I'd stumbled across this via BlogsNow, found your past stories via Google, and was almost done with my post (full of links back to your March stories) when I found that you'd beat me to the draw. Still, it's a great story, and thanks for all the info!

In a quirk of the internets, I was offered up the full domain registration info, including Mr. Dyke, of which I have a screenshot in my post.

I also noted that the mailing address for ACVR is Lathrop & Gage's DC office.

I called and asked for the Newsdesk. A very nice lady answered and I said I had some concerns about a story I saw on the website.

I explained that the ACVR is a front group for conservatives - Mark Thor was in the Reagan White House and Jim Dyke was the Communications Director for the Republican National Committee.

Far from being non-partisan, like the ACVR claims, it's a very partisan group and they only targeted liberal organizations in their report.

I mentioned all that and thanked her and she seemed to actually care (though it may be wishful thinking on my part).

Brad,

Our dear, old friends at CNS news (syndicated at gopusa.com, covered it, as well.

Wait, so because the ACVR report doesn't include the claims you wish to highlight, the entire report is phony?

The report doesn't appear to be challenged at all on this weblog. The only thing challenged is the source of the report. It's Republicans so it must be false.

Make your case. But simply stating the report doesn't have all your caveats doesn't do anything to discredit the facts of the ACVR report.

Less fury, more patience. I know the rage brings in readers as the market is pretty stacked with left wing venom, but even readers from the right will come to appreciate honest scrutiny.

So ACVR is staffed with Republicans. SO WHAT?

Observor:

So WHAT?

Do you think republicans are honest? The leadership of the republican party is the most dishonest and corrupt fools anyone's ever seen!!!

How could anything they are saying be HONEST? For that matter, how could the democratic leadership council be HONEST?

Wake up and smell the coffee!!!! They are part of the same corruption, and are taking **limited reports** of democrats linining up at the polls with false names to make VOTER FRAUD be the problem!!!!

The whole problem is insecure corrupted voting machines, and partisan BOE officers!!!! They are who is altering results, and doing election fraud and also taking Diebold bribes. They are who controls the vote counting and counts things in secret!!!

Whatever amount of democrat voter fraud is found to offset it, THAT **doesn't even come close to** secret counting of the votes by board of electors who are fascist. NO ONE trusts this dishonest process!!!

Doug E.

Heavy on conjecture weak on evidence there Brad.

Doug Eldritch: Great job there. You have an issue with the machines. Get in line. But machines are not an excuse to discredit other forms of voter fraud. Fraud is fraud and the honest voter is disenfranshised by any form of fraud. One mistake and one person that waited in line, voted, was disenfranchised because of that mistake.

We should focus on voter fraud as a whole, but trying to use machines to color other forms of voter fraud isn't helping the problem.

THAT doesn't even come close to secret counting of the votes by board of electors who are fascist.

Who let you out of the hospital? If the BoE is a bunch of fascists then why are they even counting the ballots? Stop drinking the fool-aid.

Observer:

You need to wake up and read the news buddy!!

http://www.rawstory.com

Bernadette Noe and a group of Diebold mafia thugs discarded ballots, and patched the optical scan machines!

You don't think that's fascist?!??? You don't think the fact they drained 300 million from the workers comp fund, is fascist?!???

You don't think the fact that Clermont county workers, discarded ballots in secret and affixed stickers is fascist?!???

Get a brain!!!! Democratic voter fraud is not even **close** to the problem of BOE workers counting votes in secret.

Doug E.

Doug,

Anything new on those indictments?

I searched everywhere I could for more information to no avail.

Perhaps I am to excited and it is a much longer process than I thought.

Any idea on the process of releasing an indictment and how long that usually takes?

Charlie

Mark - Nice work on that story! I'll try to add it as an update shortly!

Observer & Traderrob - Perhaps, like your wingnut brethren, you failed to read the scores and scores of pages available via https://BradBlog.com/ACVR

...or even posted here yesterday showing just one or two of the incidents that the ACVR sham report must have "forgotten" to mention.

In the meantime, they label isolated incidents of "Voter Registration" malfeasance as "Election Fraud" and fail to document a single fraudulent vote that occured in the process.

You may keep your collective heads in the sand as long as you like, and apologize for your lying GOP operative friends. It's only your own democracy at stake. It's up to you.

Charlie: Lets hope they do go public with it. The prosecutors office will not comment on any indictments, I also called them to see when they might say something. It could be a long week.

By the way anyone who wants to should call them as well.

Doug E.

Hi, Observer - (1) Don't you have a problem with Republican operatives pretending to be non-partisan and then writing a report solely about fraud purportedly carried out only by Dems? If they are Republican operatives, they are NOT non-partisan. Please research these people first, then try to tell us they are not being partisan. (2) The goal of ACVR is to get voter ID's which will do little or nothing to prevent the existing vote fraud and election stealing. (3) If they are non-partisan, they should have included purportedly frauds carried out by BOTH parties. (4) Do you really want to know and find out the truth? Or are you here just to get (negative) attention like some others? Or were you bored? In any event, life is not about opinions. Life is about reality...get with it.

