looking at all the places I used to live! LOL

Weird stuff there, Arry. I checked that link before I posted it and it seemed to work ... then I see your comment and I check it again and it's broken ... so I fixed it and now both of our links to the great Patsy Cline will work! Click on 'em, folks, and find out (if you don't already know) what a GREAT country singer sounds like. Sounded like. RIP Patsy.

Now here's a player! : Derek Trucks at YouTube

Seven minute video of Pink Floyd doing Run Like Hell.

Peg, I started reading your Ruppert link yesterday, and bookmarked it so I can sit down and really pay attention to it all at once. Seems to merit that. Thanks for bringing it up. Without having read the whole thing, though, I can say I hope Chavez has given him protection, because Caracas wouldn't seem to me to be the best place to go to dodge the black ops right now. Place has got to be swarming with them.

So now the Dems will pick their presidential candidate based on who follows the calender rather than who's the best man?

WTF?

OK! Here's the plan: We can start here and finish here; and along the way, we might meet up with one friend or another, or even a bunch of 'em ... and we don't even have to worry about provisions, because the river will provide.

To y'all music discussion types:

I think I'm probably the only working Nashville musician who blogs here regularly. Brad even used my song "Election Reform" awhile back.
I'm not clear on how to do links, so you can google the tune if you wanna hear it thru Brad's search in the top right corner... ; - )

Nashville really is Music City, and literally one outta every four families in our town is somewhere in the Music Biz. We all started out as artists and, as such, our natural inclination is to be open and
fair-minded. Music Row Democrats is gearing up again, as the article WP showed us. Nashville always votes Democrat.
We're doing our part, writing songs that explore the truth, but they can only be found online, as the big media has got the radio pretty much locked up...

shw

{LINK --99}

WP, #23

I'm in! When do we leave?

(You forgot a portrait of the State Bird though [mosquito].)

It was a Republican Senator, Hiram Johnson of California, who is credited with saying in 1917, "The first casualty when war comes is truth." His words were borne out by the censorship and civil repression that accompanied the U.S.'s entry into World War I and this has been true to the nth degree in regard to our own "war on terror" and the war in Iraq. But there are degrees of casualty ranging from a cut on the finger to loss of limb, shattered spine, or death itself. And in our current situation, where the very legitimacy of the Bush administration is a lie due to its corrupting of the electoral process and the Constitution, truth is in fact dead.

http://www.opednews.com/...spinning_truth_into_.htm

A little late getting this info out,..
just had a laptop crash,.. took awhile to reboot.

Ring of Fire,.. Kennedy/Papantonio
with David Brock of Media Matters discusses in detail the politicization of terror alerts by bu$$hco and the MSM and how the public seems to be becoming leery and weary to fall for this crap anymore. KKKarl Rove's ability to divert and manipulate the political discourse to the advantage of the Republican Party just prior to the midterm elections is not working as effectively as it has in the past.

Media Matter,.. MSM prostitutes for bu$$hco,..

Matthews claimed Islamic terrorists "may be politically on the left," presented false choice between "tap[ping] ... phones" and "honoring civil rights"
Thursday, August 17, 2006 6:35PM : Video Link

Fox's Your World asked: "Is the liberal media helping to fuel terror?"
Thursday, August 17, 2006 7:21PM : Video Link

NY Times, CNN, Fox News uncritically reported GOP suggestion that unwarranted surveillance helped foil U.K. terror plot
Friday, August 18, 2006 5:43PM : Video Link

Cavuto hosted Armageddon author Joel Rosenberg --- noted as a "Middle East analyst" --- who cited Ahmadinejad's apocalyptic vision while ignoring his own
Thursday, August 17, 2006 5:49PM : Video Link

Imus producer on man who admitted killing Ramsey: "He looks like Ned Lamont, actually. Is that who you want representing you, Connecticut?"
Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:34PM : Video Link

Citing no one, Scarborough claimed "[s]ome Democrats" have suggested British terror plot "was just some ploy by the Republicans ... to justify their actions in the war on terror"
Wednesday, August 16, 2006 1:15PM : Video Link

The MSM propaganda noise machine feeds and nourishes Fascism,.. the general public is becoming reluctant and cynical about digesting this swill,.. Media Matters delves into these issues,..More Links

====================

Ironically this mirrors the Peter B. Collins/Winter Patriot radio discussions. It is nice to see people bring these issues to the attention of the public,.. the ability of this administration to hoodwink the public is key to breaking this single party control over our government so that meaningful oversight in the halls of congress can commence.

Ring of Fire next segment,.. Islamo-fascism another Rove/bu$$hco hideous diversionary tactic,.. concern for religious extremism should properly be directed to American fundimentalist religious extremism,.. familiarize yourself with Christian Dominionism and Christian Reconstructionists,.. that brand of Theocratic extremism is the real threat.

This Ring of Fire program will be re-broadcast on Sunday,.. as always they dissect these issues with their customary expertise.

Just last night listened to an archived segment of Head On with Bob Kincaid where he had a long discussion with a caller about the term "Islamo-fascist" spreading throughout right wing media. The POINT is that the United States now meets all fourteen criteria for fascism, and the Islamist fanatics don't meet any of them. There's a link to Kincaid's show/network in the column to the right of this thread on our screens.

Here's what I think...CheneyCo is going to "green light" another 9/11. I can tell, with all of these Republicans going on the air, saying if the Dems win, the terrorist win. Also, Bush saying he is against the Court decision about wiretapping. There's going to be a false flag 9/11-like attack, and Bush will say, "See? I was right!" The MSM will cheerlead it. It's coming, before November elections. They're "preparing" us with statements all over the corporate MSM, like posted above in all the mediamatters links. It's August, there's less than 90 days until Cheney "green lights" another 9/11, to keep the Republicans in power. Somehow, even though they were in charge during 9/11, the MSM goes along with the talking points that if the Dems win, Al Queda wins, even though Bush/Cheney were in charge of keeping us safe on 9/11. How'd they pull that off?

The Republicans should be known as the "party that didn't defend us on 9/11", instead the MSM has dolts calling them the "security party". How'd that happen???

Hold your breath for the next 90 days, I'm tellin' ya!!! The only difference, is that we know who's doing it now. We grew up a lot since 9/11/2001, in our knowledge of false-flag terrorism.

Here's some food for thought, of who may have been behind the 1982 bombing of the American barracks in Lebanon...

http://www.rbnlive.com/Forbes.html

Agent99 #20,

Run Like Hell is my favorite Pink Floyd tune but it strangely missing from their greatest hits double-CD.

"Nuclear war starting in 10 days?

