BANG THE GONG!!!
The swing state of Florida in 2000.
Thes swing states of Florida, New Mexico, Nevada, AND Ohio in 2004.

Glad one of the Kennedy's is showcasing this story-pointing to 'elephant in the room'...right on time for the '06 midterms.

Did RFK, Jr. write this when he was taking his meds?
How can he be sure he wrote this article? How can I be sure the Kennedy's are doing anything but meds, drinking, and driving. Say hello to Dick C next time you are on the phone.
Anj

2 People who need to weigh in on this one:
Bob Fitrakis of the Ohio Free Press and Presidential Candidate in 2004 who TRIED unsuccessfully to have some sort of legitimate recount in Ohio, David Cobb of the Green Party.
In 2000 the swing state of Florida was stolen.
In 2004, the swing states of Florida, New Mexico, Neveda AND Ohio.
Kerry went to Iraq and made a statement he was not contesting the election fraud. Screw him.

Let's hope Bobby does not become another "tragic story" of Camelot. He's a great guy.

So was Paul Wellstone. So was John Jr., his cousin.

I never miss Ring of Fire on Air America Radio. . . Now more to look foward to.

Anj,

You're getting your Kennedys mixed up. That was Teddy's son.

Understandable, given the size of the family and their political tendencies... but I'm not sure that RFK Jr. is on any medications that would affect judgement and I'm not willing to hold him responsible for family members who might be. Hear him out.

Wow. Keep it up and Bush will not win another election. Good job guys!

Election fraud of this magnitude would constitute a conspiracy to overthrow the government, treason, and may require the death penalty if proven. :hehe:

:D Margaret G, I like the way you think! Go Bobby! Let's bring those criminals DOWN!!!!

God bless those Kennedys!

You're right, pRicky.. Jeb Bush is looking to have his turn at fucking over the masses and helping his oil-interests get uber rich, then not have to pay an estate tax on it when his daddy dies.

But, we'll likely get the elections corrected so the will of the people is applied again, then you and your 29% (and falling) crew can get back to the business of trying to figure out how to hijack the country again.

David Cobb, Bob Fitrakis and not to leave out Bev Harris or anyone from Black Box Voting were very outspoken a deaf media ear. Get an updated story from them since they roared how "We the People" was a story called "We the Rigged."

I would say the secrets have been in the right hands for some time now. The U.S. has no right invading other countries and telling them about democracy and voting....Bush Boys.

Ricky is right. The lunatic left rolled over and got crushed in 2000 because they voted for Nader. Now, they hire the raging moron Howard Dean to run the party of Roosevelt and Truman. Now, what do you do? Write a whiny article, in Rolling Stone of all places, exposing the fact that Bush is "corrupt". Duh. Gee, thanks for pointing that out in 2006. Many of us knew this 6 years ago. REMEMBER: IF YOU VOTED FOR NADER, BUSH IS *YOUR FAULT* and you bear some responsibility for the 30,000 dead and wounded (mostly) men in Iraq!!! whew

Margaret G has encapsulated it most succinctly. And, so as to not "mis-underestimate" the power of these fascists - probably time to start stocking up on anti-anthrax stuff.

I don't mean to rain on your parade, but don't you realize that these stories are all just part of Another Rovian Conspiracy? What better way to marginalize the Democratic Party than to have them caricatured as wild-eyed conspiracy theorists who won't shut the @$#% up about an election 2 or even 6 years ago?!

Regards,
St Wendeler
Another Rovian Conspiracy

Conservaturds have no agenda except their unbridled greed and disregard for humanity. :angry:

Oh yeh..Thank you Brad!

Right you are, DJ.. blame the voters for a system that has been rigged for decades to not facilitate "true representation", but to encourage "party politics".

Though, Shrubby didn't win in 2000 either, he was appointed. Or did you miss that bit? And from the looks of things, it wouldn't have mattered if those votes had gone to Gore instead of Nader.. the fix was in, I'm sure. If not in 2000, then in 2004 and Sept. 11, 2001 would have been Sept. 11, 2005 and we'd still be in this war, and still dismantling this country.. Of course, there's the huge surpluss we'd probably have had to fight the war with instead of this huge deficit we have now.. but...

ARC:St Wendeler...

Do you suggest we all just ignore the broke electoral system then? Don't get the "facts" out there so people can see that these machines are HUGE PROBLEMS for -every- American?

Seems like the typical Repug mind-set is to just ignore everything and let those (corrupt pricks) in charge make all the descisions.. After all, isn't that their job? protect us from ourselves?

Good timing to address these issues of election fraud,... something can still be done to seek corrective action prior to Nov. 2006. This issue will soon become irrelevant and stale to accomplish anything meaningful before 2006,... we can not wait for 2008,.. by then FASCISM will have a strangle hold on our political systems,... a death grip. This we can not permit.

We may get a clean election and turn back the tide
of FASCISM,.. take our country back.

Thank You Rolling Stone,.. Thank You Robert F. Kennedy Jr.,.. And last but not the least of them all - THANK YOU MR. BRADLEY FRIEDMAN.

God Bless them all !!!!!

GREAT to hear about this article.

And who cares if they attack back. WE are now on attack mode too.

And the more they attack, the more ATTENTION this will get.

We now have 71% of the people on our side. The people united will never be defeated!

The MSM should be held accountable along with all the criminals in the white house. This story had legs in 2004 and no one danced with it. Shame on the MSM for ignoring this attack on America. I would be so proud to watch Bush Co be held accountable for once and for all.
Thank you Bobby

Can't wait to read it. Go Bobby Jr!

Kids, this wasn't just machine-hacking. They made people wait in the rain for hours, they overpacked targeted voting locations, hardware broke down...certain, numerous voters were disenfranchised on purpose.

Don't you guys remember that mess in Ohio?

The real culprits are the felonious five, one of whom is burning in hell right about now.

Bush V. Gore defenestrated the constitution.

Oh,.. Raw Story has a direct link to Bradblog
and this thread,... nice exposure.

Raw Story Link :

DJ #15

Screw you. I'll vote for whomever I want. Nader's votes made zero difference in the outcome of Florida 2000. THe election was rigged. If Gore had gotten 538 of the votes that went to Nader, the fucking Katherine Harris/Jeb Bush crime team would have made sure the official count was whatever it needed to be for Bush to win Florida.

When YOU blame people for voting their conscience, wanting a legitimate third party - when you bully people because of their vote, how are you any different than the fascists who currently are in power? Explain that one to me. I'm so fucking tired of Democrats blaming Nader. Remember that Nader was one of the few who contested the vote in 2000 AND 2004. Perhaps Gore and Kerry should both take a page...

I wonder if the article will have any new information and whether it will have put the pieces of the jigsaw puzzle together any better.

Seems like some people are confusing Patrick Kennedy, son of Ted Kennedy, who crashed his car in DC and is in drug rehab, and Robert Kennedy Jr., who is a highly responsible guy and widely respected within the progressive community. WE need to follow-up with letters to Congress, the media, calls to friends, to keep this issue alive. Thanks, thanks, thanks to the Brad Blog for not letting go of this story!!!!

Let's hope that this will force the national media to PAY ATTENTION for once and, along with the growing Iraqi murder investigations (I feel so sorry for the marines who have been placed in such hell by this regime that they lost it and committed terrible things), will make for a very hot summer for the bushies.

The HAVA act has to be reversed. We need to toss the computers they're the central part of the Fascist takeover of this country. Bu$h and his gang are anything but Conservatives they're Fascist radicals and they are rapidly consolidating all power into King george's hands. 1 more terror attack and these thugs will open the camp doors there friends at Halliburton are building and we'll all be detained by Homeland Security for having the temerity to question Dear leader. These bastards have no intention of ever allowing another fair and free election in this country. They wipe their ass with the Constitution daily.

Ohio Coingate,.. Mr. Noe,.. pleads guilty for improper fund raising for bu$$$h 2004 election.

Noe guilty of improper fund raising bu$$$h 2004 election : Link

Sadly due to his drug use+his voice issues his opinion will have little impact.

The MSM never reported on this before. They never even touched what Jeb Bush and Katherine Harris did to fix the election in 2000. If Bush were polling around 50% or more, this story would go nowhere. But, after all that's happened in the past year (just go review press clippings of the White House scandals du jour yourself), the incompetence and dishonesty of this regime in the eyes of the American public, this one's got legs. And, call it "whiny" all you want. The facts don't whine. When the public finally gets to see what was done in Ohio, just for starters, they're going to hate Bush even more and they're going to be yelling at their congressmen to impeach him.

It's shaping up to be a perfect storm. With Gore's film in release around the country next week, as Bush continues to do less than nothing about our country's contributions to the effects of global warming, people are going to get a real clear idea of just how abominable this administration is.

As much as I hated seeing Bush steal a second term in the White House, I think I actually prefer to see him go down this way. He's going to go down hard. And on top of all the other crimes they nail him for, I hope they get him for war crimes and put his sick, twisted, lying ass away forever.

This is hopeful. But do I dare hope in a world gone mad?

The last three elections have been blatantly stolen. I will never get over the sick feeling I felt waking up to find that bush was being called the winner over Gore. When I went to bed that night, Gore had won.

Never before had this happened. Never before had a state not gone for the candidate for whom it was called.

2004 was more complicated than 2000, which made it harder to crack, and the popular vote caused a lot of people to not care, so the story went more slowly.

Finally, someone with a voice and a conscience and a sense of moral obligation has stepped forward.

Hooray!
Let's all buy up the Rolling Stone issue and spread it around!

shw

Fantastic news Brad. Hopefully Kennedy's name recognition will give this the kick in the ass it needs to finally hit the consciousness of average Americans. I can't wait to read the article and see what evidence he has.

StevenD at Boomantribune has frontpaged your post here.

Great work kid.

DJ: If the elections were rigged, why the hell would it matter if we voted for Nader? Your logic is greatly flawed.

Blame the criminals. Not those among us who voted for the candidate we felt would do the best job. Isn't that what democracy is supposed to be about?

This two party system, and its corrupt voting mechanisms is rotten to the very core.

what about the 2000 election? isn't there a pantload of evidence on that as well? same thing with 9/11? isn't there massive amounts of evidence disputing the official story? same thing with the iraq 'war'. same thing with just about everything thats screwed up, i just thought we weren't supposed to talk about it.

Get Kennedy a copy of LOUDER THAN WORDS 2ND EDITION. loosechange911.com so ALL AMERICANS AND CITIZENS OF THE WORLD CAN LEARN that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld etc created 9/11 and the story these liers and the media has spun is a load of BUSHIT.

Don't EVER forget that Gore won Florida by over 50,000+ votes, so Nader was NOT a factor.

Which 50,000 votes?

Those were the ones that were thrown out when the voter (often a first-timer, newly registered) checked off for GORE and then WROTE-IN (there was often a space at the bottom of the list of candidates) either GORE again or LIBERMAN. These were all thrown out (NO, the voters were NOT given a chance to correct them) even though under Florida's "intent of the voter" standard, the vote was clear.

Oh, yes, there were under 1,000 similar over-votes for Bush, in case you were wondering.

REPUBLICANS ARE THIEVES.
REPUBLICANS ARE CHEATS.
REPUBLICANS ARE LIARS.
REPUBLICANS ARE COWARDS.

And HELL, I'm gonna have to get a subscription to the ROLLING STONE --- this is like the third major article in the last 12 months where they are brining attention to matters long ignored or covered up by the rest of the right-wing corporate-controlled media.

Greg Palast goes on tour beginning June 5 (right here in Portland)... DO NOT MISS HIM!!!

Charlie L
Portland, OR

Way to go!!! If nothing, it will make people think, hmmmm.... it's not a bad thing!!!

you people act like america was a democracy at one point. it wasnt. the kennedy's are a bunch of elite murderers no different from the bush's.

what? because some liberal elite guy says it it is suddenly gonna be taken as truth?

your elections have ALWAYS been owned by the rich.

I don't know...Robt Kennedy was hysterical in his pieces on autism & mercury. I need to see good documentation on this one.

YAAAYYY!!!! I think have tears in my eyes.