The whole purpose of the ACVR and Carter commission, is to **mandate** Photo IDs and disenfranchise as many voters as possible.

Its come to this. These people are completely corrupt, the evil stinks to high heaven, and they think the people of the United States does not see how bad the GOP leadership is. How wrong they are and how wrong they are along with the DLC.

The american people are waking up, you fascist leaders in both parties. Will the revolution be televised, I sure as hell hope so!

Doug E.

The story's still up at The Washington Times.

Hi, Doug - I was so excited yesterday about the big "I" word...but maybe it won't happen...will be extremely disappointed...

Hey Blowhard,

Rather than your worthless opinion that the ACVR report is a sham, how about FACTS? I know that's something you libs have an aversion to, but facts do matter. And the fact is that the ACVR has Democrats as members as well --- Brian Lunde ring a bell? And the incidents of voter fraud on the Democrats side are documented to have actually happened. It's real easy to call names and it appears you are very good at it like most liberal blowhards. But put your money where your mouth is and REFUTE the report with FACTS.

Doug, I hope you are right about the indightments, but the flocco website looks like craap to me (the kind of craap I like since I like conspiracy theories, admittedly).

I'm glad to see that so far the MSM don't seem to be flogging the new report in contrast to the way they have failed to flog any Stolen Election stuff that I can recall.

Ok I just lost it in my email. I felt like Mike Malloy.

Steve "jackass" if you followed things you would have the "facts". ACVR is a sham and that was already previously reported and proven here.

Was great timing for the Hackett election. I just love how they plan "when" to release things. Not.

Flocco is not the original source though, so when at least three people are reporting the same thing it deserves to be watched.

We'll just have to wait and see I suppose, since their office refuses to comment on the matter. This could be why they are leaving the state fast (Read: Cheney and Bush on long time vacation all of a sudden...)

The Chicago terrorist threat on Fitzgerald was apparently real. They had a bomb threat in CHicago, police denied it happened but it did. Was it directed at the prosecutor...Could be why there is silence.

Doug E.

Peggy: Yes. I came here for attention. Grow up.

No, I don't care that ACVR is staffed by former legal staff members of the Bush/Cheney 04 campaign. In fact, I'm glad those lawyers didn't just stop doing vital work after the election was over. Bush won and these lawyers are still concerned about fraud.

However, as I mentioned in my first post, Brad thinks that the whole report is phony because it doesn't include the instances of voter fraud that Brad wants to get attention. Tough luck. Do an investigation. Clearly it's not hard to get attention as ACVR only took a week to get an invitation to a Congressional Hearing and six months to put out a report.

If the goal is voter id then why is the American Prospect clearing its pages for contributors to make the case for voter IDs? Is the Prospect in the pocket of the RNC?

Brad: I did read your trove of information. I hadn't even heard of the ACVR until a friend linked me to your blog. What I asked you earlier was "So what?". The ACVR is reporting stuff you don't like? That doesn't seem to be it. The problem you have is that ACVR was started by Republicans. Run away!

The information from ACVR is a fraud.

The entire organization is located in a Post Office Box, in Texas near Tom DeLay. It is a front group for the GOP.

Why don't they even have a real building, and why hide it? Because they are a phony front group.

Bush lost the election and that's a fact now. Bernadette Noe helped them steal for Bush, and the GOP flat out lost and stole votes.

Click on me to see more of this finaggling in action. This kind of unprecedented sham is what will ruin voting.

American Prospect and others got duped by these liars, Photo IDs will disenfranchise millions. Just the way the GOP wants it.

Doug E.

Steve Jackass and Observer - you guys sound like the kind of nutz who step over $1,000 to pick up a penny.

Observer, you got your attention. We are not buying your and ACVR's crap. America will eventually get rid of it...better sooner than later.

Observer sounds like that guy some time ago who was interested in getting into the business of creating/selling government ID's and MAKING MONEY. If so, no wonder he's pissed at us...

incidents of "Voter Registration" malfeasance as "Election Fraud"

Fraud is fraud my friend and labeling it registration malfeasance doesn't make it smell any better or any less illegal. I will agree that Hogenson and Dyke's involvement warrants greater scrutiny.
This alone however does not prove bias nor disqualify them from being impartial. Are there Democrats involved with this group as well? Untill there is a full accounting of everone involved it's speculation. If it is a front group, I'll be the first to admit and report it, but I'll reserve my judgements untill the facts are in. One would hope you would do the same.

oh and btw that's Mr Wingnut.

Mr. Wingnut,

It's time to wake up and get pissed. The republicans are all getting disenfranchised now too, the only ones who they see shall be elected is neocons.

This proves the ACVR is a front group:
https://bradblog.com/archives/00001298.htm

Brian Lunde is a corrupt democrat, who got bought off by Karl Rove as soon as the 2000 election was over. He went to the establishment, now he's in the pocket of the neocon fascists and thats bottom line.