Our world is on the brink of another world war. It will originate August 22nd in the Middle East. The prediction was presented not by Vagna or Nostradamus but by an American political scientist Bernard Lewis in the acclaimed publication of Wall Street Journal. He is a man with close ties to the Bush administration as well as to the non-conservatives pushing for the radical solution of the ’Iranian Threat.’ Lewis believes it will be precisely Teheran who will unleash the ultimate conflict by attacking Israel. Why August 22nd? Perhaps simply because Washington has set a deadline for the Iranian president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and has demanded a complete wrap up of the nuclear program by that day. It is obvious that Teheran has no intention to comply. Curiously, this year the night of August 22nd happens to be night Muslims will celebrate the journey of their prophet Mohammed to Jerusalem and his ascension into heaven. According to Lewis the followers of Mohammed have a perfect opportunity to enrich their celebration by throwing an attack on Israel. An immediate retaliation will follow."

http://bellaciao.org/en/...le.php3?id_article=13131

WP #23 & Agent99 #25

Wait for me!

Agent BB2

I would never dream of going into the wilderness without you!

Oldturk #27

Only let one girl on your lap at a time!

Big Dan #29

Will it be before the elections hoping to turn the people who aren't believing them anymore, or as a parting shot after the elections as in "See I told you so!"?

Agent99

I'll bring the yurt carried by a yak.

Bush cried "Wolf" but nobody's listening.

Hurray, WP!

I finally got to hear you and you did a wonderful job! Especially the part about those "truer words were never spoken" by our own vice - or "vise" as in clamp or squeezer. Funny thing about homonyms - in ALL languages!

WP's play with maps reminds me of what I miss second-most about slow dial-up. Google satellite! Other people say they can see our house and yard, even my truck, people living thousands of miles away! But the images take so long to download initially that "zooming" is really oxymoronic for us.

So don't forget to send me written instructions once BB2 has collected his yak, yurt and a new pair of mukluks.

Did you know that Hitler, the Columbine massacre and immorality are all the fault of Charles Darwin?

Our favorite Ann Coulter will get you up to speed. (Real Player Video)

Link to the text article.

Peg C

It looks like we'll need Kayaks too, unless your time machine is portable and capable of locational transport.

#24- Shannon --- Thanks for the information. Probably a lot of people don't know Nashville votes Democrat. I didn't. Where I live (in northern California) very corporate-sounding, slick country music seems to be the music of choice of Bush/Cheney supporters.

I'm sure there is some great country stuff being written and performed. If the political, progressive, true populist music can only be distributed through the internet, there may be trouble with the "Advanced Telecommunications and Opportunities Reform Act" which you probably are aware of. Will they take everything away from us?

You and other musicians have my best wishes in the hope that your music can get out there and be a big part (as music always is) of a renewal of American spirit and purpose.

#42 - Peg --- I can't do Google satellite on my computer either, but I did it on another one. It was fun travelling around the world checking out places.

Call me paranoid, but zeroing in on my house (which could be easily seen) gave me a very uneasy feeling, like I was looking through the instruments of a bomber and pretty soon you'd see a silent explosion like has become so common in modern television war coverage.

Just a fantasy, of course, but it really hit me how in control the people who control the technology are. Whether satellite surveillance, wiretapping, keeping vast electronic files on American citizens and their habits...Well, Google satellite wasn't as much fun as it would have been!

Arry #45

I stopped listening to music on commercial radio stations years ago when they all started subscribing to Arbitron and competed for ratings based on the Arbtron play lists.
Since then the only stations I listen to are KVMR - Nevada City and KDVS - Davis. Independant non-commercial stations which play things you'll never hear on the others.
I'll never forget the advent of FM stations in the 60's when they went out on a limb to bring new and provocitive progamming to us while th AM stations played all the fluff.
Now it seems AM is nothing but Talk Radio and FM has become the fluff. Only the independant - non commercial stations are true to form.

Another great source for music is Live Music Archive where you can stream and download tons of live recordings for free. Everything there is sanctioned by the artists and is legal to download. Some of the bands are well known, but most are little known bands many of whom are very good.
Derek Trucks was mentioned up-thread - He has 147 shows there. And for you fellow Dead Heads - 2,845, plus a bunch of Phil and Ratdog.

Other areas of the same archive site have archived shows from Free Speech Radio along with individual series which run on Link TV just to mention a few.

#47 --- Bluebear --- Many thanks. That's great. I hadn't heard of the "Live Music Archive". It looks like I'll be spending some serious time there! I can manage the audio streams. Videos, such as the Derek Trucks video and Pink Floyd videos that WP and Agent99 posted, are a problem, unless I can tie up or leave the computer for a long time. (The short Patsy Cline video - about 3 minutes long - I managed. Walked up the hill, mended an irrigation pipe, came back and the divine Patsy was waiting for me.)

I remember the old progressive FM programming. It was great while it lasted.

Come to think of it, I have heard some fine and very interesting non-commercial stuff on KVMR and KDVS. (Mostly, I listen to the radio on the road as I don't get KDVS at all, and get KVMR irregularly where I live. Occasionally, I stream KVMR on the computer for awhile.)

I remember not too long ago the concept of the "Open Thread" was foreign to this blog,.. isn't it delightful how this blog was allowed to evolve.

Take a good look at this thread from top to bottom,.. there is something very dynamic going on here of which we should all be very proud. This is an incredibly masterful combination of human energy working together in unison,.. sharing their incredible intellect,.. and working their fingers to the bone,.. sort of. If they were so inclined they could easily be off selfishly entertaining themselves with less mind taxing pursuits. But they choose not.

I continually remain in a state of amazement and always impressed at the ever increasing quality of the oppositional research produced by the people who frequent this blog. The result of all this unselfish hard work will most certainly beat to submission those who adamantly intend to defile our democracy - and bring force upon them to drastically alter their ways.

So,.. in conclusion,.. I remain forever grateful for this crossroads of communication that this green and yellow blog provides. I remain forever appreciative of the efforts of each and every individual contributor who visits upon the terrain of this blog,.. providing their web links that access higher understandings and knowledge about the state of our current events. It is like an endless buffet of food - for thought and contemplation,.. and akin to delightful harmonies of music - for one's ears. Thank You for the rights that allow my visitations that permit sharing upon the happenings that occur on this landscape. You people are so much a part of the solution for the things that have gone wrong with the United States of America. Walk in pride of yourselves,.. you are some of the best heroes this country has ever offered for inclusion to the books of history - "Those who stood unselfishly forth in opposition to Fascism - and the dismantling and ultimate destruction of democracy." History may not remember each of you individually,.. but collectively the efforts that have been made in unison will will always be remembered. You are an extremely altruistic lot of intelligent and civilized human beings.

Thank You for the pleasure of your associations.
Now get back to work,.. we ain't done yet.

A mini interlude,... Celebration,.. Party-time,.. Video/Music Link

WP
Am just about reconciled to the loss of the wise old fart WP Yes heard your quite young voice on Peter B Collins. Must say that your critical thinking "bullfighting" skills are impressive in someone of any age.