Thabks again Brad and blog.

We have Congress largely to thank for the mess we are in:

'HAVA democracy in name only', America --- where when you go to cast a vote, your vote disappears into the invisible electronic ether, never to be seen again. All paid for by $4 BILLION of your tax dollars which HAVA funnels straight from the federal treasury, through the hands of the state election officials and then directly into the coffers of the handful of for-profit computerized-voting-machinery corporations. Secret corporate software, overseen by NO, I repeat, NO independent authority, is then inserted into shoddy plastic hardware which is manufactured offshore and then foisted on our public officials for a king's ransom, to "count" our votes.

Brought to you by Rep. Bob Ney of Ohio, convicted today of breaking the law to which he pleaded guilty yet still in Congress, Senator Mitch McConnell of Kentucky, Senator Christopher Dodd of Connecticut, Rep. Steny Hoyer of Maryland. Send HAVA and these co-sponsors back where they came from, PLEASE.

Paper ballots, hand counted: Plan B for America this fall. Plan ahead by adopting Plan B now, election officials, and you will be thanking your lucky stars that you had the foresight to do so.

Meanwhile, THANK YOU Robert Kennedy, Jr. and Rolling Stone, and THANK YOU Bev Harris et al of blackboxvoting.org, and Brad Friedman of bradblog.com and all the other citizens who think for themselves, and know corporate propaganda when they hear it or see it broadcast by the corporate owners of America's airwaves and newspapers. And thank you especially to Responsible Public Election Officials Ion Sancho of Florida and Bruce Funk of Utah [I cannot BELIEVE that Utah kicked this honest veteran County Clerk out of office for singlehandedly uncovering a VITAL-to-our-democracy threat to our elections! Utah: FOR SHAME --- stop practicing Soviet-style tyranny inside the USA.] Sancho and Funk are the only reasons we have ANY independent test results for any of the computerized-voting-machinery and software, in the public realm. Other nationally-distributed equipment has YET to be thoroughly and independently scrutinized, because its corporate owners forbid it, and Congress yawns at such behavior by these favored and taxpayer-financed corporate funders of their political campaigns, no matter the damage to our democracy that results.

Congress has become far less than useless - it's up to us now - We, the People - to save our democracy.

I know I'm off topic, well kind of. College students might be interested in this. The government is giving grants away for poll workers. See link below

http://www.eac.gov/docs/...mp;%20News%20Release.pdf

Nader voters certainly provided a critical margin for the election of Bush. But I disagree with DJ on the fundamentals of who is responsible for Bush in the final analysis. I will forever blame those people who called them selves "moderates" and who still voted for Bush. There was nothing moderate about him or his policies and by the end of the first term everybody knew it. And I shall also blame the 2/3 of the Christian faith who let the loudest 1/3 represent them, frame them, bully them and embarrass them into silence and inactivity. It is moderates today who simply do not believe that electoral fraud was committed on a large scale. It is the moderates who refuse to investigate and speak openly about it. It is the moderates who are afraid and who have lost their spine. Radicals and activists will never on their own succeed against the Radical Right, but they can and do push back. Moderates have failed utterly to push back. And it is disgusting.

SUDS, you are talking about POLITICS and "MODERATES versus PROGRESSIVES" as if the opinions of the candidates and the thoughts of the voters had anything to do with the results in 2000.

It was the same stupid discussion that was had after 2004 as if what Kerry STOOD FOR or what the people who went voting BELIEVED had anything to do with the final tally.

THEY STOLE 2000 in FLORIDA.
THEY STOLE 2004 in Florida, Ohio, Iowa, New Mexico, and Nevada.

THEY ARE THIEVES, not politicians with political opinions and appeals to voters. IF WE ALLOW THEM TO CONTINUE TO STEAL, THEY CAN HAVE AS LITTLE AS 1% APPROVAL AND STILL WIN!

Don't you get it?

They CHEAT!

They would lose an honest election, so they CHEAT! We can't win by convincing people to vote for our candidate. THAT WON'T HELP.

WE HAVE TO CHANGE THE VOTING SYSTEM OR BE PREPARED TO "GO UKRAINIAN" WHEN OUR VOTE COUNTS DON'T MATCH THE SCIENTIFIC EXIT POLLING.

We have to take back our representative democratic republic --- BY FORCE IF NECESSARY!!!

Charlie L
Portland, OR

Hi Brad, You are doing a great heroic job, remember the truth hurts. I have an idea to mobilize the "troops" for the upcoming election. I think the American People who are intelligent enough to know the truth should adopt a uniform, we should wear feathers and headdresses and war paint and actively participate in all political functions, town meetings, and rallies. First, it would attract the curiousity of other participants, media and help us get the message out. The symbolism would be devastating to the status quo. Imagine little old ladies in war paint, fat white guys with war bonnetts, black suburban youth wearing headbands and feathers. It would look ridiculous just like the original Tea Party participants, who knew that the English would not buy into an real Indian attack. We would get free publicity worldwide and would grow like wildfire. The talk at the water cooler at work would not be about sports but about my "crazy mother in law" who thinks she can change the world by posing as a wild Indian. The discussions in the classrooms of our schools would be priceless. The teachers would love the tie in to American History and would be a springboard for other stimulating conversations. We could sneak attack closed Republican rallies dressed in white shirts and business suits only to apply our was paint once inside. Imagine a political rally where 65% of the people are dressed as "wild Indians", they would soon be averting the cameras to the stage only. We could adopt an "official war cry" or "war whoop", at first there would be a isolated whoop, then another, then a thunderous cacophany of whoops causing the Neo con candidate to turn a bright shade of red as he or she's bull shit rhetoric is drowned out. What about tom-tom drums .Just for fun, we could bombard Rush Limbaugh's show and C-Span's Washington Journal, the new Howard Stern show with phone calls, and before we can be cut off, let out a loud whoop or have a feint tom-tom drum beating in the backround only to get louder and louder. It would be fun, contagious and extemely healthy for our cancerous government. We would strike fear into the hearts and minds of the incumbency. Imagine our candidates who wear Indian Regalia at political rallies and on campaign posters. We could set up face painting booths just about anywhere. Imagine going to vote at your local polling place and having to "run the gauntlet" before voting. Imagine the converts getting their faces painted before their vote is placed and proudly wearing their costume to the office on election day. They don't need to vote for a particular party, they just need to insist that their vote be counted. Maybe if they don't fix the machines, we can dump them in the harbor.

Max
New American Tea Party

CALL THE FBI

It is time for full criminal investigations of the whole affair.

Commenters above who point out that the vote fraud was many things are exactly right. It's amazing that in a democracy which is rather proud of itself, most people just wanted to pretend it never happened. It was too embarrassing, I guess.

It seems like tinfoil hat stuff because there's no clear mechanism showing how it happened. A real, conscious conspiracy would have presumably required cooperation from thousands of people, at least a few of whom would have blabbed by now.

However, the evidence that the 2004 election really was stolen--even if we still don't know how--is very strong. Kathy Dopp's statistical analysis of exit poll results versus reported vote counts shows a bias so far from random that the only plausible conclusion is that somebody pushed it. If you had those levels of statistical significance in a scientific experiment, you'd have a solid case. And yet the media still treat it like tinfoil hat stuff.

Let's hope Kennedy Jr.'s spotlight on the issue makes people finally start thinking.

I hope this means Ken Blackwell won't be able to steal the election in November and become my Governor. So if it's shown that Bush stole either one of the elections then everybody should refuse to be on a federal jury under a Bush appointed judge (unless it's a trial of another corrupt republican.)

Sorry - got my Ohio crooks confused. Tom NOE is the one who pleaded guilty today. Rep. Bob Ney is still on the slow boil...

If it weren't for Brad I don't think anyone would have the balls to talk about this! After all it's taken only six years for these folks to ctach up to Brad. Anyway, any report is appreciated.

Thank you Brad for all the amazing work you have done. It is work!
And it is appreciated!

Max:

I like your plan.

We have been short on "symbology" for a while in the movement.

I'm going to get my indian paint ready.

Charlie L
Portland, OR

Thanks RFK Jr and Rolling Stone! I'm glad to see there's a few REAL patriots left!

Just how many patriots will be shown by the coverage this story gets in the MSM.

Brad:

Thanks for the news --- can't wait to read it!

Bobby, we love ya, baby!

And as for the repugnant comments, maybe when Bush uses his same tricks to overpower some of his REPUBLICAN enemies, they'll stop whining at us and start to protect this republic!

# 44 So Bobby Kennedy was "hysterical" about mercury? And all the parents who have kids with autism (1-166) who KNOW the mercury in the vaccines have caused the autism are also hysterical?

Check it out: http://en.wikipedia.org/...mpsonwood_CDC_conference

Your wonderful MD advisors to the CDC are ADMITTING that there is a link between mercury in vaccines and autism and then agree to "embargo" the information. One doc even says that his first grandson had just been born and he told his daughter-in-law not to have the child vaccinated!

No, Bobby isn't hysterical. He is one of the few to name the elephant in the room.

When election fraud is brought up on Air America Radio almost every single host says exclusively and reflexively;

"Go To Brad Blog"

I firmly think that bush&co along with the religious fascist believe that they have a legitimate right (as outlined in the Declaration of Independence) to take over the government because it's not responsive to the needs "of the people." And in America, "the people" are the moral and righteous people of jesus....

Better late than never! Maybe election fraud will finally be something that American's can talk about. "The words election fraud" have been taboo for so long. Maybe if we ignore it it will just go away...yeh right! "Well" I haven't forgotten and I still haven't gotten over it. It's about time that this thing came out of the closet. Why is it that American's can talk about pornography, drugs, sex, gays, alcohol, prostitution, war, and just about any other topic...but mention the word election fraud and the silence is down-right awkward. Somebody has got to wake this country up. I sure hope that Bobby Kennedy is the one to finally do it. Maybe finally...finally...finally...the news media will be forced to do their jobs. Maybe everyone will finally realize that the ones who have been jumping up and down screaming "stolen elections" weren't so crazy afterall!!!!!!!

The real insult will be when Rebulicans "demand an apology" and dozens of democrats, Joe Lieberman among them, fall all over themselves to dump on RFK on this one.

Sorry if I'm being cynical, but that's my take on the current state of the Democratic party.

-Michael

Always delightful to see Kerry state "he isn't certain" whether Ohio polls were tampered with.

Is there a liquid " instant gonads" drink he could down soon?

It is painful watching a grown man without balls.

Personally, and this is just my unscientific opinion here:

The reason the incumbent Dems don't protest or draw attention to the obviously rigged polls is, they have already made their deals with the devils in charge. Don't rock the boat, keep your precious seat, perks and all, and stay in the room feeding at the taxpayer trough with the rest of the pigs.

Obvious, isn't it?

Rupert Murdoch hosting Hillary??

C'mon, whaddya need, a wall to fall on ya?

kerry's attitude at the time when we were all desparate to have him put up a fight and had contributed funds to send lawyers down to make sure the election was fair... was a near instant "oh gee we lost, quel dommage"...i will not support kerry again. now he is still trying to justify his instant cave in...puleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeze. he is clearly in on the fix.

#64

When I heard the rupert murdoch was hosting Hillary my stomach dropped, as well as my opinion of her . . .

why is the smartest kennedy like the only one not holding public office?

the media never adequately addressed the election result and the electronic voting issue

meanwhile, on a semi related note, the bush gov's information police states marches forward, as now only a handful of political appointees are allowed to talk about the salmon issue. that's right. salmon. the fish. the big national security threat. (the washington post thought this was a marginal story, and so buried it on the bottom of page a17 under "noted with interest." with interest? wha kind of paranoid administration gags its scientists from talking about salmon. that is a totalitarian type of action, not a democratcit one. what's america doing in the meantime? yawning......agree with me? write a few papers and ask them why they don't focus on this pervasive pattern of secrecy and information control so analthema to an open democracy....

and in a 5-4 ruling yesterday by the newly configured highly conservative u.s. supreme court, the court took an interesting viewof just who gov employees work for, furthering chilling the potential exposure of information about the gov, exactly what it is doing and how it is putting tax dollars to work

(with links)

the media never adequately addressed the election result and the electronic voting issue

the court took an interesting viewof just who gov employees work for...