You have to get furious and get armed, get ready to take to the streets. That is the only way the fair voting will come back, and it is the only way there will be balance again.

I guarantee you this is the truth. The only way that these elections are happening anymore is through stealing, I wouldn't be surprised to find out DLC Democrat Evan Bayh stole his last three seats. I wouldn't be surprised at all.

Either you fight for civil rights or watch them evaporate, the choice is up to you. We made our choice.

Doug E.

TreaderRob or Mr. Wingnut, if you like - frankly, I find people like you and Observer, who come here without having done any research, and with no honest interest in the facts, and spout your uninformed prejudiced opinions, and tell us we have to educate you or convince you, TIRESOME. You are not interesting, or clever...just TIRESOME. 99% of the time I skip past your entries without reading them. If you are pleased with yourselves, I am happy for you. Now, excuse me while I ignore you.

Doug, anger impairs judgment and blind anger obliterates it.

I don't need to get furious to be motivated. My call to action will be based on facts not conjecture or fervent speculation masquerading as undeniable truth.

I am not as convinced that the sun will rise in the east tommorrow as you are in rampant election fraud. Being that dead sure of anything is not only suspect, it's scary.

Construct your conspiracy theories if you must, but make sure you're not building them on a foundation of clay.

One thing I'll never get over about the coward we have in the white house.

Why did he turn his back on the report a month before the towers fell, especially since Bill Clinton told him that Osama was the number one threat to America the day he left our country in the hands of the coward?

A buddy of mine says Busch received those reports all the time, so he wasn't worried. However, I had I been in the kings chair when that report came across my chair, I would have put the airlines on notice.

And the first footnote in the "nonpartisan" 911 commission report tells me that at the very least Atta would never have boarded the plane.

God Bless America
God Damn the GOP

Mr. Wingnut TraderRob, you can't prove who won or lost the 2004 election because you cannot verify any of the votes tallied in secrecy by the electronic machines. No business in this country (or across the globe, for that matter) is stupid enough to rely on unauditable accounting procedures - which, by the way are what we have with these so-called "black box voting" machines.

It would be helpful if YOU did some real research.

Good post, Moose. I'd like to add something that made my BS-meter go sky-high:

It had been widely publicized where busch was going to be the morning of 9/11 - in a classroom with children. When the 2nd plane hit and it was apparent to everyone (including the worm who calls himself "president") the first incident was no accident AND the SS wanted to whisk him away for fear he would be a target ... busch waved them back so he could sit in silence in the classroom with the children for - at least - 15 minutes.

BUSCH MADE THOSE CHILDREN TERRORIST TARGETS (if you believe he didn't know there was no real danger to him from terrorists.)

How do you bu$h believers get around that?

Too late for that TraderRob, you need to get motivated.

The election fraud is a reality and you **CAN NOT** deny it or hide from it either as it will affect your life severely soon.

http://www.votersunite.org

http://toledoblade.com/a...20050803/NEWS24/50803006

Raw Story on Ms. Noe's Own Scandal

These are the people who are counting the votes, dishonest workers who have great interest in racketeering and conducting illegal wars continually the world over.

Did you realize that they used Diebold and conveniently lost over 50% of the optical scan ballots? They also patched the machines, and under Blackwell's orders **lost** ballots.

When it happens again and again, and the election fraud is blatant and obvious its time to get on the bandwagon. You DO need to get angry. The only thing that will put the republican leadership in check, is when all the real republicans DO get angry enough.

Because they have been disenfranchising everyone and continually electing radicals like Schmidt, and have every intention of making it worse too.

Doug E.

Kira, if Kerry had one wouldn't the situation be exactly the same? And if so would you feel the same way?

TraderRob --- I'm not sure what you mean by having "one." Care to clarify? And, really --- why are you obfuscating by talking about Kerry?

Care to answer my question about the children?

sorry, trying to write an article and post comments at the same time one = won

Kerry did win the 2004 election.

If John Kerry had won by the election fraud, everyone would be taking to the streets to denounce him too. Kerry is a part of the establishment, the whole corruption is out of control.

Kerry should have fought for voters but he rolled over like a log. Just another official hack. In fact, had John Kerry committed election fraud I bet there would be so much outcry it would hit the national news 24/7.

I can see it now, every single member would be all over it and Rush Limbaugh would devour him. But at least by that point, the whole system would be reformed. But we the people have to reform it, NOT anyone else!!!

The establishment must fall.

Doug E.

Thanks for clarifying TR #34 --- I'm waiting to hear your response about the children bu$h put in harm's way by refusing to leave the school on 9/11.

Oh were to post this!?

This is off this thread, but I see there is no action today at sunday's open thread and this is so scary that I need to get other's opinions if this is for real.

From American Free Press:

http://www.americanfreep....net/html/nuke_iran.html

"A number of political observers and activists today sounded “a red alert” after allegations surfaced this week that Vice President Dick Cheney has ordered Strategic Command (STRATCOM) to make contingency plans for a nuclear strike against Iran in the aftermath of another “9-11 type attack” on the United States."