Where do you think Osama is?

OLDTURK

IT'S HARD WORK (like THEY say).

"Two Strange Deaths in European Wiretapping Scandal"

http://rawstory.com/show...t.org%2Fstory%2F40485%2F

Old Turk #49

The music is equally as sweet as your accolade!

Thanks

And don't forget to include yourself, OLDTURK.

.........Arry & BB2

Give a listen to WDST Woodstock. Still independent after all these years and worth the ear time.

Speaking of Republicans and music (I was speaking of Republicans and music), this piece about Lieberman struck me as really funny.

MMIIXX.........#51

Interesting story, thanks for the post. There is just so much shit going down on this little globe with out an extended watchful community there would be no way in hell to keep up.

#54 --- Thanks, MEP. Will do.

Oh, MAN, do I ever get behind! Good night, sweet princes and prinecesses. It gets late early on the very eastern coast.

Love you all...

MEP #54

I tried to listen to WDST, but none of the listed players worked. Windows Media player did nothing from the player on their page and gave a "class not registered" error message when I pasted the link in. Real player said the file was corrupted and Winamp crashed my computer. Any tricks to it?
I'll try again later and try with Internet Explorer in case Netscape has a problem with it.

G'night Peg. Sweet dreams.

OldTurk #49 -

This is a beautiful post, and you are one of the "enlightened." Thank you, bless you and sustain other like you!

Good night Peg. Sleep tight.

BB2.#59

My puter skills are lacking but you hit a chord with the Explorer thing.., cause I do know it seems to not like Firefox. Hope you can connect cause the people there really do creative programing. They have a live "round table" discussion/mind puzzle show on Sundays that can be a real hoot. Good luck wish I could be of more help. Got to go now....been bouncing time zones and its scrambled my gray stuff.

Sorry, BB2, UTube is beyond this simple station of sanity. But thank you for the idea! 'Night all. I love you.

Peg C

It was The Beatles "Good Night"

Adding to the country music theme, remember who was one of the first artists to come out in public support of Michael Moore when he released Fahrenheit 9-11, and who called him a true patriot...

Linda Ronstadt
A cautionary rumor quasher here though

And although I posted it a few threads back on the blog, thanks again to Peg C for the Ruppert link. i wrote him a personal letter thanking him for his courage over the years. He was one of the first people to turn me on to government conspiracy surrounding 9-11 through his video "Truth and Lies of 9-11", back in mid-2002. I haven't looked back...

Soul Rebel -

Exactly right. Keep up the whatever-it-is we are doing. We've GOT to get it right.

I'm too sleepy to be coherent. But I've got to say, you guys are the salt of the earth!

What about heterosexual marriage and the protections thereof,.. what about Mosaic Laws and the sin of adultery,.. What does Orin Hatch have to say about this ? He always seems to have a clever comment,.. why the silence on this subject matter ? You'd think he would be up in arms.

Photo Link

# 68

Polygamy,..

Just what we need,.. one male,.. twenty kids.

Senator George Allen (R-Virginia) who's up for reelection and wants to run for president in 2008.

This is the racist Nazi pig who cheerfully made the despicable "Macaca" racial slur,.. he is now down six points in the polls after having made this white supremacist comment.

Allen & Hitler in 2008 - Heading towards the White House.

Link to article

Sally #50: I think he has a corner office at 1600 ... no, just kidding ... I think he's almost certainly dead. Serious that time.

BigDan #29

There are indications that the republican dictatorship can no longer catapult the propaganda (link here).

At least not when they are talking to those who are not in a catatonic state of mind.

(Now there is a tune for Shannon to sing about those who support the fascist Bush regime: "I'm in a Catatonic State of Mind", sung to the tune of Joel's "I'm in a New York State of Mind".)

WP #6

I said unless the rules have changed. Long posts have been criticized for a long time.

I made no comment about the content, as your false flag straw man suggests.

Now we make the rules up as we go I suppose?

Whatever. Ego on. Any form of power corrupts obviously.

I have been wondering where RLM is. Haven't seen any of his posts lately.

I wonder if the Lamont/Lieberman thing took him out?

Michael Moore is a hero. I'm sure he is as disappointed at the American reaction to fascism as Michael Ruppert.

He didn't just talk. He stood up for his country against the most evil men on the planet and all he gets is a bunch of unamerican losers who attack a woman, (Linda Ronstadt), for telling the truth!

Jesus has lost interest, and won't be back. Heal yourselves, jackasses!

Arry #45: Yeah, they may take it all from us, but I have faith in songs and I have faith in technology. We'll figure out some way to keep the music going...

You can find a lot of more thoughtful music with the Americana artists. Google 'em up. Americana is a format that sorta sprang outta country here in Nashville - where popularity has-beens, never-weres and never-will-bes can still practice their art and deliver their quality music to somebody. Seek 'em out. You won't be disappointed. Steve Earl (I see him at the bookstore...). Americana. Kevin Welch (I see him at the grocer...). Americana. Will Kimbrough (great guitarist/producer/singer/songwriter that I see at neighborhood school functions). Americana. Dave Olney (our shoulda-been Springsteen, I see him at our kids' school and walking in the park - writes for Rondstat and lots of others...). Americana. LOTS of others. The Americana music movement is Nashville-based. I note that I see 'em around just to show that this is Music City and we are mostly progressive. I don't work with any of these folks myself, but do hang with 'em now and again. My music can be found at www.deliciousbluesstew.com. It's mostly Louisiana and blues-based stuff, as I grew up in the jook joints of Baton Rouge.

Old Turk #49: Thanks for the lovely panflute break!My wife and my musician child dug it, too...

Dredd #72: I think "Catatonic State of Mind" should be a death-metal-voice-of-Satan-rapping rage tune...
I've never recorded one, but my son's music has given me the opportunity to hear WAAAAyy too much of the genre...

Thanks to all y'all patriots. We may save this country yet; or at least have good seats at the opry house in Heaven if the fasciasts take us out...

shw

Shannon Williford #76

Five minutes of the "death-metal-voice-of-Satan-rapping rage" genre is more than enough for me. I'll stick with the stew and bluegrass.

Yes, I too have been wondering about RLM (Robert Lockwood Mills). He's never been away this long before. Vacation? Illness? Battle fatigue? Let's find out...

yeah BB2 #77, I'm a little old to appreciate that myself. I think the stuff would make Ozzy himself flinch... "Music to barf by..."
But, all adolescent boys have to go through their loud obnoxious music stage. Mine was Zeppelin; the guys ahead of us were the Stones, Beatles. Before that was Elvis. I think maybe Black Sabbath and Rush were in there somewhere.
Later the Sex Pistols, and hard-core rap...
I just hope there is some decent lyric in there somewhere...

And yes, Peg C, RLM needs to be heard here again...
'Course I disappear for weeks at a time when real life and work call...

shw

Remember that guy doug eldrich? What ever happened to him?