Voting for the first time in 1968, I cast my ballot for RFK Sr. in the California Presidential Primary. We were crushed by events later in the day but we never gave up hope for the humanitarian policies that he represented.

Thank you, RFK Jr. The truth will set you free!

I don't see the point in fighting past battles or who arguing over who didn't fight past battles. This is about TODAY's battle, and that is about election fraud TODAY. Every other issue is moot till this one is fixed.

Okay, we should have addressed it in 2000, 2002, 2004. But only a few people came forward then and "we" (the collective "we") ignored it. Now we're all paying the price.

Kennedy is sticking his neck out on this one; what can we do to keep this issue alive and get action going. Talk with friends, write your newspapers, call your reps. If change is going to happen, it's up to us to make it happen. We've got to get beyond "I told you so" and show those who voted for these bastards that they can live with no jobs, no healcare, no retirement, rampant corruption, or do something about it.

I've been telling people about this for some time. this information (about 400,000 votes being involved) has been out for a while in this case (billy meier). Check it out http://www25.brinkster.com/chancede/Cnotes.html

Bush has stolen the last two elections presidential, and who knows how many senate and reps. elections. Let's put this guy behind jail

CONTACT 367
[Thursday, September 9, 2004]
Contact person: Ptaah
German excerpt: http://www.figu.org/de/f...katastrophenwahl-usa.htm

Overpopulation's (7.5 billion) dangers for the Earth
Bad leaders in government exploiting the people
World War III (WW3/WWIII) - Meier states that WW3 has been "in full course" for a long time; global military conflicts still possible in 2006, 2010, 2011 & 2012
USA, Israel, Palestine & Sudan
Death of Yasser Arafat in November 2004: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arafat
Terrorism
George W. Bush - a "terrorkrat"; 2nd rise to power in November 2004 (stated by Quetzal 15+ years ago); global military conflicts (WW3) possible in 2006
Republican population of the US led by "the lies and empty promises made by Bush", etc.; not able to think logically
Israel
Palestine & Yasser Arafat
John F. Kerry: http://kerry.senate.gov/
USA Presidential Election 2004 - Bush will win by fraudulently using 400,000 falsified votes manufactured during the 2000 election and stored on voting machines; Florida & Ohio will be complicated
Republicans
Yasser Arafat's death in November 2004 - Israel (Ariel Sharon) will prevent his body being buried in Jerusalem: http://www.guardian.co.u...y/0,2763,1345031,00.html
Ariel Sharon - "a thousandfold murderer and terrorist"
George W. Bush - comparable to Adolph Hitler, Josef Stalin, Ariel Sharon, Yasser Arafat, Saddam Husain, Nicolae Ceausescu, Slobodan Milosevic, etc.; strives for US world domination; he isn't concerned with world terrorism, the "War On Terrorism" is a cover for attacking other countries to establish military bases in them & exploit them; he is "the worst [president] who ever prevailed over the United States of America"
US Senators, etc.
Approximately half of Americans are opposed to war & only want direct defenses for America, not attacking other countries
Switzerland - criminals in government, free speech, the press, judicial system

No vote, no democracy - we have no vote. At this point in time America itself is a fraud (not the Constitution - the piss-poor implementation of it). This ignorant worship of capitalism, fostered by the corporate shills on the right, works against ever having a real democracy. We have to do much more than simply force our "leaders" to organize a fair vote... heaven forbid someone utter the unspeakable, screw capitalism and corporations. Gut them both.

Brad, There is some information that will eventually get out after certain things get worked with the BIG BOYS. There is a book available on Amazon that details an experience of racism against Lynn Swann in "White Male Privilege." The Uk Amazon has a synopsis of the situation. Your readers might find the information very interesting!

"I don't see the point in fighting past battles or who arguing over who didn't fight past battles."

First, the battles were never "not being faught", they were being ignored by the MSM.. Since 2000, people have been fighting, and in the case of 2004, people are going to jail -today-, and court cases are being argued -today-.

Second, it MATTERS who "didn't fight past battles" because it speaks to their character and weather or not we should trust them TODAY or in the FUTURE..

It -all- matters...

Without dialog, we don't learn.. if we don't learn, we're doomed to repeat ourselves and this mess.

Election Fraud issue,.. improper financing of
federal pResidential elections,..

How Tom Noe was involved knee deep.

Tom Noe like Tom Delay,... same tomfoolery,...
gaming election financing laws to throw elections,..
with conduct specifically against written law. You can not seize control of a political system by means of illegal conduct,... and anoint yourself leader of that political system.

These guys did just that,.. they should answer for that illegal conduct.

More Tom Noe link :

More Tom Noe link :

More Tom Noe Brad File link :

I really like the content of this Web site, and absolutely can't deal with the yellow on green layout. There is insufficient distinction between the two colors to make it possible for me, and I am sure, others, to read the material here. Basically, I cut the text out and paste it into a word processor, so I can read the text.

Also, the tiny text, combined with the ghastly color choices, make it impossible to read the site. Stop sabotaging your message with this incredibly inappropriate choice of background and text color. Please. The content is too important to undercut it in this way.

I know you like soldiers stories. I guess you missed this one.

http://www.thestate.com/...ment/movies/14709855.htm

Ken Blackwell,....

Ken Blackwell link :

Ken Blackwell/Bradblog File link :

Ken Blackwell/Bradblog link :

I've admired the environmental work of RFK Jr. for many years, and I'm so glad to see that he's up on this crucial topic as well. Without real, reliable elections, we may just as well declare our country a dictatorship, roll up our red, white and blue colors, and hold out our hands to be cuffed and our children to be enslaved in a corporatocracy without conscience or soul.

THANK YOU, "Rolling Stone" and Robert Kennedy, Jr. - and Brad, for keeping at this topic in such dogged and determined fashion!

Peg C #79

Fancy seeing you here )

I wonder what action Carrie Nation would
would take to deal with these electronic vote
stealing machines?

Ohio Governor Robert Taft,....

Robert Taft/The Corrupt One link :

Ohio's Elections as tainted and tarnished as Florida's link :

Robert Taft/Bradblog File :

To the Nader voters who are responsible for Bush being elected.

Ralph Nader had a seat at the table with us progressives in the Democratic Party. He always had. Nader, and those windmill lancers who voted for him, were pleaded with by us to vote Democratic because polling showed that it would be an extremely close election. Instead Nader and you kept insisting that there wasn't a dimes worth of difference between Democrats (Gore) and Republicans (Bush).

How's that looking to you today? BTW, Florida wasn't the only state where egocentric progressiver-than-thou Nader voters tipped the election to Bush. I believe West Virginia was another, and possibly Iowa, I think.

Anyhow, West Virginia would have tipped it to Gore as well. Why don't you crawl back into Nader's stock portfolio and disappear once and for all, idiots.

Your leader and party was 1/5th as relevant as Ross Perot. That about sums it up.

Well, add another hero to my small list of heros. RFK, Jr., along with John Conyers & Russ Feingold. I always loved RFK, Jr.

might I make another point..in America WHEN ONE VOTES ONE CAN NOT SAY NO ! IN OTHER WORDS "NONE OF THE ABOVE".

BUSHISMS:

"The point now is how do we work together to achieve important goals. And one such goal is a democracy in Germany." —George W. Bush, D.C., May 5, 2006

"That's George Washington, the first president, of course. The interesting thing about him is that I read three — three or four books about him last year. Isn't that interesting?" —George W. Bush, while showing German newspaper reporter Kai Diekmann the Oval Office, Washington, D.C., May 5, 2006

"Finally, the desk, where we'll have our picture taken in front of --- is nine other Presidents used it. This was given to us by Queen Victoria in the 1870s, I think it was. President Roosevelt put the door in so people would not know he was in a wheelchair. John Kennedy put his head out the door." —George W. Bush, showing German newspaper reporter Kai Diekmann the Oval Office, Washington, D.C., May 5, 2006

"That's called, A Charge To Keep, based upon a religious hymn. The hymn talks about serving God. The president's job is never to promote a religion." —George W. Bush, showing German newspaper reporter Kai Diekmann the Oval Office, Washington, D.C., May 5, 2006

Maybe I just haven't read enough, but I don't believe the elections were stolen. But if I find proof that it did happen, heads should roll!!
Also wanted to state, for those that are strong republican minded citizens of this country, that it is not JUST republican politicians that are corrupt. There are waaaay too many democratic politicians that eat from the trough.
You do have to remember though, that the republican party is IN POWER today. The White House and BOTH houses of Congress are controlled by the republicans. The worst news of all is what has gone on in the White House, which has brought shame to this country and will keep us in the red and hated by the world for a long time to come.
I'll keep reading, and I'll make a choice on all this election fraud when I've heard or read the evidence, but what I hear needs to be verifiable. I DO know that I don't want electronic voting machines that can be manipulated by anyone, republican or democrat, to take away what little faith I have left in this republic.

Politicians who care about the environment seem to be on the "up and up", ever notice that? There's $$$ in ruining and exploiting the environment, there isn't in educating people on how we're ruining it and ourselves. Gore & RFK care about the environment. The Dems have got to go back to publicizing how they are the "pro-environmental" party.

I am curious why none of the media covers the most important aspect of the Malvo shootings. If you look at Newspapers on the dates when the shootings are underway you discover something I find quite interesting. The shootings begin to dominate the news the day before
the debate on the Iraq war starts and they catch them the day after the declaration of war??? If you ask most people "do you remember the debate about starting the second Iraq war", they will all answer "yes of course". But if you followup with the question "name one point in the debate, a speech by a Senator or where their senator stood", nada.

Almost no one noticed any aspect of the most important debate in the last 50 years?

An interesting and odd fact... No one has done a story on what the real impact of the shootings were. It was to virtually eliminate the war debate from the media.

The special forces background of the senior member of the pair also seems to get short shrift.

Smells a little fishy to me based on what little I know about it. At minimum its a very significant part of the story, i.e. that a common murderer had such an impact on our political process. Why is nobody covering this obvious fact?

Dan Pride
Aurora

{Ed note: Comment deleted. Disinformation not tolerated here. Thank you.}

FROM THE HEARTLAND
Free Press uncovers evidence of ballot tampering in Warren County, Ohio
by Bob Fitrakis
After locking out all media observers and declaring a Level 10 Homeland Security Alert, the Republican-dominated Warren County, Ohio reported the vote tally in the wee hours of the morning on November 3, 2004 --- and gave George W. Bush a surprising 14,000 vote boost. Two election workers told the Free Press that the ballots had been diverted to an unauthorized warehouse where they had been possibly stuffed. That is, punched for Bush only. Maps were supplied to the Free Press showing the locations of the warehouse and the Board of Elections.
READ THE ARTICLE : LINK ; link

There are plenty of things to fault the Dems for, but there's only one thing that they really need to be hammered about with regard to election fraud. They may not have figured out what was going on right away with the 2000 election, but the evidence came out shortly afterwards that made it clear what the Republicans were doing and what they'd continue to do if they weren't stopped. The Dems had four years to raise hell about it and they did nothing. In fact, they let the Republicans get away with even more in 2004.

How many people remember or even know that the NAACP won a lawsuit against Jeb Bush and Katherine Harris after the 2000 election for their denial of voting rights to tens of thousands of African Americans in Florida? They knowingly declared people to be felons who weren't. They purged them from the voter roles and refused to listen to any warnings that what they were doing was wrong and illegal. It's true that the Nader votes didn't really hurt Gore that much, because about 50,000 African Americans in Florida were illegally denied the right to vote and the advantage they would have given to Gore would have more than made up for the Nader votes. And don't say "Well maybe they would have voted for Bush. You don't know." Jeb and Harris knew exactly what they were doing and they knew how it would affect the election. And please don't try to tell me that there's nothing suspicious about having a secretary of state, the person responsible for overseeing elections, who is also the head of a presidential candidate's campaign in her state. That's not just suspicious. That's crooked and it's intentional and it was repeated in other states by the Republicans, as well.