“Vice President Cheney’s office has specifically told the Pentagon that the military should be prepared for an attack on Iran in the immediate aftermath of ‘another 9-11.’ ”

“Vice President Dick Cheney, with the full collusion of the circles of British Prime Minister Tony Blair unleashed the recently exposed plans to stage a preemptive tactical nuclear strike against Iran.

Oh my God - is this for real?

** Howard Dean and company discussing fraud **

http://www.democraticund...address=132×1982692

"Susie Turnbull posted at Kos."

No doubt there was fraud in election.....but are they going to fight?

Doug E.

I was not obfuscating, This thread has been concentrating on election fraud and the ACVR report so was limiting my commments to that. Also, I found the assertion you offered so beyond the pale as to be unworthy of comment, but if you insist.

Any belief that Bush, anyone in his administration or for that matter anyone in either party knew in advance of the 9-11 attack is ludicrous, the height of self delusional, conspiratorial nonsense.

He didn't want to run out of the classroom in a panic and traumatize the kids is his explanation. Maybe so, frankly I think he was in shock and he took those few minutes (and it was 4-5 minutes not 15 )to collect his thoughts and solidify his composure.

I am no expert in human nature, but that look on Bush's face said it all. It was a look of mental anguish and shock. It was a look that I would expect from anyone in his position ie Bill Clinton, Kerry, Gore, had they been sitting there. Your hate for Bush has clouded your judgement to the point of incoherence.

I despised Bill Clinton as much as anyone could I suppose. I thought of him as a liar and a cheat but never in my wildest fantasies would I have conjured up a scenario like you have here. In order to believe what you do one has to believe that Bush and several people in his administration conspired to commit mass murder.

There is nobody at any level in either party who is capable of that barring some massive mental breakdown. Your hatred of the man has made rational thought elusive. You may certainly disagree and despise every policy Bush has proposed, and be royally pissed at him for it. But to accuse someone....anyone with such a agregious evil is not only delusional it's criminal.

** "There is nobody at any level in either party who is capable of that barring some massive mental breakdown." **

You're wrong, there completely is evidence and precedent for this.

There is such a man: He is called Dick Cheney. The sooner you wake up to the fact your party leadership is absolutely corrupt, and have committed acts of treason, the sooner they can be driven from power.

Read all the reports, there is precedence for every bit of the 9/11 coverup:

http://www.yourbbsucks.c...um/showthread.php?t=3619

Even if Bush was just a pawn, he still willingly allowed these traitors to enact a plan of total subterfuge. John Bolton is in the U.N to start Cheney's war against Iran, plain and simple. Not even the corrupt admins believe in Cheney's plan.

But Cheney is intent on carrying it out, if the **GROUP** is not stopped. They are without question, totaltarian dictators.

Doug E.

Hi, Bluebear2 - Bushco will be moving U.S. troops out of Iraq - could that be because Bush/Cheney are going to drop nuclear bombs on Iran? Are they insane enough to do this? YES. They are insane, and murderous, without any doubt!

Doug E, with all due respect you need to get your news from sources other than just Rawstory, DU, VotersUnite, Kos and even Bradblog. Just as I must not get all my news from Newsmax, FreeRepublic,CNS and MediaWatch.

If your looking for nothing more than to reinforce your preconcieved notions and cheerlead your single minded beliefs your probably content. If however your looking to get at the truth, elusive as it almost certainly is, open your mind and your reading list.

TraderRob #39

Funny how you accused Doug of what you just did in your comment #28 --- "Doug, anger impairs judgment and blind anger obliterates it. I don't need to get furious to be motivated. My call to action will be based on facts not conjecture or fervent speculation masquerading as undeniable truth." Well --- you sidled up to the bar, as they say.

You're very apologetic of the actions of bu$h on 9/11 when he waved the SS aside at the time they were trying to whisk him away.

You're funny. You think upsetting the children would be worse than making them targets of terrorists? You're either afraid to think or you're refusing to think.

No other president in the history of this country has ever acted with such disrespect for the citizens - and this particular incident is such an unfathomable action with callous disregard for innocent children is not acceptable.

If a person is going to be president, s/he must be strong enough to make decisions under times of attack. This one can't even move because, as you say in #39, "he was in shock and he took those few minutes (and it was 4-5 minutes not 15 )to collect his thoughts and solidify his composure." ???? Right-oh, old chap! Your argument is weak-weak-weak, just like bu$h.

Trader Rob:

I did not rely on those sources for any of this information. I got it from the "American **Conservative** " magazine which is one of the most conservative magazines ever written.

http://www.justinlogan.c.../07/what_is_the_pla.html

In it, Dick Cheney reveals his direct plan of orders to deploy nuclear weapons on Iran. This is not any tinfoil conspiracy.