Also, will Christopher Bollyn still write for AFP, even though he left the country?

here's a story of hope…

The Energy Project

In 2003 Steorn undertook a project to develop more efficient micro generators. Early into this project the company developed certain generator configurations that appeared to be over 100% efficient. Further investigation and development has led to the company’s current technology, a technology that produces free energy. The technology is patent pending.

http://www.steorn.net/en/technology.aspx?p=5

Regarding RLM, what has happened to him? I just tried to reach his web site but it just times out. It is through Tripod and the Tripod home page works.

What's up with that?

Robert Lockwood Mills' Tripod page works fine for me, BB2. He could be having computer problems. He could be on vacation. He could be sick of the internet. (I know a few people who have been forced for the sake of sanity to take news vacations.) I hope he's not sick of us, but that could be too. He could be just plain sick. I'm sure he'll pipe up again when he wants to. Also, don't forget, internet traffic tends to slow in the summer months, just the way the freeway traffic eases in the summer months. Kids being out of school tends to distract a lot of people from their routines. Suddenly saddled with grandkids; suddenly taken up with your own kids' needs; kids themselves not at their computers nearly as much as during the school year....

BB2 --- The site comes up for me.

...as I wrote not having seen 99's post. Seems like RLM was here a week or two ago. Maybe I'm wrong.

Maybe RLM is working on another book. I have a copy of his The Lindberg Syndrome, which came out last year, about small planes that vanish into thin air, piloted by supremely competent fliers.

Well that's odd - it turns out that my firewall was blocking his site. Working now ok after resetting it.

An interesting little tidbit

Blair 'feels betrayed by Bush on Lebanon'

Well duh! About time you woke up, Tony!

I'm sorry, but I feel this is a huge mistake!

Sen. Clinton gets ready to run

Dredd - input?

I figured I'd link something to my name. It's not politics or even related to this fine place, but it's a big part of me.

BB-2

Sen. Clinton,.. well,.. she has Rupert Murdock's vote
Isn't she a Republican like Lie-berman ?

Re the disappearance of RLM.......if my memory serves me correctly, it seems that on one of the threads, he was reamed out for being 'snobbish' or some similar comment and I can't remember which thread it was, and that would be about 2 or 3 weeks ago.

I hope he didn't take it to heart and decide to leave posting here. Personally, I found him to be a very knowledgeable, courteous poster and will miss him if he is gone for good. Let's hope he's away on vacation or taking a sanity break from all the bad news like 99 suggested.

I know I get that way about what's happening in your country...., sometimes the news is bleak, but I'm a bradblog-a-holic and have to come back every day for my fix...!! Plus, I silently cheer you guys on as you continue your battle for truth and justice. You are all an inspiration in doggedness and determination.

Hugs to all.....

OldTurk #91

I certainly don't feel she is the uniting factor so much needed right now to overcome bushco. I also don't see her taking action against this regime.

MAR #92

RLM did indeed get into a very heated argument a while back. I also hope it didn't cause his absence. He has always provide a very sound historical base for the topics discussed here.

I meant to mention it this morning but forgot.
If you've got the Science Channel through cable or satellite watch for Tom Brokow's "Global Warming" special. I don't know when it will be on again, but it is excellent!

Dredd #73: Thanks for your very kind words:

I said unless the rules have changed. Long posts have been criticized for a long time.

I made no comment about the content, as your false flag straw man suggests.

Now we make the rules up as we go I suppose?

Whatever. Ego on. Any form of power corrupts obviously.

Your analysis is just about perfect. Clearly, if there's anybody here with an ego problem, it's me. And of course it's obvious that I've been thoroughly corrupted by the awesome power of spending 15 or 20 hours a day looking after somebody else's blog.

As far as "rules" go, there are no written rules here, none that I know of, anyway. I "moderate" according to the principles laid out in discussions I've had with Brad over the years, about what he wants to allow and what he doesn't want. In that sense, the rules are "fuzzy", perhaps. But we are not making them up as we go along.

Having been away for a while, it was difficult for me to recall the posting rules exactly, but (spurred on by your most gracious comment) I have racked my brains as best I could, and I believe I am now "up to speed".

As a matter of fact, there is not now and there has never been any rule (or any other policy whatsoever) specifying the maximum length of a comment. If long comments were verboten, I would have been outa here a long time ago, and so would some very well-respected contributors, past and present. Among the former group, Freebird comes to mind, as does Kira. Nobody ever complained when they typed their fingers to the bone. In fact, if anyone said anything at all about those long posts, what they usually said was: "Thank You".

The rule about "long" actually pertains to "long quotes". We ask people not to post long quotes from material that is available elsewhere on the net. In such a case we ask that the quoted passage be clearly indicated as such, and that it be limited to four paragraphs (save in exceptional circumstances), and we ask for a link to the original article.

For other material, whether it's original writing, or something published in a form that is not available online, there's no limit to how much you can post. If you're willing to sit there and type it, you're welcome to post it. If you're quoting somebody, we still want that clearly indicated, of course. But we don't limit the length of a comment.

Long comments may deter some readers but that is not a big deal as far as I can tell. If you don't want to read something that somebody else posted, by all means scroll past it. The rule that seems to apply here is: "No harm, no foul."

IMO Plunger's comments did transgress our rules, because they don't mention any authors but in fact most of the text (if not all of it) was written by other people. If Plunger wants to continue posting material written by others, that's all right (according to the rules outlined above) provided that the quoted text is so indicated (preferably by the use of "blockquote" and "/blockquote" tags).

I could delete the offending posts on the grounds that they break the rules, but I won't, mostly because Plunger seems to be new here and I don't think it's fair to apply unposted rules to newcomers. Surely the more reasonable approach is to explain the rules and give them a chance to change their ways.

Is it fair not to enforce a rule because of special circumstances? According to Brad, it is. He wants me to use my discretion and judgement and do what seems best at any given time, rather than having a strict menu of offenses and the punishments to be meted out for each of them.

And because I use my discretion, some rules don't get enforced regularly, even in regard to regular commenters. For instance, I really don't like to see the same comment posted on multiple threads, but I don't usually complain about it unless it gets really annoying.

I don't think it serves any good purpose to rip a newcomer without first attempting a civilized conversation; on the contrary, it discourages others from joining the discussion and that doesn't help us at all. IF we're trying to build a broad-based movement, or an "irresistable force" as I sometimes call it, then we need to be willing to work with anyone who shares our goals, even if they like to post long comments.

I also think it's rude to call somebody else's comments "sucky" --- or to denigrate them in any other way --- unless you're prepared to say what you don't like about them. And I think it's especially rude to make disparaging remarks about comments you haven't even read.

But then again, maybe I'd be more tolerant of such seemningly unfriendly and un-called-for behavior, if I didn't have such a big ego.