As for the right-wing stooges who are going to try to dismiss the whole thing or call it whining or water under the bridge, dwelling on the past, etc.--just read the Rolling Stone article. Force yourselves to read the whole thing. Rather than say it's all lies without ever reading a word of it, or taking your talking points from the Fox smear machine, try basing your opinions on actual knowledge of what Kennedy has to say. If you can logically or factually refute it, that's fine. But if your only point is to try to silence your opponents and keep people from finding out the truth about election fraud in 2004, don't waste your time. The word's getting out and right-wing lies just aren't working their magic anymore.

Ohio,... 10,000 Democratic voter registration cards may have been shredded.

Link : To Article

Can these fraudulent elections finally be exposed? If so, will our legal institutions have the strength to do their jobs?

If the answer is yes, perhaps my wildest dream (o.k., 2nd wildest...) can come true. No impeachment. That's right. NO Impeachment!

Void the election outright, arrest Chimpy, Cheneyburton and their entire criminal enterprise and charge them with Treason and/or war crimes....establish a temporary executive branch and have the governors of every state appoint replacements to any fraudulently obtained Senate/House seat and start repairing the damage done by these cretins. Start with the CIA and FEMA.

Down the road, prosecutors can file criminal propaganda charges against Rush, O'Lielly, Gibson, Fucker Tarlson, Mann Coulter, et al....

click my little heels....."there's no place like Rome, there's no place like Rome"....

Jesus, I hate these bastards. If we keep picking at them, keep on demanding answers and accountability, we might - after many years - restore our national reputation and reclaim our humanity as a force for good in our world.

I'm having a difficult time with this. You see, I used to live in Ohio from 1972-1981. Kenny Blackwell just happens to be a fellow Alum, graduating from Xavier University, a Jesuit Institution.

I happen to have met him a few times and I also "served" with him from Jan-August of 1980 as he was a City Councilman and I an aide to another City Councilman.

Honestly, I can't say anything bad about the guy.

And I still have good friends as well as family in Cinci and they tell me it was hogwash.

Time For A Tune . . .

He was a friend of mine
He was a friend of mine
His killing had no purpose
No reason, or rhyme
He was a friend of mine
He was in L.A. town
He was in L.A. town
In a crowded kitchen passageway
A gunner shot him down
He died in L.A. town
He never knew my name
He never knew my name
Though I never met him
I knew him just the same
Oh, he was a friend of mine

He was a friend of mine
He was a friend of mine
His killing had no purpose
No reason, or rhyme
He was a friend of mine
He was in Dallas town
He was in Dallas town
Form a sixth floor window
A gunner shot him down
He died in Dallas town
He never knew my name
He never knew my name
Though I never met him
I knew him just the same
Oh, he was a friend of mine

Traditional with additional lyrics by Jim Mcguinn
Byrds Release: 1965

I may hate Chimpy and his criminal cabal, but I never tire of seeing a Village Idiot or his Asst., stagger in, pick his ass, fart and belch (all simultaneously) and say things like:

"Kennedy does not have a good track record for surviving examination of his environmental claims. He does best when he can go on unchallenged, giving the impression that all the cool kids know he's right.

I haven't seen Kennedy's info. I have seen the claims of the last 18 months, and I imagine his article is at least partly based on them. People, they evaporate when exposed to light"

But with NO FACTS to back up his lame-ass, Oxy-Limbaugh Mumbling Points.

Ohio,... post voting but pre - voting tabulation results,.. a Triad Company technician switched a main voting machine tabulators hard drive,.. mid count,.. then the voting results were announced,..

Article Link : Link

#97 - "stagger in, pick his ass, fart and belch (all simultaneously) ... " . . . . . Now That's Coordination ! ! !

WOW! BRAD! What can I say? Eh!? Eh!? Great timing! Great work!

"Did RFK, Jr. write this when he was taking his meds?
How can he be sure he wrote this article? How can I be sure the Kennedy's are doing anything but meds, drinking, and driving. Say hello to Dick C next time you are on the phone.
Anj"

The Bush family is also addicted to drugs idiot-The Pres is a coke snorting alcoholic you idiot-Half the Bush family is on Vicadin, Bushco murdered JFK, give the guy a break.....
Read your history books Anj....not the ones in your high school fool

Am happy to see a Kennedy may wake up some people with this article..hopefully, our country can survive as a Democracy! what a mess we have,and so many people with their heads in the sand!

This is not the first stolen election. The theft in Florida is even more egregious and blatant than in Ohio. After all, Al Gore had more than a half a million votes more than Bush, and if Jeb Bush hadn't been the governor of Florida at the time, Florida would easily have gone to Gore. But Jeb Bush managed to keep it close enough for the the Bush owned Supreme Court judges, Scalia and Thomas, to annoint George W. Bush as your President. The rest of the disaster is history.
If Supreme Court judges were not above the law, Scalia and Thomas would have had a serious problem. There is a law in the US that requires judges to recuse themselves from any case that may come before them in which they, or members of their families, may have an interest. It is not suggested, it is absolutely required.
Scalia's son worked for the law firm representing Bush in the case, while Thomas's wife worked at the Heritage Foundation, which was contracted to vet applicants for jobs in the Bush administration.
Had they recused themselves, as the law required, Al Gore would probably be your president today.

#90 Assistant Village Idiot:

Boy, that was a lot of fluff. Did you realize that nothing you said was actually true? Or was that intentional?

Real smooth, though. Just lay it out there matter-of-factly and watch the unsuspecting ones gobble it up as if you actually have anything concrete to support your claims.

Nice touch at the end, too: "Remember, conspiracies never hold up as well as the participants think they will. If you're counting on hidden information to prove your point, it usually means it's not really there."

How about this: Remember, the crimes that are easiest to get away with are the crimes that nobody believes you would ever try to pull off.

Rig a presidential election? That's crazy. Nobody would even think of doing such a thing. That would be like a candidate bugging his own office and blaming it on his opponent.

Have you noticed how nothing has succeeded in stopping Bush's slide? None of the gimmicks. None of the propaganda bits. People just aren't buying it anymore. The gig is over, so why don't you just go lay down and forget about it.

:)

REMEMBER: IF YOU VOTED FOR NADER, BUSH IS *YOUR FAULT*

That is one of the dumbest remarks thats been made. Are you saying for people to not vote for who they think is the best, vote republican or democrat? Thats the problem and you're the problem. We need more than 2 candidates. If you vote Dem or Rep youre essentially picking the same choice. The system is set up so that you or I can run, but corruption and big business have made it a contest for the wealthy. We need more votes for a 3rd party so a 3rd party can get funded and become a serious contender. And then we wont have to choose between Bush or Kerry. I want a real everyday American who understands the every people of this country. We all are to blame for just accepting it. We need to get behind 3rd and 4th party candidates to keep the others in line.

Anyone who is STILL blaming Nader for Gore's 2000 loss can just fucking eat me. That is one vote I will NEVER regret because Nader had NOTHING to do with the Republicans STEALING THE ELECTION!

Don't you 'tards fucking get it?? The election was STOLEN. Not by Nader. By Bush. Is that sinking in AT ALL???

I am as angry, loathing, seething, and yes, hateful, of these goddamn bastard frat boy half-brain war criminal legacy thugs as anyone. On the scale of "I hate GW Bush & Co" I'm in the 99th percentile. I'm for impeachment. I'm for a trial in the Hague and having these cowardly fucks brought up on international crime charges (and if they do, I hope they drag Kissinger's ass in too). I'd take a second mortgage out for front row center.

But my vote for Nader was in no way a part of the theft that took place. Thousands....tens of thousands, possibly even hundreds of thousands of voters were ILLEGALLY purged from voter rolls by Katherine Harris and Jeb Bush. That wasn't Nader, did you catch it? I feel no guilt, regardless of what idiots might say. If you really think that Nader had one iota of influence in the 2000 election, then you have your head squarely up your ass.

And if you haven't read Nader, you really should. He is a man of principle and a man of ideas. And if more people listened to him, we might be able to solve some of the shit that it seems we're all fighting for. Nader-bashing is Democrat "insider" politics and it is rank. RANK.

"you kept insisting that there wasn't a dimes worth of difference between Democrats (Gore) and Republicans (Bush)"

There ISN'T. There wasn't then, and there isn't now The proof is in the fact that "third parties" are consistently shut out of participating in the "official debates".

After all, you can't have someone who won't toe the line making the bland, two-sides-of-the-same-coin "Major Party Candidates" look like a couple of Stepford People, now, can you?

Get WITH IT. The vote is broken, period. What are you prepared to do about it?

I witnesses GOP voter registration that threw away a voter registration form of a proud Kerry supporter at a 4th of July 2004 street party in Maumee, OH. I reported it to the Lucas County BOE (Paula Hicks) and they refused to investigate.

I would like to know how much more of the Tom Noe dirty, stolen Ohio State BWC money made it into the election. Now that he has pled guilty of illegally funneling, at least, $45,000 to the Bush '04 campaign.

I know that Noe used his coin store as the Lucas County Repo. HQ and Bush '04 HQ, was this inkind donation reported?

I was told that Noe provided free Bush election materials (Signs, stickers, materials and paid campaign workers) for most of NW Ohio that was not reported as required by law.

I heard that Tom Noe used this money to fund Mike Drabik's unregistered PAC "Catholics Against Kerry".

It was reported that Noe gave an improper $70,000 loan to the Lucas County Repo. Party out of this stolen money. What is the status?

It would be interesting to learn if the GOP, ORP, RNC, LCRP or Noe had anything to do with the breakin of the Lucas County Democratic Party and Kerry'04 HQ in Toledo Oct. 13th, 2004 where only the computers with the VoterID, Finance, Volunteer, Election Protection databases and plans were stored. Thieves took only these computers from various areas of the office while bypassing the alarm and breaking the window from the inside. They left other computers, LCD monitors, printers and petty cash behind.

#87 Michael,
Yup, you haven't read enough. Stay at Bradblog for a few days, read. It's all here.

We all know that this article will bring out the usual onslaught of rightwing mud-slingers with their usual arsenal of derision & denial. Well, like georgie said, Bring 'em on. This is one fight that needs fighting.
Thank you, RFK JR, for taking this on. For climbing out on this limb.

BRAD,
Thank you.

Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you Thank you

I gotta say, at one point I agreed that Nader was the problem; but now I know that Nader didn't matter, Gore had enuf votes to win...
They stole it...

I don't consider myself partisan, but I'm sure that the Dems do a better job in the presidencey than the pubs. They appoint people with expertice in the field to the top spots and let them work....
Pubs put ignorent cronies at the top ("heckofajob, Brownie...") and then wonder why stuff messes up...

shw

shw

to those who like to blame it all on Nader --- and Nader voters --- i just want to jump in and say that for awhile i agreed with you. i laughed out loud when Bill Maher and Michael Moore got down on their knees (on Maher's "Real Time" before the '04 election), begging Nader to get out of the race. i thought they were right, too.

the fact is, Nader --- and David Cobb, 2004 presidential candidate for the Green Party --- were right on the money.

because they were on the ticket, they were eligible to challenge the elections results. in most states, only the candidates in the election are allowed to challenge the results and sue for a recount.

you can thank Cobb and Bednarik for the recount in OH '04. and they did it without kerry or the democratic party leadership.

(the OH recount was, of course, also criminally corrupted, for which three people have been indicted: https://bradblog.com/archives/00002661.htm)

consider that next time you spout off that an independent party candidate is (or was) just getting in the way. although it may not look like it to you, there is actually a necessary method to their apparent madness.

I know enough to noe that the gop & disco SUCK . . .

#87 Michael
My thoughts exactly.
I don't know if elections are actually being stolen or not, but I have read some things that are very suspicious and make me very uneasy about the way elections are being handled. Like you I want the machines gone. Too easy to tamper with.
#77
Actually, I did catch that story. I strongly believe in the individuals right to sue when they feel they have been injured by another party. I don't think there should be any limit to damages the "little people" can claim from the rich and the corporations. I think tort reform helps the wealthy and powerful, not the injured. The vet has every right to sue.
I never cared much for the movie mentioned in the story. Bush is the worst president ever, yes, but the film was very contrived.