This is really happening, in the event of another 9/11 which would be soon Iran will be nuked by the Vice President. The Pentagon and STRATCOM have the orders sitting on their desk.

Everyone disagrees with this act, but Cheney is going to fire the nuke button. He doesn't care anymore, and the downing street incidents has caused too much commotion.

Further, his NORAD strike was involved directly in allowing 9/11 and plotting for the New World Order.

Read Cheney's personal think-tank website and diaries which include all the Jewish and other Israeli neoconservatives worldwide.

http://www.newamericancentury.org

They call it PNAC, plain and simple. And they required a new pearl harbor event in order to get their world domination agenda. The point is, 9/11 terrorism was financed by associates of PNAC.

Now the project for new american century is front page news, as they are getting ready to wage the final war. A war against ALL who oppose them and then they will take every bit of oil over for themselves.

Pentagon officials have testified that Cheney, Wolfowitz and others knew that 9/11 would happen. They were conducting drills to get ready for it to happen, period.

Doug E

Bolton will not be able to bully or manipulate or bribe the U.N. countries into condoning nuking Iran. So, the only way Bush/Cheney/Israeli-extremists can do this will be by nuking the U.S., and then nuking Iran in return. You can be sure, any nuking in the U.S. will take place far from any of the neocons - unless they want to get rid of one of their own who is not cooperating and is now expendable. They learned that Americans and the world do not accept a first strike policy. So they have to arrange to be struck first...even if they do it themselves.

Kira, it scores on helluva lot higher on the plausibility meter than your scenario.

I gotta go, I've been neglecting my own blog to verbally spar with you all.

In all seriousness, I enjoyed going a round with you. It always gives me perspective to chat with the other end of the political spectrum although I dare say many of you are a bit further to the left than I am to the right.

Take care, look forward to having at it gain soon

TraderRob: You need to wake up to the truth here, regardless of how horrible it is. Thousands of lives are in danger and its not from terrorism.

It is from the eye of the beholder.

Don't put foolish trust in the fact John Bolton won't be able to force the U.N. to Nuke Iran, all Bolton has to do is prove Tehran and the fake evidence on Iran is important enough for war or passing the resolutions. United Nations be damned. Then right afterward, Cheney will order the nuclear strike to destroy Iran. Nucelar bombs back and forth, hello nuclear war.

Doug E.

If Cheney is permitted to nuke America, the Internet may well be shut down - at least semi-permanently. Would ham-radios work?

Hi Peggy, it sounds like it is for real. The last paragrph of the original article at American Conservative is very telling of the atmosphere in Washington these days:

"Several senior Air Force officers involved in the planning are reportedly appalled at the implications of what they are doing—that Iran is being set up for an unprovoked nuclear attack—but no one is prepared to damage his career by posing any objections."

WWIII vs Carrier. Hmmm which would you choose?

If this comes down it will be so hard to consider myself a part of a country that would do something like this. Hell it's hard enough with Iraq, this would just sinch it.

Will it be time to take up arms, or learn Kanook eh?

Amazing!

TraderRob #46 --- Really.

I guess it is about time you slithered back to your blog.

The mailing address for ACVR is Lathrop & Gage's DC office. This is the company Mark "Thor" F. Hearne works for.

His Bio page (to be found here: http://www.lathropgage.c...ple/bio.aspx?bioid=8185= has got some more juicy tidbits about his Republican past.

One of his recent professional accomplishments has been: "Counsel for Bush-Cheney-2000 in Bush-Cheney, 2000, Inc. v. Baker, 34 S.W.3d 410 (Mo. App, 2000), successful emergency appeal quashing Circuit Court order holding polls open beyond legal closing hour".

It's glaringly obvious that the radical regressives are getting very nervous and employing their tried and true propaganda tactics in full force. THEY OWN THE PRESS - of course msm is reporting it!!

If they truly felt it was but a few delusional, conspiracist bloggers out there that merited mocking, they wouldn't go to all the trouble of staging this kangaroo commission and it's predictable antics.

People are slowly waking up and the rovian operatives are going to be in full attack mode from now until their end days... which are coming. Let's just hope they don't take us all down with them...

Peggy #48 - good thought. We need a contingency plan to be able to contact each other in the event the Internet is shut down. I have emails for Kira, VG and Brad and am more than willing to share my phone # with any of them. The opposition knows our strength is our numbers and one way to stop us is to isolate us from each other.

Hi Jen,
Maybe Brad can set up a way for us to privately share our email addresses with others. I know other forums which have that feature. Just a thought.

Err Peggy, re #48, did you mean nuke [IRAN]
...........or are you privy to some DOUBLE SUPER- SECRET BACKGROUND intel from Dr Dick "Strangelove" Cheney?

If so, the space shuttle Discovery and international space station would be the safest place [not] on Earth!
........maybe 6 or 7 of us should borrow the spare shuttle!
Anyone know how to fly one of these things?

