Today on The BradCast: Escaping MAGA and whether real accountability for the former President’s many crimes and civil verdicts might finally begin to bend the curve against him from within his own party and from his own supporters. [Audio link to full show follows this summary.]
On Friday, a nine-member federal jury in New York ordered Donald Trump to pay an additional $83.3 million to writer E. Jean Carroll, who an earlier 9-member jury determined last year that he had sexually assaulted and repeatedly defamed. The original verdict cost him $5 million, but wasn’t enough to stop the repeated defamation of Carroll.
All of this comes on the cusp of a completely separate verdict in a state case in NY where the judge has already determined Trump committed massive fraud by falsely inflating his assets to receive more favorable rates on bank loans, insurance and taxes. The State A.G. has asked that the judge now find Trump and his companies and his top executives (including his two eldest sons) liable for at least $370 million. That ruling is likely to come any day now.
A hundred million here, a hundred million there, and, before ya know it, you’re talking about real money. Even for a “billionaire” like Trump. But will any of it make a difference to Trump’s most ardent supporters? How about the few Republicans left who are neither Never Trumpers nor hardcore MAGA? Will they finally take notice? Might these rulings begin to make a difference in GOP primary polling, as the disgraced former President continues to be the party’s front-running nominee for the 2024 Presidential election?
For thoughts on all of that and much more, we’re delighted to be joined again today by RICH LOGIS, a former hardcore MAGA member himself who voted for Trump in both 2016 and 2020, before eventually coming to terms with the fact that he had become captive to what is a far-right political cult. (Our first conversation with him, with more details on that, was in October last year.)
Logis now runs PerfectOurUnion.us, devoted to “healing political trauma” and “building diverse, pro-democracy alliances”. Today, he offers his insight, as a reformed MAGA member and former Republican pundit, on whether any of the recent verdicts against Trump — and/or those that are still to come in the four separate criminal felony cases he is facing this year — might finally begin to turn the tide away from the GOP’s cult leader.
We also discuss Logis’ thoughts published recently at Salon, on why the MAGA crowd is so gullible to mythologization and race-baiting, and how even Nikki Haley is now tapping into the same bloodstream to capitalize on a party that has long been captured (well before Trump) by racist polarization and “White fright”.
Logis is now creating a new organization specifically devoted to “Leaving MAGA” and we begin the important discussion of how to help those captured by MAGA find their way out, and what friends and family members may be able to do to begin helping their loved ones find their way home.
“As someone who was in MAGA for seven years,” he tells me, “Most MAGA voters are good people, deep down. But, unfortunately, the relationship between most MAGA Americans and Donald Trump is a very toxic one. While I don’t defend ignorance, MAGA Americans have been traumatized by Trump and the rightwing and the Republican Party. They just have a skill set at keeping MAGA Americans desperate and panicked.”
But, he insists optimistically, “if someone got into MAGA, they can get out of it.” His own catalyst came after coming to terms with the fact that his own Governor, Ron DeSantis, who he had previously supported, was willing to let people die by lying to them about COVID vaccines in 2021.
“If someone who is very pro-MAGA speaks to someone who is very anti-MAGA, I guarantee, if they speak long enough, they’re going to find some issues that they have some common ground and agreement on.” He cautions, however, that vilification doesn’t work. If it did, “everybody would have left at this point.”
“It’s going to take time,” Logis insists. But he believes “there are more out there who are in the nascent stages of remorse. Because ultimately the strength of the numbers in Leaving MAGA will be in how many we can encourage and empower to leave and tell their stories publicly.”
Until his new organization is formally unveiled, he asks folks to contact him at his website. This conversation will continue, I hope. Because it must…
Sigh. Former cultists be like: I figured out that 2+2 is not 22. I’m now a genius that should be teaching math.
Liked the reference to “white fright”, Brad.