..."there wasn't a dimes worth of difference between Democrats (Gore) and Republicans (Bush)"

"There ISN'T. There wasn't then, and there isn't now"

Sorry dude, but you're wrong there.

Do you seriously believe a responsible executive branch - such as we had in Clinton/Gore - would've been 'clearing brush' and asking NO questions in August of 2001 after the PDB "BinLaden Determined to Strike Within US"???

Do you seriously believe a President Gore would've sat reading "my pet goat" on 9-11??
Or that Gore would've allowed 150 Saudis to fly home on 9-13 without any substantial questioning? Or that Gore would've pre-emptively invaded Iraq while lying about having cherry-picked intel from the CIA to help justify it?
Or that Gore would've destroyed BOTH FEMA AND THE CIA with our Fueher's Dept. of Homeland Security bullshit?
Or that Gore would've assumed DICTATORIAL POWERS and start "disappearing" people at his own whim??
Or that Gore would've green-lighted TORTURE and abandon the Geneva Conventions??
Or Warrantless Wiretaps and searches, phone record databasing, etc, etc.???

please.

Please.

"I gotta say, at one point I agreed that Nader was the problem;"...shannon

How can you think like that. you have to be truly brainwashed to think that someone voting for who they thought was best was a problem. Your thought process is the problem. Voting for someone just because they are dem or rep is the same as saying im voting for the best looking guy. thats so ignorant. Vote for the best candidate make up your own mind. dont vote for someone just because others are doing it and dont not vote for someone just because you dont think anyone else is.

Dont be one of the sheep. Find out who you are, get some sense of yourself, get some conviction, and make up your own mind. dont just follow the crowd, wake up.

Well if the Kenendy boy has just woken up, we must support his cause.

Afterall it is these Kenendy's who have ruined America and allowed the Criminal cabal to run riot in the United States of Mafia.

RFK Jr. must try and watch his back. These Criminals will stop at nothing to get rid of him.

He must team up with AL GORE and become his number 2 in the next Presidential elections. They can't kill everyone can they???

We need a coherent and accountable administration not the Criminals in place.

Go for it young man. God bless your efforts to keep America and the World informed.

JBWatson

hey ...Blow Me, I'm Irish!

The fact of the matter is we dont know what Gore would've done. You're just making up scenerios then comparing them to a real life situation. And I bet Nader would've done something different, too. It doesnt matter. Rep's or Dem's dont have our best interests in mind. We need to shake up the system by supporting 3rd & 4th parties. Look at dem's & rep"s they all go to the same schools, take the same classes, speak the same language, and dont have to worry about the everyday problems of the everyday Americans. We need to elect someone who truly appreciates getting the job. rep's & dem's just expect it. a 3rd party would go the extra mile to assure us we made a good choice. try to remember, this is still a democracy.

republicrat or
democan
they both are the same
dems stand for nothing
pubs for wealthy gain
its all a game
religions control your brain
God is God
can't be defined by man
we won't attack Iran
but Israel will
when IRan retaliates
we will defend
thus starts the end
i guess this school thing
may have been for naught
I get sworn in tommorrow
just passed the Cali bar
I'm 26 years old
I was taught to aim for the stars
also I'm black
no rims on my car
yes i have a jump shot
but grades kept me on top
and i guess this is a rap
more like a rhyme
went to law school
only to say
f the law dude
who has the money
we write the laws we want to
screw you
the average American
the laws aren't for you
they are for me my friend
and my friends that can spend
now that my color doesn't matter
at this level
its all about class
income, assets the like - you know
so i can get over
so i can drive a rover
so you can be poor and play my toy soldier
yes
im being sarcastic
but our politicians
all of em - both sides - need they a$s kicked
constitution has been shittted on
mis-spelling no - avoidance of censorship
presidential signing statements
war without declarations
from wmd, to liberty
when Abu Garaib shows how compassionate we be
please see
until America gets together and talks about
slavery
and blacks and whites can rectify and move on
we go still be singing these war songs
I don't wont reparations - I'll earn my own
but we have to recognize present circumstances
are because of what happened so long
ago
cocaine was put in slave food
so they would work harder
so blacks have heart problems
1 example, a million more
we tired, very poor and sore
years of rape, so butt cheeks flake
stop cops from terrorizing my community
give us decent schools
be a little bit softer on weed
and we cool
then smart brothers look me
could start teaching to the rest of the fools
that's shooting and slanging and hating yo school
that's what happens when you won't hire us
and the books are see through
the truth is
we have daily hypocrisies that you
have been conditioned in reality
not to see
a lot of you are white
so i call it the white complex
after being a master for 4 hundred years
you have a master mindset
unfortunently
some of us think like slaves
brothers like me
you think we do
we don't obey
I learned the lesson of MLK
I'll go the back way
do this
do that
no to this , no to that
don't worry about what i do
just know i control how you act
for cats like me
i just grin and smile
brain is on warp spped in the meanwhile
and that's not good
so lets sit down and talk
before the issues blow up -
like nukes in the Middle East
for the world to be there
first America must be at peace
you think you are entitled
NOT YOU
you don't control jack
the guy reading this
you are probably the nicest cat
call it the matrix
because of my skin color
I'm not pre-conditioned call me morpheus
what is the definition of a continent-
then Europe is not one
but it is when you look at a map
why is Africa so small
well in reality its not
America and Israel are the same
kill the natives and take soil
How was the founding father's all over freedom
when slaves built all the buildings
every single one
ideals
man falls short
but that's man not God
people have forgotten
how sad
To all you so called Christians out there
Try actually reading your Bible
I want you to listen, please listen here
Jesus was the example
not just some idol
the way to live
not just a cross on your neck
to love God is to be like Jesus
and this means loving everybody
just because you "love Jesus"
does not mean you love God
especially when other nations you are trying
to steal from and rob
dictate, control and extort from
Jesus helped the weak
he hung around the sick
how many AIDS patients have you visited yet
How many strangers have you said hi to
who have you sacrificed for
the meek
will inherit the Earth
democracy is a farce
of course the voting machines work perfectly
they work for those who can control them
wake up America
your head is in the sand
while a mid air maneuvering missle is coming for your exposed as$

Bush stealing Florida in 2000 and Ohio in 2004 is not what killed democracy in America. Democracy died when not enough people cared.

Havn't we gotten our hopes up so many times before? Most of them are in on it. Either they are willing participants, or they are blackmailed.

How many times unqualified nominies have been confirmed. Over and over again, right?

How many dems stood up in 2000,2002 and 2004 when the majority of the people cheated out of their vote, were their most loyal supporters. Isn't this really telling?

What did kerry say in response to peoples worries about the election fraud in 2000, repeating itself in 2004. " we'll have lawyers all over the place".
This statement was a favorite in the black community.

Why would anybody think about supporting him again, is beyond me.

Why is it that we know of the voting fraud, the eavedropping, the fake war, all the lying, the greed, the Scams over and over again and nothing is done about it. Why doesn't cross a lot of our minds, that the politicians are being spied upon, blackmailed. both repubs, dems editors, law enforcers, etc.

These criminals will do anything to they fill necessary to stay in power. Including committing mass murder upon the american people.

Maybe this information will have some tration if not it really does not matter

I am looking forward to reading this article. This story never gets old for me. The Republicans are terrified about the upcoming election. The timing is perfect for this story, people are ready to listen now. But the screams of the Right will be deafening. As to Nader, where in the hell has he been? If a third party is ever going to be taken seriously, it's "leader" can't just pop up for a presidential election, then effectively disappear from sight after it's over, and expect that to be enough. Where was he in 2004? Just saying...

The decider Bush is a mutant President.

So what do you do about it?

Just get your ass to the polls and make sure your vote is counted in November 2006 election. Throw the bums out and let's have some "real" congressional investigations of the allegations of vote fraud in 2004 and perhaps even 2000.

Maybe there's enough there to impeach the crook.

Not to mention the need for investigation of the numerous other scandals that the current Republican congress has choosen to ignore. There are no checks and balances with this crew of vipers.

rolling stone ...snow ball ...whatever starts the avalanche ...here's hoping .

DEMOCRACY NOW COVERS E-VOTING!

Very lengthy segment includes interview with Bruce Funk and David Dill!

Democracy Now E-voting Segment

DJ

Fuck you. FUCK YOU. 100,000 people are dead because of my vote? FUCK. YOU.

Idiot. I would bust your fucking nose open if you said that to my face.

Get a fucking life.

I'm really glad to hear about this, Robert Kennedy, Jr. is continuing his family tradition of helping Americans instead of the "elites".

We need to find every way to generate interest in voting integrity and get rid of blackbox voting for elections with auditable paper trail.

Thank you Brad for being steadfast in keeping election fraud which is the basis of the bloodbath in Iraq and Afghanistan and the destruction of our military and America by the puppet masters of bush junior. :plain:

...SOUL
Your hostility is as misplaced as was your vote for GWB.
GWB lied and misled and people died and are dying (DJ - "...at the hand of this madman").
Don't plame the messenger.

Please note Kerry's comments. He says he would have taken legal action if it could have been shown that election fraud made the difference in Ohio.

In other words, election fraud is O.K. if you can't prove you would have won otherwise. That's the same as saying it's O.K. to steal money from someone if that person can't prove that you stole it.

Kerry sounds more like a complete ass every day. Thank you, RFK, Jr. Your dad would be proud of you.

Watch the trolls folks
They'll say something like "there is no difference in the two parties" and then go on to put down the Dems without mentioning the Pukes at all
WATCH OUT
Most everyone had real good points on this thread, I liked most of them anyway
Soul, its just someone with a different opinion (with a little ad hominem) relax, they also want in-fighting too
you know, divide and conquer, that IS the RNC/DLC plan for total Corporate domination of the People's Government

The right-wing-spin-machine must be up as late as I am this morning trying to figure ways to slime Robert Kennedy Jr. They’re all going to be flailing around like stoned-out acid heads on pot,(Christopher Hitchens style)! Get the children to bed, quick!

I hate to admit it Robert, but I’ve been throwing away all of the mail I get (and it’s a lot, believe me), concerning the environment and some of the other issues you’ve been great to expose. It just seemed silly to focus narrowly on any issue when getting rid of this Bush regime would solve ALL of the issues that give me high blood pressure.

That’s why I am more excited this morning then I’ve been in years. With all the “news” organizations HAVING to cover the problems with these voting machines lately, it’s going to be very hard for the MSM to ignore your focus on election fraud.

You know they’re going to drag you through the mud, but I also know YOU DON’T GIVE A DAMN!

Thank you sir!

Kudos to Howard Dean and Dennis Kucinich. I nearly cleaned out my bank account for you guys and I’ll never be sorry.

I think I gave Kerry about $20. I’m not sorry about that either after hearing that pathetic quote!

Brad mate

Fuck, a lot of comment!

Go Bobby jnr.!

DOWN WITH BUSH!

Here is Proof of the Top Secret Kerry non-response Bias in 2004 Midnight Exit Poll.

Taking into account the finite limits on the supply of voters in each category of the midnight exit poll here is proof that all major rights to claim non-response bias in the National 2004 exit poll belong to John Kerry instead of media darling George Bush.

http://customer.wcta.net/roberty/return.htm

Ok, yes, voting for Nader elected Bush, TRUE. Looking for a knight in shinning armour out there somewhere ignores the fact that history tells us that the two parties are DIFFERENT. Yes, there are crooks in both parties, BUT, if you vote republican, you vote for the ultra rich. If you vote democratic, you vote for the majority.

The country went wrong when Line Dancing became popular.