Kira #53 - If the internet is shut down we won't have emails... That's scary to think about... Seriously, it would be the most effective way for "them" to shut down our movement. I'll sleep on it and maybe will dream up a solution... or learn to fly a space shuttle!! Laters all.

By the way --- has anybody read the bullshit TraitorROB wrote on his site about the comments on this thread? He's so off-base it's funny. What's not funny is that he has wildly misrepresented what was said here and stated his reactionary assumptions and opinions as fact.

Talk about living in the Twilight Zone! He's definitely in over his head! Keep on spinning the lies traitorRob!

Oh, definitely, Jen, but the only way I'd feel comfortable sharing my home address would be after a private exchange of emails.

I'm afraid this is just the beginning of some very difficult times ahead.

Bushw@cker #54

Heh! Anybody know any Russian Cosmonauts? Where's Sputnik these days?

**REMEMBER THAT THEME WHEN YOU FEEL LIKE THE BUBBLE IS ABOUT TO BURST?**

I think it just happened......

""Edmonds reportedly added that the recordings contained repeated references to Hastert’s flip-flop in the fall of 200," Rose pens, "over an issue which remains of intense concern to the Turkish government—the continuing campaign to have Congress designate the killings of Armenians between 1915 and 1923 a genocide. For many years, attempts had been made to get the House to pass a genocide resolution, but they never got anywhere until August 2000, when Hastert, as Speaker, announced that he would give it his backing and see that it received a full House vote…Thanks to Hastert, the resolution, vehemently opposed by the Turks, passed… Then on October 19, minutes before the full House vote, Hastert withdrew it. He attributed it to a letter from President Clinton."
LINK

Sibel Edmonds whistle-blows on the 9/11 coverup artists.....Plus...

**US Attorney's office comments on Indictments!!!**

Citizen Spook has interviewed a representative of Randy Sanborn's office at the Dirksen Federal Courthouse in Chicago where the Fitzgerald investigation is headquartered. Randy Sanborn is the official spokesperson for the US Attorney's Office in the Northern District of Illinois. Sanborn is also the official spokesperson for Patrick Fitzgerald.

It's crucial to ask the right questions, and the right questions need the right words. The political and legal environment we find ourselves in at this strange moment in American history is centered upon the manipulation of citizen perception. We have been asked to endure a President who can say with a straight face, "That depends on what the meaning of is, is." And the current right wing lunatic harbingers of Treason are flogging a defense in the Valerie Plame affair based upon the ridiculous assertion that there's a difference between outing "Valerie Plame" and outing "Joe Wilson's wife".

Because of this environment, it's imperative that those of us in the Blogosphere stay focused for pinpoint accuracy with the questions that we ask, the words we use, and our analysis of the answers we receive.

Yesterday, **Tom Flocco** published the following headline bombshell, "Bush and Cheney Indicted":

"U.S. federal prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald's Chicago grand jury has issued perjury and obstruction of justice indictments to the following members of the Bush Administration: President George W. Bush, Vice-President Richard Cheney, Bush Chief of Staff Andrew Card, Cheney Chief of Staff I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Attorney General Alberto Gonzalez, former Attorney General John Ashcroft, imprisoned New York Times reporter Judith Miller and former Senior Cheney advisor Mary Matalin." LINK

The story spread like wildfire through internet forums. As of last night, I couldn't find an official, "on the record", reply to the story from the US Attorney's Office in the main stream media or anywhere in the Blogosphere.

That made sense, because Grand Jury proceedings are Secret, and without a Judicial Order releasing Grand Jury results, the US Attorney's Office would not be allowed to comment on what the Grand Jury has done.

The Federal ules of Civil Procedure:

"Rule 6(e) of the Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure provide that the prosecutor, grand jurors, and the grand jury stenographer are prohibited from disclosing what happened before the grand jury, unless ordered to do so in a judicial proceeding. Secrecy was originally designed to protect the grand jurors from improper pressures. The modern justifications are to prevent the escape of people whose indictment may be contemplated, to ensure that the grand jury is free to deliberate without outside pressure, to prevent subornation of perjury or witness tampering prior to a subsequent trial, to encourage people with information about a crime to speak freely, and to protect the innocent accused from disclosure of the fact that he or she was under investigation." http://www.law.ku.edu/research/frcriIII.htm

The prosecutor is barred from "disclosing what happened before the grand jury, unless ordered to do so in a judicial proceeding." The law does not allow Fitzgerald to comment regardless of whether Indictments have been "returned" or not.

Furthermore, according to the Federal Handbook for Grand Jurors, keeping the proceedings and findings of the Grand Jury secret, "[p]revents the disclosure of investigations that result in no action by the grand jury. LEGAL REPORT

The US Attorney's office is not allowed to comment about proceedings regardless of outcome.