WP

Thanks, now I know what that "Blockquote" button is for! LOL

I must admit that way back when I was a new-comer everyone was most gracious with me and helped me along. I had never commented at any blog before and I screwed up more than once when learning to post links etc and stretched the blog out to about 50 screen widths more than once! My first attempt at bold fonts made everyone bold until Brad fixed it.
Kira and others helped me along and showed me how to do it right.
The one thing I noticed about Plunger's post was the quantity of links. The old grey matter only allowed 10 before it cut you off.
Thank you and Brad and everyone for making this a good place to be whether you are new or a long time poster.

Sure, BB2, you're welcome. The easy way to use it is to paste in the stuff you're quoting, then click and drag to highlight it and then click "blockquote".

While we're completely OT here, if there are any other questions about the interface I'll be happy to try and help ...

and as for the link limit, if you go over the limit the post lands in a "moderate" queue and I have to see it before it gets posted (or not). Not sure what the limit is, but I think it might be 8. Spam almost always has a lot of links and that's why we watch for posts with a lot of links --- they might be spam. Of course it doesn't hold going the other way; just because a post has a lot of links that doesn't mean it's spam. But we like to see them first ...

Ask 'em if you got 'em!

I've never linked to Daily Kos before but I think everyone needs to read this diary. http://www.dailykos.com/...ory/2006/8/20/154414/372

Robert Lockwood Mills was a real asset to the blog and the guy he got into a little tussel with apologized on a later thread, I hope he saw it. I don't have a problem with people flaunting what they have every now and then, and Mr. Mills is obviously an intelligent guy from an intelligent state.

Who knows what happened to him though. When I have to go back to work full time, I'll be mostly gone too. All of his posts were very well thought out and probably took some time.

Laura:

Boy, I sure like this Paul Letho guy. That poll was a great service and seems to impugn the use of voting machines overall considering they hide the counting of votes to even the top voting officials!

I was in the very room where most of the votes were counted in Utah on primary night and saw people bringing in the chips from all the precincts, but didn't see ONE vote counted!

Larry, If I'm not mistaken Paul Lehto is the attorney who took on the lawsuit for the voters in California's #50th. Yeah I like ANYONE who thinks voting and counting should be transparent. 92% is a whole hell of a lot of people. I think people are finally waking up, at least I hope they are!

I went offline for a weekend and missed an open thread! Well damn.

Winter Patriot - I just wanted to say thanks for the "cold" pictures. Those of us who have been struggling with heat indexes above the century mark for many weeks in a row are much appreciative for the psychological "cooling down" effect.

Now perhaps I can find something to help me visualize a garden that's been completely harvested and tilled under for the year......

KestrelBrighteyes #103

Maybe this will help.

I often read what R.L.M. wrote . . . . . not that I read alot . . . & miss his posts.

Maybe he found that nice lady he was looking 4 . . . . . I hope . . .

Know what? I'd rather read what a reichwing blogger has to say, than what the corporate controlled MSM has to say! BOTH sides better fight for net neutrality. The internet levelled the media playing field, by letting the common guy sound off. When was the last time you were on TV? Never. We are shut out of the TV airwaves. That is why the internet is so big.

The regular guy is totally shut out of participating in any MSM, we are supposed to swallow whatever they broadcast, and not sound off about it. They are losing the media war, look for them to take over the internet. It's happening with the net neutrality legislation, by the "tubes" senator.

Did you see? In Bush's address, he said there were no WMD's in Iraq, no Iraq ties to Al Queda, but we're not leaving while he's president!

Big Dan #107

Don't his own words now prove he lied?
When will he be arrested for war crimes?
When will he be charged with malfeasance in office?
When will he be impeached for crimes against the constitution?
When will hell freeze over?

BB2: I'm getting pissed at Republicans calling ME a terrorist. The Republicans are saying a Dem victory is a victory for terrorists. So if I vote Dem, I am a terrorist, according to them. That is really pissing me off. No one's pointing this out, that the GOP are calling voters who vote Dem "terrorists"!

When is someone going to point out on TV, that Republicans are calling Dem voters "terrorists"??? I'm going to call the next show a Republican is on, and accuse him of calling me a terrorist! They better stop this!

Bluebear2, #108

Your war crimes link would appear to connect to George Herbert Walker Bush and everyone involved in the 1991 Gulf War. Was that what you wanted to link to * saying we aren't leaving Iraq while he's president?

And, er, posting shots of Winter Patriot's ranch is dangerous!

#90 Bluebear --- a man after my own heart.

Duplicitous is just another way of saying bullshit.

Agent99 #111

Oops - I pulled that one up in a hurry - I meant to find another link which which is current to George W and his crew. A little later I will see if I can find it again.

Regarding Winter's Ranch - did you see this?
{Yep, it's way cool... also part of Winter Patriot's ranch. --99}

Arry #112

You've probably got the better view!

WP #96

Hey, I defer to your long "quote" or long "post" or looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong whatever, with a moment of bandwidth holyness and long a thon:

U.S. Supreme Court
BROWN v. BOARD OF EDUCATION, 349 U.S. 294 (1955)
349 U.S. 294
BROWN ET AL. v. BOARD OF EDUCATION OF TOPEKA ET AL.
APPEAL FROM THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR THE DISTRICT OF KANSAS.

* No. 1. Reargued on the question of relief April 11-14, 1955. Opinion and judgments announced May 31, 1955.

1. Racial discrimination in public education is unconstitutional, 347 U.S. 483, 497, and all provisions of federal, state or local law requiring or permitting such discrimination must yield to this principle. P. 298.

2. The judgments below (except that in the Delaware case) are reversed and the cases are remanded to the District Courts to take such proceedings and enter such orders and decrees consistent with this opinion as are necessary and proper to admit the parties to these cases to public schools on a racially nondiscriminatory basis with all deliberate speed. P. 301.

(a) School authorities have the primary responsibility for elucidating, assessing and solving the varied local school problems which may require solution in fully implementing the governing constitutional principles. P. 299.

(b) Courts will have to consider whether the action of school authorities constitutes good faith implementation of the governing constitutional principles. P. 299.

(c) Because of their proximity to local conditions and the possible need for further hearings, the courts which originally heard these cases can best perform this judicial appraisal. P. 299.

(d) In fashioning and effectuating the decrees, the courts will be guided by equitable principles - characterized by a practical flexibility in shaping remedies and a facility for adjusting and reconciling public and private needs. P. 300. [349 U.S. 294, 295]

(e) At stake is the personal interest of the plaintiffs in admission to public schools as soon as practicable on a nondiscriminatory basis. P. 300.

(f) Courts of equity may properly take into account the public interest in the elimination in a systematic and effective manner of a variety of obstacles in making the transition to school systems operated in accordance with the constitutional principles enunciated in 347 U.S. 483, 497; but the vitality of these constitutional principles cannot be allowed to yield simply because of disagreement with them. P. 300.