I understand that referring to actual numbers, poll results and vote totals, is forbidden by the pact between unhinged leftist Democrats and their media lapdogs, but just how stupid can it get? Four hundred THOUSAND votes disappeared?!?! From what? Ohio voter turnout increased sharply in 2004 from the previous presidential election, particularly in Democratic areas. In Cuyahoga County, Kerry got 448,000, as compared to Gore's 359,000. Bush received merely 30,000 more than he got in 2000. The ground games of both parties were in overdrive and the Dems did a little better, whittling Bush's 180,000 vote margin against Gore down to 120,000. Bush led by 2-3 points in the aggregate of polls for the state. Somehow, it is suspicious when the candidate who was leading actually manages to win, but had the candidate who was trailing pulled off an upset, that would not have been an anomaly. Innumeracy--sheer innumeracy. But then, nobody--absolutely NOBODY--ever said our current crop of Kennedys had any brains. Privilege and arrogance, yes.

Do punk idiots like Dj and Monstersound NOT understand that the election was rigged. That Gore won the election in Florida? Just what the hell is wrong with you people??? Gore won. Gore won. Gore won. Don't you get it? Kerry won. Kerry won. Kerry won. Don't you get it. Katherine Harris. Jeb Bush. Kenneth Blackwell. What part of that don't you understand? Where is Nader in this equation? Nowhere.

Tools. I spent a year knocking on doors for Howard Dean, until his own party did him in because he wasn't "electable" and it was sick. It was a sick mentality that took a growing populist movement and sowed seeds of doubt instead of nurturing it. Dean's success would have shaken up the party too much, so they killed it. I'd be willing to bet Dean would have fought on in Ohio. You know, like David Cobb and Michael Badnarik did. Like Ralph Nader did.

I don't get people sometimes. It's right there in front of your face (STOLEN ELECTION) but you want to attack Ralph Nader and those who voted for him (which I didn't do in '04, but defend the right of those who did to do so). It's just stupid.

If you want to blame someone other than the REAL culprits, why don't you blame the millions of people who didn't even exercise their right to vote? In 2000 AND in 2004. I can't even count the number of doors I knocked on ON ELECTION DAY where people flat-out said "nah, I'm not going to vote."

Bradblog webdesigners. Increase the font size and turn off this yellow and green! This is too difficult to read!!!!

Bradblog webdesigners. Increase the font size and turn off this yellow and green! This is too difficult to read!!!! All across the web you can read those comments about your site.

TOO HARD TO READ!

My biggest fear is that prior to the 2008 elections there will be another "terrorist" attack of such a magnitude that Bush will declare marshall law postponing elections indefinitely. He cannot afford to leave office for his day of reckoning then will surely come. Bush is confident in all of his decisions because he is confident he will never have to answer for any of them. He is after all above the law you know and he is the decider as well. Think it could never happen in the USA? If someone had predicted our current situation 10 years ago would you have belived it possible then?

Brian replied: "The fact of the matter is we dont know what Gore would've done."

An obvious statement, but it certainly doesn't offer any real counterpoint at all. It's not that I disagree with folks who want to see 3rd & 4th parties having more influence on our political system, but I do take issue with the assertion that Dems and Repugnantcans are "all the same".

That view is not supported by even the most casual review and comparison between the Clinton/Gore years of peace and prosperity and the criminally negligent incompetence, shamelessly corrupt and murderous Reign of the Chimp.

"You're just making up scenerios then comparing them to a real life situation."

I'm not making up scenarios - I'm taking ACTUAL situations and making a reasonable comparison to how differently things would've played out with Gore.

It is completely reasonable to compare the competent leadership of Clinton/Gore to the idiocy of Chimp/Cheney and consider what actions a competent executive branch would've taken - and I maintain that TORTURE, SECRET ARRESTS, WARRANTLESS WIRETAPS AND PRE-EMPTIVE WAR (against a country that had nothing to do with Osama and posed NO threat to the U.S.) would NOT have been part of the plan!

I am going to read the article first, then I will make my comments about what it says and does not say.

Kudos to all who have kept this candle burning even with the stormy winds of the republican dictatorship blowing out as much light as it can.

For Ronald Wieck: I don't know what you mean by the "aggregate of polls (in Ohio)" showing Bush with a 2-3% lead. That's a misleading statement at best, outright false at worst.

The poll that matters is the LAST ONE taken. In that poll, Ohio was a dead heat, with Kerry having gained almost 2% in the last 48 hours before the vote was taken. Any poll expert will tell you that a challenger gaining ground at the end will win when the polls are even...every time.

On the subject of Ralph Nader: I voted for Nader in Connecticut in 2000 because I knew Gore was going to win the state anyway. How in the name of Harold Stassen did I contribute to Bush winning the election, given that Gore did in fact carry Connecticut? We have an Electoral College system in the United States, friends...a vote for Nader was a vote for Bush only in battleground states, and I'm not convinced (though it's possible) that Nader votes carried Florida for Bush in 2000.

Even if it were provable, I'd never regret voting for Nader. He's one of the few public figures with enough gonads to call a fraud a fraud. Kerry? Dean? Gore? Clinton? They're all looking ahead to 2008. Good luck, folks...Karl Rove is looking ahead, too, and he's got a plan for rigging that one.
Count on it.

For the record, here's a list of prominent citizens
who have called the 2004 election a fraud:

Robert F. Kennedy, Jr.
Ralph Nader
David Cobb
Michael Bednarik
Brad Friedman
Teresa Kerry
Jim Lampley
Bob Fitrakis
John Aravosis
Mark Crispin Miller
Barbara Boxer
Stephanie Tubbs Jones
Greg Palast
Craig Roberts
Marcy Winograd

Here's a list of prominent Americans who have questioned one or more aspects of the 2004 election, but have stopped short of calling it a fraud for one reason or another:

John Conyers
Keith Olbermann
Howard Dean
Christopher Hitchens (believe it or not)
Clint Curtis
Jimmy Carter
Al Gore
Russ Feingold
Bev Harris
Ion Soncho
Debra Bowen
Professor David Dill

The following have accepted the 2004 election outcome and are "moving on" to the next fraud.

John Kerry
John Edwards
Bill Clinton (said Bush won "fair and square")
Hillary Clinton
Donna Brazile
Dianne Feinstein
Barack Obama
Steny Hoyer
Harry Reid
James Carville
Paul Begala
George Stephanopoulos
Chris Dodd ("I looked into fraud. Nothing there.")
EVERY MAJOR NEWSPAPER AND TV NETWORK
EVERY REPUBLICAN, WITHOUT EXCEPTION

As I said, I don't regret having voted for Nader.

How about Chertoff cutting anti-terrorist funding, and now it's coming out that post 9/11 workers are dying, after Bush's EPA head pronounced the area safe to work in??? More American deaths chalked up to the Bush administration. What do all you rightwingers have to say about that???

BTW, RFK, Jr. is one of the squeakiest/clean politicians going. They're not going to find any dirt on him. They can only fabricate something. RFK, Jr. is genuine, beyond a doubt.

Thats funny RLM, in your last list of names it looks like the whos who of the DLC (Dems that Love Corporations) part of the Party

RFK, Jr. is like is old man, but seemingly without the political ruthlessness. I agree he's the perfect liberal to carry the ball on election fraud.

RFK, Sr. had personal ambition that his son doesn't seem to have. His run for the presidency wasn't really based on Vietnam (he was a hawk to begin with, and fiercely anti-Communist all along). I suspect he realized his deportation of Carlos Marcello as Attorney General, on top of his earlier pursuit of Mafia hoods as a lawyer, had led to JFK's assassination...and he felt guilty as hell about it.

RFK, Jr. is a clean Gene, as Big Dan says. Like his dad, he doesn't have much of a sense of humor, but election fraud isn't a laughing matter. The goons on the right will attack him for sure, but all the Kennedys have developed a thick skin against personal attacks by now. A huge breakthrough.

Even though we have kept informed on elections '00 and '04, it all still makes us feel like we are living in a make believe world. Seems like there are some powerful people orchestrating the whole thing. I would like to know who they are.

why would anyone want to complain? look at every thing else thats going on,people complain no one listens or does anything about it.most people know every one in wash.d.c is corrupt to the core,from the murdering son of a bitch bush to the lowest page boy.this is not my understanding of our govt.they should all be hung from the lamp posts and left hanging forever.

After the 2000 elections there was all this talk about fixing the flaws. Did it happen? Hell no - not only were they not fixed, things got worse.
Now you would think that would set-off some alarm bells. Hardly, with the lack of accountability the crooks simply continued on.
The real fault I believe lies with the American people. When we were first presented with machines with no paper trail we should have smashed them with sledge-hammers! It's beyond my understanding just how stupid we the people can be to simply trust the results on something as important as our votes.
Stalin had it right, "It's not the people that vote that matter, it's the people that count the votes that matter."
Now, with just a few short months left we expect this problem to be fixed after years of neglect? Pathetic.

Bob Fitrakis and Richard Hayes Phillips, both who have spent an immense amount of time investigating the fraud in Ohio will also be featured in the article.

For those who still dismiss the theft, I would encourage them to read Mark Crispin Miller's "Fooled Again" and get ready for more discussion on the subject with Greg Palast's upcoming (June 6) book "Armed Madhouse"! Palast does an excellent job not only on Ohio but delves deely into New Mexico as well.

Amy Goodman at Democracy Now covered the mess in Utah yesterday. Thats where the Utah Sec. of Elections for 23 years was fired by state officials after a closed door meeting with Diebold executives. This, after he exposed the vulnerability of the voting machines to be hackable that ended up producing the "Harri Hursti report". They are so vulnerable that it was not exposed how it was done because it is so easy to do.
If you're not familiar with this vulnerability, read here on Brad blog and move on to Blackboxvoting.org for more details.
We need to be screaming about this!!!!!!

Good stuff, I'll look forward to Kennedy's article. In the meantime there has been some great, if largely ignored, work on the same issue.

These make great reading. Starting with the House Judiciary Committee Democratic Staff Report, What Went Wrong in Ohio.

Last year, Harper's gave us None Dare Call it Stolen, and The Nation published Gore Vidal's essay, Something Rotten in Ohio.

Someday, perhaps, SOMEone will listen.

I always mention this. How do we know Dem primaries aren't hacked? Dean was up by landslide proportions, and then Skull & Bones Kerry came from nowhere. Dean/Bush debates, Dean would've made a fool of Bush.

If we all know there's vote fraud, then it's not limited to GOP vs. Dem elections, it can be in ANY election.

They probably don't want Clint Curtis against Feeney, so the same people who rig the big elections, can rig it so Curtis loses in the primary.

Were there any pre-election polls showing Dean over Kerry, but Kery won? No one ever thinks about this. Do you think they have some ethics rules, where they won't hack a primary???

P. Edward Murray, did you read any of the Blackwell links???

John Kerry is the culprit here. Millions of us ordinary citizens knew with reasonable certainty that the early polls in Ohio and in other "red" states were correct in forecasting a "President Kerry" and that the election has been stolen mainly through electronic chicanery. But not John Kerry! Is he dumb or just a wimp, a man whose glory days had long passed. He could have joined in with Cobb and other third party candidates early on and perhaps have turned things around instead of mind numbingly conceding on November 3, carrying on about how Bush called offering him an olive branch--Laughable! Only a fool like Kerry could believe such swill.

Bottom line: If "Lieutenant" Kerry had declared war instead of peace on November 3, the whole nation would have been better informed of their dwindling
democracy then instead of now after 2 more years of the disastrousBush Regime.

Dope that he is, Kerry still cannot make a definitive statement about being duped----too embarassed to do so? IMHO, yes.

For Captain USA: Who are the powerful people orchestrating the whole thing? My list contains familiar names and less familiar ones. It does not include George W. Bush, because I think he's merely pawn on the chessboard. He might even believe he really won in 2000 and 2004.

FAMILIAR NAMES

Karl Rove
James Baker III (consigliore #1 for Bush Mafia)
Jeb Bush
Katherine Harris
Dick Cheney
William Kristol (neo-con legatee)
Rupert Murdoch
Donald Rumsfeld
Antonin Scalia
Robert Ney
J. Kenneth Blackwell
Walden "Wally" O'Dell (emeritus)
Tom DeLay (emeritus)
James Dobson (keeps Christian right onboard ship)
George H.W. Bush (senior adviser)
Bill Clinton (planning ahead for Hillary)
Hillary Clinton (ditto)
John Kerry (guilty via passive neglect)

LESS FAMILIAR NAMES

Bill Keller (New York Times editor in chief)
Mark "Thor" Hearne (consigliore #2 for Bush Mafia)
David DeStefano (Ney colleague, outed by Brad)
Thomas Noe
Bernadette Noe
Theodore Olson (pleaded at Supreme Court, 2001)
John Yoo (law professor/apologist of last resort)

Thanks Brad. Thank you Bobby Jr. Your father would be very proud of you for your courageous stand.