So I was surprised this morning, when I came across a post at http://www.flybynews.com which contains a statement, alleged to be from the US Attorney's office. Please note that I am not vouching for the credibility of the flybynews.com comment. I have conducted my own interview with the US Attorney's office and will discuss it below, but it was this flybynews.com comment which percolated my curiosity and led me to dig a bit deeper. The flybynews commentary: __________________________________________________________________
Updated 03 August 2005 - ---------- This following received via email ----------- From: "People's Attorney / Volks-Anwalt Wolfram Grätz" Leuren Moret wrote:

I called the US Attorney's office this morning and they had "no comment" but when I asked them when they would announce this to the public they said " **we have** not issued **these** indictments". They had a lot of phone calls.

LINK
Assuming for the moment, that the quote is accurate, the words must be examined carefully in the context of grand jury linguistics and rules of procedure because they tell us that the US Attorney does not "issue" indictments. So when Randy Sanborn's office issued official statement to me this morning, "on the record", which said, "This office has not issued any indictments," the US Attorney was telling the truth, and was no in violation of the Federal secrecy law. As you will see, the statement in no way denies Tom Flocco's report that the "grand jury" has issued indictments.

LEGAL LINGUISTICS

The grand jury and the US Attorney are two separate entities with the respect indictments in that the prosecutor, according to the Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure, presents "information" or an "indictment" to the grand jury, and the word "indictment"is used as a noun, and it's used to describe the allegation against the defendant . And if the grand jury finds sufficient evidence that a crime has been commited, the grand jury votes to "indict", indict now being a verb, and if the the grand jury indicts, it then "returns an "indictment" or a "true bill". But the indictment returned by the jury is a "finding" whereas the "indictment" (aka "information") presented to the grand jury is an allegation."

"If the grand jury finds that there is sufficient evidence of probable cause, the grand jury "returns" an "indictment" which is also known as a "true bill", or in the alternative, if there is not sufficient evidence of the crime, the grand jury will return "a not true bill" aka "bill of ignoramus".

It's not legally possible for the US Attorney's Office to "issue" "indictments" when referring to charges that a grand jury has voted to "return" "indictments" on. Those "indictments" are "returned" by the grand jury, not the US Attorney.

And just so we're clear, neither the US Attorney or the grand jury, according to the letter of the law, is empowered to "issue" indictments. Rule 9 empowers "the court" to "issue" a "warrant" or "summons"."
LINK

I think I just heard the bubble pop..

Doug E.

http://www.newsnet5.com/news/4800587/detail.html

The NewsNet5 story is down!

Great work Brad. Found this via Atrios if I remember correctly.

I've sent the 8/2 post to the DSCC, DNC, and DCCC. Also Trumajority and my two Senators, Lautenberg and Corzine. Please folks, send it to yours and any media outlets you know of. If we can shine a big spotlight on these crooks maybe we can get some action on fixing their voting fraud. Their hand is in the cookie jar and the time is right to kick their butts.

It seems that BradBlog has replaced reason with inflamed rhetoric. Captain's Quarters has very rationally explained that there are some questions about the non-partisanship of ACVR and warns readers to beware. But he doesn't simply judge guilt through association and ignore any substantive information available on the website. All balanced observers of politics will view a report like ACVR's with due skepticism. But to be truly thoughtful and openminded, it is necessary to NOT discard out of hand the information contained in their report. BradBlog's purpose is to pursue a particularly partisan agenda, and to substitute prejudice and name-calling for patience and analysis. This tends to discredit the opinions of BradBlog and this site's allies in the view of those who consider themselves outside the main battle trenches of left and right.

Excuse me, Casey - have you taken the time to go back and study Brad's earlier reports on the ACVR? I think if you do you will understand why there is such acrimony here. Most of us have researched the ACVR since it's inception back in March. Also Brad conducted a telephone interview with Jim Dyke --- BradBlog ACVR Investigation and there's much more at the link to read up on.

Before you quickly diss us, take a look!

Seems liberals and most democrats are afraid of the truth and will do whatever it takes to mislead people and obfuscate anytime. Personal attacks are standard practice.

Democrats cannot win at the ballot box as has been proven the past elections so thet do what they can to stink up the process. The party is in deep doo doo.

Even liberal talk radio, ie, Air America is doomed. Al Gore's new TV network is a failure in waiting. The record is clear which party has engaged in the greatest voter fraud. Democrats.

Whether some Republican are associated with the RNC is immaterial. You'd disregard them even if they were Democrats. They'd be sellout or worse. The facts speak the truth. Democrats are in a sorry state and need to reevaluate themselves. Kick out the phonys and return to the days when Democrats were more honest.

Hi Kira, Thanks for responding. I came to BradBlog because I ran across the ACVR site and was a bit skeptical of it's origins. I decided to google a bit and BradBlog's comments from back in March (I think) came up. As such, my sketicism of the source was confirmed, but the information contained in ACVR was not completely repudiated in my mind. BradBlog had a link to Captain's Quarters, which I followed to see what he had said regarding ACVR. Comparing the tone and content of the two sites inspired my comments above regarding an over-reliance on heated rhetoric and name calling on BradBlog. It reminds me of my friends who often (in political conversations) jump to conclusions first and think later, if at all. It seems to me that Captains Quarters takes a more patient and open-minded approach than BradBlog. But, alas, open-minded does not necessarily mean correct. So, we'll see where this ACVR story goes.