(g) While giving weight to these public and private considerations, the courts will require that the defendants make a prompt and reasonable start toward full compliance with the ruling of this Court. P. 300.

(h) Once such a start has been made, the courts may find that additional time is necessary to carry out the ruling in an effective manner. P. 300.

(i) The burden rests on the defendants to establish that additional time is necessary in the public interest and is consistent with good faith compliance at the earliest practicable date. P. 300.

(j) The courts may consider problems related to administration, arising from the physical condition of the school plant, the school transportation system, personnel, revision of school districts and attendance areas into compact units to achieve a system of determining admission to the public schools on a nonracial basis, and revision of local laws and regulations which may be necessary in solving the foregoing problems. Pp. 300-301.

(k) The courts will also consider the adequacy of any plans the defendants may propose to meet these problems and to effectuate a transition to a racially nondiscriminatory school system. P. 301.

(l) During the period of transition, the courts will retain jurisdiction of these cases. P. 301.

3. The judgment in the Delaware case, ordering the immediate admission of the plaintiffs to schools previously attended only by white children, is affirmed on the basis of the principles stated by this Court in its opinion, 347 U.S. 483; but the case is remanded to the Supreme Court of Delaware for such further proceedings as that Court may deem necessary in the light of this opinion. P. 301.
98 F. Supp. 797, 103 F. Supp. 920, 103 F. Supp. 337 and judgment in No. 4, reversed and remanded.

91 A. 2d 137, affirmed and remanded.

[ Footnote *] Together with No. 2, Briggs et al. v. Elliott et al., on appeal from the United States District Court for the Eastern District of South Carolina; No. 3, Davis et al. v. County School Board of Prince Edward County, Virginia, et al., on appeal from the United States District Court for the Eastern District of Virginia; No. 4, Bolling et al. v. Sharpe et al., on certiorari to the United States Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit; and No. 5, Gebhart et al. v. Belton et al., on certiorari to the Supreme Court of Delaware. [349 U.S. 294, 296]

Robert L. Carter argued the cause for appellants in No. 1. Spottswood W. Robinson, III, argued the causes for appellants in Nos. 2 and 3. George E. C. Hayes and James M. Nabrit, Jr. argued the cause for petitioners in No. 4. Louis L. Redding argued the cause for respondents in No. 5. Thurgood Marshall argued the causes for appellants in Nos. 1, 2 and 3, petitioners in No. 4 and respondents in No. 5.

On the briefs were Harold Boulware, Robert L. Carter, Jack Greenberg, Oliver W. Hill, Thurgood Marshall, Louis L. Redding, Spottswood W. Robinson, III, Charles S. Scott, William T. Coleman, Jr., Charles T. Duncan, George E. C. Hayes, Loren Miller, William R. Ming, Jr., Constance Baker Motley, James M. Nabrit, Jr., Louis H. Pollak and Frank D. Reeves for appellants in Nos. 1, 2 and 3, and respondents in No. 5; and George E. C. Hayes, James M. Nabrit, Jr., George M. Johnson, Charles W. Quick, Herbert O. Reid, Thurgood Marshall and Robert L. Carter for petitioners in No. 4.

Harold R. Fatzer, Attorney General of Kansas, argued the cause for appellees in No. 1. With him on the brief was Paul E. Wilson, Assistant Attorney General. Peter F. Caldwell filed a brief for the Board of Education of Topeka, Kansas, appellee.

S. E. Rogers and Robert McC. Figg, Jr. argued the cause and filed a brief for appellees in No. 2.

J. Lindsay Almond, Jr., Attorney General of Virginia, and Archibald G. Robertson argued the cause for appellees in No. 3. With them on the brief were Henry T. Wickham, Special Assistant to the Attorney General, T. Justin Moore, John W. Riely and T. Justin Moore, Jr.

Milton D. Korman argued the cause for respondents in No. 4. With him on the brief were Vernon E. West, Chester H. Gray and Lyman J. Umstead. [349 U.S. 294, 297]

Joseph Donald Craven, Attorney General of Delaware, argued the cause for petitioners in No. 5. On the brief were H. Albert Young, then Attorney General, Clarence W. Taylor, Deputy Attorney General, and Andrew D. Christie, Special Deputy to the Attorney General.

In response to the Court's invitation, 347 U.S. 483, 495-496, Solicitor General Sobeloff participated in the oral argument for the United States. With him on the brief were Attorney General Brownell, Assistant Attorney General Rankin, Philip Elman, Ralph S. Spritzer and Alan S. Rosenthal.

By invitation of the Court, 347 U.S. 483, 496, the following State officials presented their views orally as amici curiae: Thomas J. Gentry, Attorney General of Arkansas, with whom on the brief were James L. Sloan, Assistant Attorney General, and Richard B. McCulloch, Special Assistant Attorney General. Richard W. Ervin, Attorney General of Florida, and Ralph E. Odum, Assistant Attorney General, both of whom were also on a brief. C. Ferdinand Sybert, Attorney General of Maryland, with whom on the brief were Edward D. E. Rollins, then Attorney General, W. Giles Parker, Assistant Attorney General, and James H. Norris, Jr., Special Assistant Attorney General. I. Beverly Lake, Assistant Attorney General of North Carolina, with whom on the brief were Harry McMullan, Attorney General, and T. Wade Bruton, Ralph Moody and Claude L. Love, Assistant Attorneys General. Mac Q. Williamson, Attorney General of Oklahoma, who also filed a brief. John Ben Shepperd, Attorney General of Texas, and Burnell Waldrep, Assistant Attorney General, with whom on the brief were Billy E. Lee, J. A. Amis, Jr., L. P. Lollar, J. Fred Jones, John Davenport, John Reeves and Will Davis.

Phineas Indritz filed a brief for the American Veterans Committee, Inc., as amicus curiae. [349 U.S. 294, 298]

MR. CHIEF JUSTICE WARREN delivered the opinion of the Court.

These cases were decided on May 17, 1954. The opinions of that date, 1 declaring the fundamental principle that racial discrimination in public education is unconstitutional, are incorporated herein by reference. All provisions of federal, state, or local law requiring or permitting such discrimination must yield to this principle. There remains for consideration the manner in which relief is to be accorded.

Because these cases arose under different local conditions and their disposition will involve a variety of local problems, we requested further argument on the question of relief. 2 In view of the nationwide importance of the decision, we invited the Attorney General of the United [349 U.S. 294, 299] States and the Attorneys General of all states requiring or permitting racial discrimination in public education to present their views on that question. The parties, the United States, and the States of Florida, North Carolina, Arkansas, Oklahoma, Maryland, and Texas filed briefs and participated in the oral argument.