In 2000, why didn't Gore want the entire state recounted, but only certain precincts? Because he knows he would have lost the state. Did everyone forget that Jeb Bush won easily twice? Was that fraud too? If you believe Jeb's victories were also fraud, then you are just not facing reality and you want to believe you are helpless.

Why is it every time the Democrats lose it's some sinister conspiracy?

So if the Dems win back the House and Senate in '06, it's a clean election. But if they fail it's the evil Republicans secretly stealing it?

Blaming unprovable conspiracy theories on lost elections will not help the Democrats win over the American people. It just makes the Dems look like sore losers.

If you think the radical left elements of the party(RFKjr. etc) will lead the Dems to victory, I believe you will be whining about stolen elections for many years to come.

National elections are won in the center.

Also, I find it ironic that RFKjr. is the author of the voter fraud of 2000 and 2004. I wonder if he will include as background the fraud of 1960, where the Dems stole Illinois and the election for JFK?

A young fifteen year old female

makes these videos,...

Bradblog mentioned here,.. Link

Another culprit I would like to add to the list--Terry McAuliff. As a Kerry Fundraiser (to my chagrin) I was invited to a post election thank you party. I cornered McAuliff and asked him about the "stolen election" and he laughed me off, said he had seen the raw polling data (a bald-faced lie) and Bush had won. With such people advising our gullible candidate, is it no wonder Kerry refused to fight.

The voting machines in Mass. are all rigged. Both Senators and all 10 Congressmen are Democrats,
as are a vast majority of state senators and Congressmen. I demand an investigation. Maybe we can get Senator Chappaquiddick away from his Chivas long enough to...

Michael Moore lies! Maimed National Guardsman suing!
Angry liberals demand voting reform because they keep losing national elections!

None of the "More" links on this page (https://bradblog.com/archives/00002891.htm)
work.

>>I know enough to noe that the gop & disco SUCK . . .

Who taught you how to spell, Dan Quayle? You can't
spell "know"? Moonbats!

Want proof that the movement to stop these criminals is growing?

Go back and look at the number of comments on some of the old posts, back when the original "6 or 7" came into being...then look at the number of comments on this thread alone.

Yep, the avalanche has started.

We've not won the fight yet - but you can bet we're getting their attention.

I know we're all hesitant to hope at this point, but ya gotta admit, it feels good, doesn't it?

Californians, open you eyes! Bruce McPhearson, the Republican Secretary of State is NOW executing on the SAME PLAN that Blackwell did in Ohio!
1) He is supressing Democratic votes by implimenting a zero tolerance registration process (if you move, have one digit or letter not matching DMV record, you can't vote)
2) Illegally certified Diebold machines (see www.blackboxvoting.org for details).
3) Allows hackable evoting machines to be transported by $11.95/hr workers (all it takes is a few minutes to plant a virus)

Call to Action for Californians
Call your assembly person AND state senator to demand that the evoting machines be pulled
Write your local paper, ask for front page articles on this issue

BTW, Kerry-Okie - re: #168 - You don't recognize the pun on "noe"? Oh you've got some catching up to do!

Go to the search engine at the top of this page and type "noe".

Happy reading!

You guys just can't admit that you lost, can you?

Waaaaaaaa

STFU Babies

On January 6th, 2005 when the ROBOTS in Congress (less Kerry who conveniently was visiting IRAQ) were accepting the stolen fraudulent electors, a peaceful demonstration organized by David Lytel called REDEFEAT BUSH took place across from the US Capital.

A handful of State Representatives most prominant John Conyers Jr. and Maxine Waters along with Senator Barbara Boxer stood up against the rigged US election. A number of informed speakers spoke at this event calling the 2004 election a THEFT which included the late Reverand Bill Moss who had a election protection case against Bush in OHIO and Clint Curtis who talked about being hired by Republican Tom Feeny ultimately to show him how to hack the vote in Florida. It was a peaceful event however the only state Congress even talked about was Ohio thus the other 3 swing states of Florida, New Mexico, and Nevada never received ANY ACKNOWLEDGEMENT.

It's an intelligent person who changes his opinion or view in light of new fact and the underlying truth upon discovery. The Robots in Congress did nothing with the exception of a few bulldogs. The Republidem party to this day DOES NOT ADMIT THIS SHIT IN THE FACE OF CONVENTIONAL WISDOM therefore they must be removed from office. This is after we fix our election system so our vote is actually the will of "we the people."

>>Tom Noe

ah, OK, understood; prob. best to put it in quotation marks to emphasize it's a pun and not just a mis-spelling

Wow! I am amazed at the number of trolls that are hitting this site! I come here frequently to read posts, but being a very moderate type politically, I mostly just enjoy reading about what a twit Bush is ( I am in the 71% that disapprove) and never get into the "rigged vote" debate. You Bradbloggers must have really hit a nerve with the minority of Bush supporters because...dang! They are all running to this blog like moths to a flame. It is fun to watch them attempt to change the subject and bait people into non-constructive discussion. I never thought much about the rigged vote issue before. Now I think there must be something to it or these folks from blogs.for.bush wouldn't be here attempting to derail discussion.
Interesting.

>>You guys just can't admit that you lost, can you?

I'm gonna recommend a book to you guys, and it's by a Democrat: A National Party No More by Zell Miller. He knew even before the '04 election that it's impossible for the Dems to win national elections without the once-solid South (It would have helped Gore in '00 had he won his HOME STATE, for example. That would have given him the White House.) And Zell's "A Deficit of Decency"
has his memorable GOP convention speech. "Armed with what? Spitballs?"

Insert county-by-county maps of the '00 and '04 elections here: mostly solid red with a few blue splotches.

Thanks Brad for hanging in there when few were listening...In the revolution to birth this country you would have been doing your part to make it happen. Now you are helping to get our country back. The trolls prove that your site allows dissent. Great day for US.

Nobody even mentions Colorado... You know we're supposed to be this ultra conservative state - a lock for Republicans right? Yet here, everything overwhelmingly went to the Democrats. Even all of the ballot initiatives went to the Democrats, (even those backed and heavily promoted by our Republican Governor). We even voted to increase taxes on two of these initiatives. But somehow we elected Bush? It never made any sense to me. I knew of no one, not even my family and friends who voted for W the first time, nobody who voted for George junior. Colorado was called for Bush before Boulder was even counted, which ended up something like 90% Kerry. We had hundreds of reported voter incidents but I've heard no one talk about this. And our machines were just replaced beore the election...

No way our country elected this fool. I just can't get myself to believe it.

My comment that Bush led in the aggregate of state polls for Ohio is completely accurate. If an individual poll showed the two candidates tied, that result is well within the poll's margin of error, given that Bush won by 2%.

Many of the people here who invent nonsense about Republican vote fraud overlook inconvenient facts, such as the hamfisted broad daylight theft of a governorship in the state of Washington. Oh, I'm sorry--that crime was perpetrated by the party of Peace and Inclusion. It doesn't count.

The Cleveland Plain-Dealer published a comprehensive study of all the canards in circulation regarding the Ohio result. There are precisely TWO counties in the state, Lucas and Hardin, that use Diebold machines. Bush won the smaller one; Kerry won the larger.

The bi-partisan election board in every county is responsible for the requisition of voting machines. Ken Blackwell has NOTHING to do with it. As Democrat commissioner William A. Anthony, Jr. put it, "Why would I want to disenfranchise my own people?"

Please explain how Ohio's sharply increased turnout, particularly in Democratic areas, suggests disenfranchisement.

RRadio #176

Until a republican speaks at the democratic national convention selecting the next president, no rational person would call Zell Miller anything but nuts.

He challenged a news reporter to a duel on national television during the republican convention, where he spoke on behalf of preznit blush ... and we now have the worst president in six decades (link here), or ever.

Zell Miller needs to join the hypocrit party, if even they would have him.

I just hope those in the minority who voted for the worst president in six decades realize they lost. They LOST big time, and so did the rest of us.

This truth will also pass ... before the public eyes. Not that it will change their minds about preznit blush ... they already know about this republican dictatorship.

Anj Taylor's post is a clear admission that Anj Taylor believes the voter fraud is clearly true.

When you CAN'T counter the facts, attack the messenger. Obviously, Anj is admitting that there is no resoning contradiction to the fact of voter fraud.

Thank you Anj for confirming the facts of the voter fraud.

A (fallacious) ad hominem argument has the basic form:

1. A makes claim X.
2. There is something objectionable about A.
3. Therefore claim X is false.

I know a great deal about what happened in Washington state. The election was too close to call without a complete and tedious ballot by ballot count. In the end one candidate had more votes than the other. Granted it was by a very small margin, but then thats why we count votes after all. To see who got the most votes.

In a presidential election is is more difficult to count each and every vote, one by one. I still don't have an opinion about 2000 or 2004. What we need is a reliable way to track votes and make sure every vote is counted. We should not be left to wonder if it was accurate or not. Every American should be satisfied that their little ol' vote was counted. Thats as American as apple pie and baseball.

Colorado is only one of many states who the "Help America Vote Act" helped cheaters cheat in. Don't expect too much attention even though your judgment is very likely good.

it's great that the 2004 election is being dissected. but this isn't the first election bush's people has stolen. doesn't anybody remember bush, his brother, that shrew katherine harris and bush's flunkies stealing florida in 2000? huh? anyone? :crazy:

...Margaret G said on 5/31/2006 @ 1:40pm PT...

"Election fraud of this magnitude would constitute a conspiracy to overthrow the government, treason, and may require the death penalty if proven."
================================
I concur.

But, as mentioned earlier, this possibly makes the Conservaturds (accurate term) a wounded, cornered animal.

Things could get dicey if it looks like the Truth is going to come out--Look for the C-Turds to do some real dirt to save themselves--They will stop at nothing to save their own necks while destroying & looting the country.

And yes, it's Treason, boys & girls.

174.0 Kerry-Okie - I hairs ya . . .

Kestrelbrighteyes #169 said:

"Want proof that the movement to stop these criminals is growing?

Go back and look at the number of comments on some of the old posts, back when the original "6 or 7" came into being...then look at the number of comments on this thread alone.

Yep, the avalanche has started.

We've not won the fight yet - but you can bet we're getting their attention.

I know we're all hesitant to hope at this point, but ya gotta admit, it feels good, doesn't it?"

I'm reluctant to get my hopes up. But if for no other reason, this article will be tough to ignore, and awareness will be raised because of the prominence of Rolling Stone and to a lesser extant RFK Jr. That is always a good thing.

So yeah, it does feel good )

Also, someone mentioned all the "trolls" here. They are here because they believe that this is a serious issue with good facts to back it up. Note also the attempt to dilute the comments here with the Nader V. Dems fights. Anything to distract! Let's see if the Rush/Fox/Pundent machine gets put in play --- that will really tell us the Republican's state of mind and level of fear.

For Ronald Wieck: Nobody has to invent "nonsense about Republican vote fraud." The evidence is right there in front of our noses. Of course, we could always choose to ignore the evidence, or shoot the messenger who produces it.

EVIDENCE..."an outward sign," or "something that furnishes proof." Not invented. Right there to see.

Vote-flipping: All day long in Youngstown, episodic elsewhere throughout the state. Virtually every claim of a flipped vote (98%) benefited Bush. That is mathematically impossible without fraud. The laws of mathematics may not be invented. They are absolute.

Allocation of Machines: Contrary to your statement, Blackwell had EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THIS. All requests went through his office. While officials at Democratic precincts were asking for more on Election Day, over 80 machines sat idle in a warehouse and were never used. Republican precincts had all the machines they needed, though.