Casey,
What really bothered me about the initial .pdf ACVR report was this:

At the time, John Conyers had already put together his 102-page documentary report on What Happened in Ohio, and there had been numerous other compilations of serious voter disenfranchisement. Add to that the very disturbing analyses of the exit poll data (which have been laughed at by people who - I suppose - don't have the ability to understand numbers & data) plus all the evidence obtained about Diebold/ES&S & other electronic voting machines/tabulators.

BUT --- read that 31-page report put together by the (fake) non-partisan ACVR and try to find 1 single mention of Republican fraud. It's not there. Any person who will use their intelligence will see this cannot be non-partisan.

It's been such a frustrating year (actually 5 years for some) to see the lies and thefts go unreported. I guess this latest slap in the face did bring out some loud booing. Maybe we'll regain our composure about name-calling, but we aren't going to stop fighting.

I do agree with you that being open-minded doesn't necessarily mean correct.

Thanks for your response.

PS I would provide a direct link to the original ACVR .pdf file, but I have apparently looked up my quota of links Google will allow for the day :laughs: since I'm not able to connect to them. Thank goodness everything else is working ... so far!

Hi (again) Kira, I think I remember that the inability to connect to Google is absolutely related to the need to treat yourself to good food and a beverage of choice. So, keep your stomach full, your mind open, and your laughs loud. In other words, take care, and thanks for the conversation.

Hi Casey,

McAfee burped while trying to update something, corrupting part of my system here which kept me from connecting to Google. Finally got it figured out & now I'm back up & running.

Here's the link I promised:

ACVR Ohio Election Report .pdf 31 pages

Thanks for the jolly good recommendations!

Kira

Just as a BTW: I've met the proprietor of "Right Thinking". He's actually not a bad guy, for a wingnut with a Michael Moore fixation. Anyway, I can tell you that "Lee" is in fact his real name, so you don't need the quotation marks.

Kira: I can't believe you and some others are still going on about the alleged disparity b/t the exit polls and results in Ohio. That situation has now been explained ad nauseum by the very group that did the polling and by a study conducted by the DNC which concludes that while there were some problems in Ohio, none of them, separately or together would have put Kerry in office. The numbers just weren't there. In other words, if all the alleged problem votes were for Kerry, he still would have fallen short. That according to the DNC. It is good to identify the problems in Ohio and elsewhere, whether it is fraud, intimidation or suppression, and find ways to stop it on both sides. After reading the ACVR report, I see that is what they conclude as well.

Javabob: You are truly pathetic.

Do you know who wrote the "smokescreen" DNC report, that didn't cover HALF the evidence?

It wasn't Howard Dean. It was republican lite Donna Brazille!!!!!

They barely spent anytime even doing any evidence, because the GOP/DLC refused to hand over the actual audit logs from the board of elections. That information right there, was showing how many altered results there were. Instead, they literally claimed state secrets priveledge-Secret PROPRIETARY software!

They should have sued them, like Washington. There is no secret proprietary software code allowed for counting the votes. It should be outlawed, since it is unconstitutional. That would be why you believe the phony report done by THIEVES, who afterward scream about "voter fraud". Read above, the real problem is election FRAUD.

Doug E.

Doug: Why not discuss important issues rationally? You start out by name calling. There is no evidence of altered logs. You can claim that the only reason there is no evidence is because republicans won't give it up, but in that case you have to admit that you only suspect there is such evidence. But you don't. You won't even give good evidence to support your supposition. All you say is that there was a difference in the exit polls and the final vote. News flash! Exit polling can be inaccurate. It does not prove anything. Experts have gone over the polling data over and over again and it has been proved faulty in the case of Ohio. The folks who conducted it said that the people they chose to do the polling were naturally drawn to speak to Kerry supporters for various reasons.
If you can prove an incident of code manipulation that changed a legal vote, either when the code was written or after the election, whoever is responsible should go to jail. There is no proof and there is no serious, credible allegation that it even occurred. This non-story has gotten out of hand through.

Doug: Why not discuss important issues rationally? You start out by name calling. There is no evidence of altered logs. You can claim that the only reason there is no evidence is because republicans won't give it up, but in that case you have to admit that you only suspect there is such evidence. But you don't. You won't even give good evidence to support your supposition. All you say is that there was a difference in the exit polls and the final vote. News flash! Exit polling can be inaccurate. It does not prove anything. Experts have gone over the polling data over and over again and it has been proved faulty in the case of Ohio. The folks who conducted it said that the people they chose to do the polling were naturally drawn to speak to Kerry supporters for various reasons.
If you can prove an incident of code manipulation that changed a legal vote, either when the code was written or after the election, whoever is responsible should go to jail. There is no proof and there is no serious, credible allegation that it even occurred. This non-story has gotten out of hand through posts like yours.