These presentations were informative and helpful to the Court in its consideration of the complexities arising from the transition to a system of public education freed of racial discrimination. The presentations also demonstrated that substantial steps to eliminate racial discrimination in public schools have already been taken, not only in some of the communities in which these cases arose, but in some of the states appearing as amici curiae, and in other states as well. Substantial progress has been made in the District of Columbia and in the communities in Kansas and Delaware involved in this litigation. The defendants in the cases coming to us from South Carolina and Virginia are awaiting the decision of this Court concerning relief.

Full implementation of these constitutional principles may require solution of varied local school problems. School authorities have the primary responsibility for elucidating, assessing, and solving these problems; courts will have to consider whether the action of school authorities constitutes good faith implementation of the governing constitutional principles. Because of their proximity to local conditions and the possible need for further hearings, the courts which originally heard these cases can best perform this judicial appraisal. Accordingly, we believe it appropriate to remand the cases to those courts. 3 [349 U.S. 294, 300]

In fashioning and effectuating the decrees, the courts will be guided by equitable principles. Traditionally, equity has been characterized by a practical flexibility in shaping its remedies 4 and by a facility for adjusting and reconciling public and private needs. 5 These cases call for the exercise of these traditional attributes of equity power. At stake is the personal interest of the plaintiffs in admission to public schools as soon as practicable on a nondiscriminatory basis. To effectuate this interest may call for elimination of a variety of obstacles in making the transition to school systems operated in accordance with the constitutional principles set forth in our May 17, 1954, decision. Courts of equity may properly take into account the public interest in the elimination of such obstacles in a systematic and effective manner. But it should go without saying that the vitality of these constitutional principles cannot be allowed to yield simply because of disagreement with them.

While giving weight to these public and private considerations, the courts will require that the defendants make a prompt and reasonable start toward full compliance with our May 17, 1954, ruling. Once such a start has been made, the courts may find that additional time is necessary to carry out the ruling in an effective manner. The burden rests upon the defendants to establish that such time is necessary in the public interest and is consistent with good faith compliance at the earliest practicable date. To that end, the courts may consider problems related to administration, arising from the physical condition of the school plant, the school transportation system, personnel, revision of school districts and attendance areas into compact units to achieve a system of determining admission to the public schools [349 U.S. 294, 301] on a nonracial basis, and revision of local laws and regulations which may be necessary in solving the foregoing problems. They will also consider the adequacy of any plans the defendants may propose to meet these problems and to effectuate a transition to a racially nondiscriminatory school system. During this period of transition, the courts will retain jurisdiction of these cases.

The judgments below, except that in the Delaware case, are accordingly reversed and the cases are remanded to the District Courts to take such proceedings and enter such orders and decrees consistent with this opinion as are necessary and proper to admit to public schools on a racially nondiscriminatory basis with all deliberate speed the parties to these cases. The judgment in the Delaware case - ordering the immediate admission of the plaintiffs to schools previously attended only by white children - is affirmed on the basis of the principles stated in our May 17, 1954, opinion, but the case is remanded to the Supreme Court of Delaware for such further proceedings as that Court may deem necessary in light of this opinion.

It is so ordered.

Footnotes
[ Footnote 1] 347 U.S. 483; 347 U.S. 497.

[ Footnote 2] Further argument was requested on the following questions, 347 U.S. 483, 495-496, n. 13, previously propounded by the Court: "4. Assuming it is decided that segregation in public schools violates the Fourteenth Amendment "(a) would a decree necessarily follow providing that, within the limits set by normal geographic school districting, Negro children should forthwith be admitted to schools of their choice, or "(b) may this Court, in the exercise of its equity powers, permit an effective gradual adjustment to be brought about from existing segregated systems to a system not based on color distinctions? "5. On the assumption on which questions 4 (a) and (b) are based, and assuming further that this Court will exercise its equity powers to the end described in question 4 (b), "(a) should this Court formulate detailed decrees in these cases; "(b) if so, what specific issues should the decrees reach; "(c) should this Court appoint a special master to hear evidence with a view to recommending specific terms for such decrees; "(d) should this Court remand to the courts of first instance with directions to frame decrees in these cases, and if so what general directions should the decrees of this Court include and what procedures should the courts of first instance follow in arriving at the specific terms of more detailed decrees?"

[ Footnote 3] The cases coming to us from Kansas, South Carolina, and Virginia were originally heard by three-judge District Courts convened under 28 U.S.C. 2281 and 2284. These cases will accordingly be remanded to those three-judge courts. See Briggs v. Elliott, 342 U.S. 350.

[ Footnote 4] See Alexander v. Hillman, 296 U.S. 222, 239.

[ Footnote 5] See Hecht Co. v. Bowles, 321 U.S. 321, 329-330. [349 U.S. 294, 302]

A little bit of humor,..
A coded message was delivered directly to the oval office,.. the courier stated it was from
Osama Bin Ladin, and to be handed immediately to George Bush. Below is the message he received :

==================
370HSSV - 0773H
==================

pResident bush read it but it was a jumble of letters and numbers, but he could not decipher the code. He then sent it to cheney, again it was meaningless he could not break the code. cheney then sent it to the FBI, they could not decipher it,.. then the CIA, NSA, Rumsfeld's DIA, no one could break the code. It was sent to England, MI-6, again nothing. Out of desperation it was then sent on to Israel's Mossad, about two minutes later a message came in to the oval office, it stated,

Dear President Bush:
To decode the Osama message, turn it upside down.

Respectfully,
Israeli's Mossad

I really miss RLM. He brought sanity to this blog. How can we get him back?

WP, you have his e-mail address. Tell him what has been written on this open thread.

RLM said he was working on the Lamont Campaign. With that success maybe he threw himself heart and soul into the fight. I too hope he is OK. I like his well reasoned posts and historical perspective. He is one smart and reasonable guy and I miss him. YooHoo Robert, Where are you?

Dredd

That was seriously, seriously rude, and completely unwarranted. If you ask me, your ego was on long before you declared it here, and it's ugly, not fit for the commons. Pull yourself together.

TruthSeeker and everyone else: re 118 and many previous comments:

I've written to RLM and sent links to many of your comments. He wrote back to say thanks to all. His focus has shifted a bit, as some of you may have speculated.

Bob's working for Ned. Think globally, act locally. Right?

Best wishes to RLM --- who will always be welcome here unless I'm reading it way wrong --- and best wishes to Ned too.

It's tough to get something good happening on more than one blog at a time; another former regular --- a guy we haven't heard from in a long time --- is working for Clint.

Agent99 #111

I found this one but it's still not the one I was lookin for.

Winter Patriot

I was going to take everyone on a historical fantasy ride and post James Michener's Hawaii here, but after 733 pages it crashed my computer.

Do you think it will work if I do it in 2 posts?

Go RLM and go Ned!

Oh no, where's Joan? (Just kidding)

Not to say I haven't missed her sensible posts the last week or so.

Bluebear2 # 94

Thanks for clarifying what little my old worn out memory held regarding RLM and the question of his absence.

WP # 121

Good news indeed that RLM is alive and kicking out there someplace. Hope he finds the time on occasion to return to the fold with his welcome missives. Many moons ago, I did suggest to him that he should run for president.....I'm still of the same opinion and will add to that by saying that you'd make a good VP, WP....

Larry # 100

You will be missed here also once you get back into the working world. Maybe you should join RLM and WP on the ballot and you can have Rumsfeld's title.........wow, what a team you 3 would make...!!! Your country would be back to its glory days again in no time flat.

Can't leave without commenting on El Chimpo's latest TV appearance. When WILL someone tell him that he should quit with the speeches......he continues to prove what an complete idiot he really is.....plus, it's always the same yadda, yadda, yadda....the mouth is moving but there's nothing of substance coming out..!!

I thought these were the Patriot family portraits,..

Link,.... Link.

Or am I mistaken ?

Washington envoy to Canada. Paul Celluci told a Canadian audience that Flight # 93 was shot-down over Pennsylvania,.. by a military fighter jet.

Forgot the link to the above,..

Flight # 93 shot-down link

Mar #127

Thanks for that, but if I ever tried to run for high office, my entire extended family would throw a press conference and expose me as a danger to the country.

Life is so unfair.

Glad to know Robert Lockwood Mills is working on a good cause. Boy is Lieberman going to be angry if he succeeds.

Just kidding about life being unfair above. I grew up in a great country, in a great time of hope. Who knows, it may come back with a vengence!

I just love open threads, means nothing is really "off topic" - but I'll go ahead and give an "OFF TOPIC ALERT" anyway, for those of y'all who are in serious political discussion mode today (I'm not, I needed a break)

Thanks to all who contributed links for the harvest and winter photos. I'm a very visually oriented person, and the visual break has been like a mental massage to me. (I think I need to go watch "What the Bleep Do We Know? Down the Rabbit Hole" again)

Yesterday we had this liquid stuff falling down from the sky for awhile..I think we used to call it rain. It greened up the grass a bit and made all my plants perk up (except for the ones the wind blew over), and the bold streaks of lightning and the thunder echoing between the mountains and through the valley before the storms was SPECTACULAR.

More storms are expected today, and there's a cold front moving in - rumor is that the mercury may not even hit 90 today. How great is that!

I love the hills of Tennessee..but if anyone hears of a good deal on a few acres of land somewhere north of here, where they have a lot of trees and mountains and four real seasons and the grass doesn't need cutting during at least two of them, PLEASE let me know.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled blogging.

Whatever happened with Busby & McKinney?

Re: Busby/Bilbray - Last I heard, Bilbray's serving, but a Superior Court judge was scheduled to hear the case sometime before Labor Day. Is that still on?

Re: McKinney - I think she conceded the election.

Hail,... Hail,.... The gang is all here,..

Bu$$hco at the Hague,.. the whole bunch of 'em.

Photo Link

FINALLY

Larry # 132

You said....."I grew up in a great country, in a great time of hope. Who knows, it may come back with a vengence!"

I hope with all my heart that your country DOES come back with a vengence, and real soon. You are all WAY overdue.

And in the meantime, my dream of moving to Arizona is on hold, and I'm not getting any younger.....sniff, sniff...!!! Darn.....how come I can never find a handkie when I need one....

ITMFA ... !!!

Poor Latin American guards are brought to Afghanistan and Iraq by American independent contractor security firms. The cost is often 1/10th less than using USA personnel. Should people from third world countries be exploited and used as cheap mercenaries soldiers in a war or military occupied zone ?

Link to Reuter's Article

Impartiality of Mexico's election court now comes into serious question of being contaminated with political influences.

A source in Mexico's intelligence services told the World in an interview that four of the seven judges on the tribunal "respond to the interests of Calderon."
In addition, the government of President Vicente Fox was able to pressure the tribunal into not ordering a full vote recount, telling judges that their careers would go nowhere if they made the wrong decision. Six of the seven judges are set to retire from the tribunal next year, their terms coming to an end, said the source.

Source/Detailed Article : Link

The National Republican Party by proxy of Sproul Associates by proxy of Liberty Consultants are out in force 2006 to disenfranchise potential Democratic Party voters by registering these voters to allow them to vote but then illegally trashing these valid voter registration cards and not properly filing them. On election day the the Demos find their vote is invalid. Beware of the illegal conduct of these Republican groups to tamper with the election process. Tennessee,.. California,.. Nevada these criminals are active in your states trying to toss the midterm 2006 election illegally in favor of the Republican Party.

================

Liberty Consultants wanted to register Wal-Mart shoppers in seven traditionally Republican suburban counties around Nashville. But the request was denied after the company's owner, Gary Thompson, acknowledged to Wal-Mart that he had been hired by Tempe, Ariz.-based Sproul & Associates.

Headed by Nathan Sproul, a former Christian Coalition activist and executive director of the Arizona GOP, Sproul & Associates was paid $7.9 million by the Republican National Committee for consulting and voter registration drives in the 2004 election cycle, according to data compiled by the Center for Responsive Politics.

Sproul's canvassers focused on signing up Republican voters in key battleground states in 2004. Former canvassers came forward in West Virginia, Pennsylvania, Nevada and Oregon to say they were told to register only Republicans and to walk away from people who said they intended to vote for Democrat John Kerry. Some said completed Democratic registration forms were thrown out or ripped up.

Source to above/Thx Raw Story Info/details,..Link

Hi guys,
In honor of her must-see tv appearance coming up in a few days, (the "Darwin's Deadly Legacy" thing") I just had to share this little bit of bizarro nonsense: apparently there's a relative of mAnn's in the San Francisco Zoo. At least, they share the name Coulter. And there DOES seem to be a certain family resemblance. But...I report, you decide!
link

I don't know if many people will see this, this thread is really getting long, but I don't want to off topic any other thread so, New WTC Complex Photos highlight Bizarre Building 7 Collapse. http://www.prisonplanet....006/230806wtccomplex.htm

The State of Maine , Public Utilities Commission asks Verizon to produce a sworn statement that they did not violate the privacy of Maine citizens by handing over customers private telephone calling patterns to NSA without a warrant.

The US DoJ immediately intervenes with a lawsuit to stop Verizon from producing that requested sworn statement proving that it did not violate the privacy of its customers. The DoJ contending it would violate national security interests,.. if Verizon was to provide that sworn statement.

Newspaper article link

The clash of Fascism and Democracy continues.

Joan,..

Commonality the horse and mAnn Coulter,..

Horses Ass,..

The horse has one,.. Coulter is one.

The front plumbing instrument maybe near identical too.

Joan #141 - Hehehehehehehehehe . . .