Impossible Anomalies: Ridiculously high vote counts appeared for third-party candidates in Cuyahoga County, at Kerry's expense. Judge Ellen Connelly, an under-financed African American who was almost unknown outside of Cleveland, ran ahead of Kerry in Southern Ohio. Bush was credited with 4,000 votes out of whole cloth in one precinct. There are zero examples of Kerry benefiting from any anomaly anywhere in the state. Again, this is mathematically impossible, but perfectly explainable by deliberate fraud.

Warren County Lockdown: Media excluded from vote count. based on phony warning of terrorist attack (F.B.I. confirmed warning was phony). Magically, votes appear for Bush at end of evening in Warren County. By the way, the same thing happened in Hackett-Schmidt congressional race, and guess who got those magical votes? You know.

Rigged Recount: Blackwell and friends arrange recount in violation of state law (not even denied at this point). Precinct samples rigged to escape recount requirements. Why do this if Bush really won Ohio? Why not cooperate with the recount?

Only answer: Bush really didn't win Ohio. Well, I think you know that.

Wow. So many trolls.
"It just makes the Dems look like sore losers"

Who cares what it "looks like"? Good job missing the point by a mile.

And recommending a book by zell miller?! Ha! Right!
We're all gonna run out & buy THAT one!

Good to see you again, Supersoling!!!

Ronald Wieck has all the Republican talking points, and THEY ARE ALL LIES.

Just IGNORE his posts --- they are all lies and deceptions and misstatements. The pre-election polls showed Kerry pulling to even (yes, within the margin of error) on Election Day and the exit polls showed Kerry ahead by 3-4% (over the margin.)

The "bi-partisan" election boards are ANYTHING but, with many supposed "Democrats" on those boards having been Republicans right up until the 2004 election. BLACKWELL was ALL OVER those boards with letters and threats and it's all documented! THERE ARE COPIES in most of the books on the Ohio theft.

DieBold is a RED HERRING. They were just a small part of the theft. Pre-punched BUSH ballots (there are pictures of them at freepress), overuse of never-counted Provisional Ballots in Dem areas, moved voting sites, lack of machines, secret counting in Warren County due to (false and denied by the FBI) terrorist threats, et al. There were more than 100 different ways that Ohio was stolen --- DieBold machines were just one.

There is so much evidence of theft in Ohio that no rational NON-Republcian will even try to debate the subject.

LIARS like Ronald Wieck should be forced to pay $1 for each of their lies. They would be broke immediately.

God I hate trolls, especially the ones who are assigned the role of "reasonable and intelligent thinker who just can't find the facts." I guess these intelligent thinkers can't READ! There are five to ten great books and ten dozen well researched PHD-level papers on the thefts in 2000 and 2004.

Let's just buy lots of copies of ROLLING STONE and all the great books and GET THE WORD OUT. Eventually people like Ronald Wieck will have to slink back to the caves they crept out of.

Charlie L
Portland, OR

Good to see you too Peg C! )
Nice to see a few familiar names from the original 6 or 7
Have to admit though, that my eyes are taking a while to re-adjust to the green!

Comment 179 Ronald Wriek - READ UP BIG BOY

How the GOP stole America's 2004 election and is rigging 2008, by Bob Fitrakis and Harvey Wasserman: $12
The "Woodward & Bernstein of the 2004 Election"
-- Rev. Jesse Jackson

A Special Investigative Report Revealing Massive Voter Theft, Fraud and Illegalities in Ohio's Presidential Balloting

The theft of the 2004 election has been catalogued, footnoted and thoroughly documented in more than 180 bullet points compiled by the Ohio-based investigative reporters in their shocking new compendium. The special digest may serve as the touchstone for all future coverage of the 2004 campaign and vote count in the lead-up to 2008.

For more information about Dr. Fitrakis, view his bio in the Columns section of this website.

For more information about Mr. Wasserman, view his bio in the Columns section of this website.

www.freepress.org

For Charlie L. and Ronald Wieck: Not only did Kerry pull even with Bush in the polls at the very end (48%-48% with the rest undecided), but these are raw figures that don't reflect the trend for the period immediately preceding the last poll. Whether the numbers were within the margin for error is less meaningful than the trend.

Kerry was gaining ground by the hour. Any polltaker worth his salt can recite Rule # 1: When the challenger is gaining ground rapidly just before Election Day, the undecided votes favor the challenger. Adjusting for this fact, Kerry was really ahead in the polls on Election Day, a fact confirmed emphatically by the exit polls.

This could be an interesting weekend ahead. As someone who lives in the New York media market, and given that Rolling Stone is published there, I'll be eager to see whether our brain-dead friends at The New York Times acknowledge the Rolling Stone article. It will be equally fascinating to see how Rupert Murdoch (New York Post) responds.

How the Republican thieves and liars will fight this battle:

1. Swiftboating: They will attack RFKj personally with lies and hyperbole (he's a "Kennedy", etc.). They will attack ROLLING STONE as if it hasn't been a corporate version of ROCK VOGUE for the last 10 years.

2. They will say those who discuss this are "sore losers" or that we should "just get past it" as if Democracy was something we can ignore the destruction of because it happened last year.

3. They will LIE like crazy. They will simply MAKE UP facts.

4. They will DISTRACT like crazy, trying to create side discussions that have nothing to do with the real issue.

5. They will go after ONE piece of evidence and try to discredit it, so as to attempt to discredit the whole story (remember the CBS memo?).

6. Eventually, if all those arguments don't work, they will claim that the discussion itself is "dangerous" and would "lend support to our enemies" and should be taken off the table or into the back room.

KNOW YOUR ENEMY. They are ruthless. They are evil. They are repugnant. And they are VERY VERY GOOD at what they do. It wasn't easy to steal two presidential elections and heaven knows how many others and not end up laying in a puddle of your own blood in the middle of the street.

DO NOT UNDERESTIMATE THESE PEOPLE --- they are capable of anything and they have NOTHING TO LOSE.

But most of all, IGNORE THE TROLLS and make these discussions OUR discussions about how best to move the truth forward. Let's not waste our valuable time on trolls who have only one goal --- distraction (from our goals), dispersal (of our energy) and defeat (of our objectives). Furthering the truth or a representative democratic republic are NOT part of their agenda.

Charlie L
Portland, OR

P.S. IF, by some amazing luck we are able to get honest elections in 2006 and even perhaps in 2008, look for a MASSIVE swarm of Presidential pardons from this Republican White House. And, unless they can cut a deal, look for a last-day pardon of the VP followed by a last-minute resignation of the POTUS and a swearing-in of the VP and a Presidential Pardon of the recently resigned POTUS. All this will happen in the oval office with CJ Roberts in the minutes right before he heads over to swear in a new POTUS. There will also be a sealed Executive Order that exempts any member of the Executive Branch from being turned over to any international court of law for War Crimes. These people would NOT want their very wealthy retirement to be disrupted by JUSTICE.

Will the Rolling Stone article get mainstream media coverage? Will mainstream reporters follow up with more investigations and then report their findings to the public?

The population AT LARGE needs to become aware of all the voter manipulations that took place. A Rolling Stone article by a person with name recognition helps some. But without REPEATED coverage from the MSM, most people still will not accept election fraud as credible. They will view it as an offbeat theory promoted by crazies, cry babies, and/or poor sports. Most people are afraid of being classified as conspiracy nuts (a successful Rovian intimidation/manipulation tactic) and will refuse to accept that widespread fraudulent acts occurred unless it is reported by high profile news sources (e.g., CNN, NY Times, USA Today, Time Magazine, etc).

The same applies when looking at evidence that 9/11 was an inside job. People don't want to believe these things can happen in America.

[However, I have seen skeptics become convinced after watching well made videos such as the following:

http://numberonesnowstre...001/09/conspiracies.html

http://video.google.com/...cid=-8260059923762628848 ]

I think it's quite revealing that some people who think that the elections in '00 and '04 were stolen, are the same people who think that the terrorist attacks of 9/11 were an "inside job."

It's more proof of the crazed, nuttiness of the these paranoid theories and the trouble they will have appearing credible to anyone with common sense.

DJ said...You could have lived to fight another day. Instead, you "voted for your principles" and 100,000 people died at the hand of this madman.

so according to you DJ i should be tried for war crimes. Thats an idiotic statement to back up an idiotic statement. so i kind of expected that. Anyone who thinks like you obviously will have nothing intelligent to say.

Blow me Im Irish said....I'm not making up scenarios - I'm taking ACTUAL situations and making a reasonable comparison to how differently things would've played out with Gore.

Do you see how you said that, "how it WOULD'VE played out." News flash...you dont know. Gore may have had a heart attack and died when 9/11 happened. Gore may have been visiting the WTC on 9/11, or the pentagon...but it's my belief if W wasnt elected 9/11 wouldnt have happened.

I agree with you BIG DAN. Skull & Bones Kerry did come from way back. And im sure there is a big difference between Skull & Bones Kerry and Skull & Bones Bush or Bush Sr or Clinton....If any of these people truly cared about the American people, we would see no hunger and poverty in America. Look at right after 9/11...Billion & Billions of dollars approved for war. So we had access to billions and billions of $, but yet there are Americans starving and homeless.

I think it's odd how the candidate the US backs in these other countries we invaded, got elected. Anyone think the voting fraud has been outsourced?

Nikto, you are correct. This was definitely a coup!!!!!!!
I've often wondered what the American people would have done if Al Gore and John Kerry would have been more boisterous about the obvious sabotage and rigging from all directions of the electoral process.

Granted, we have much more info now, but at the time, even non-expert people like myself that were tracking results around the country could see there was a problem.

But even now, if those two main players came out and said "there is now enough proof", despite the fact that none of the players in the scam have been convicted, or even indicted, what would happen? Would there be a revolt by the American people?

I wonder what the Shrub has in mind for his own people if he thought the walls were crumbling around him. Because they are you know.

Stealing our democracy, our government, is treason in my opinion.

The thought that comes to mind is scary!!!!!!!!
And maybe that's why they haven't s-p-e-l-l-e-d it out for us.

I agree with Charlie. Don't underestimate the trolls, especially the ones who seem crazy and stupid. Crazy like foxes.

Nikto, you are correct. This was definitely a coup!!!!!!!
I've often wondered what the American people would have done if Al Gore and John Kerry would have been more boisterous about the obvious sabotage and rigging from all directions of the electoral process.

Granted, we have much more info now, but at the time, even non-expert people like myself that were tracking results around the country could see there was a problem.

But even now, if those two main players came out and said "there is now enough proof", despite the fact that none of the players in the scam have been convicted, or even indicted, what would happen? Would there be a revolt by the American people?

I wonder what the Shrub has in mind for his own people if he thought the walls were crumbling around him. Because they are you know.

Stealing our democracy, our government, is treason in my opinion.

The thought that comes to mind is scary!!!!!!!!
And maybe that's why they haven't s-p-e-l-l-e-d it out for us.

Re: Special Access Programs under NSA Using Thought Reading Technology

I have been sending a letter out since 1994 regarding secret technology that has been used on me since that time. I believe it might be the technology that Mr. Russell Tice testified in the February 14, 2006 Subcommittee on National Security, Emerging Threats & International Relations hearing being referred to as 'special access' operations of the NSA (I also believe that this technology is being used in other departments of government). It is thought reading technology.

Consider the following:

STATEMENT OF JMS. BAMFORD BEFORE THE DEMOCRATIC MEMBERSHIP, HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE (January 20, 2006)

{Ed Note: Long copied and pasted post removed. Use the above linkn if interested. Please do not post complete articles here. A link and a paragraph or two will do. Thanks!}

PS Here are a couple of recent web sites that have alluded to 'new technology' behind the lack of warrants in the NSA program:

from: http://www.defensetech.org/archives/002030.html
New Tech Behind NSA Snoop Case?
... Maybe there's something different about this surveillance. It could be in its scope, as Laura suggests. But I'm guessing --- and this is just a guess --- that the real difference is in the technology of the wiretaps themselves.
...Senator Bob Graham (D-Fla.) told the Washington Post:
"I came out of the room with the full sense that we were dealing with a change in technology but not policy..."
New York Times Editor Bill Keller:
In the course of subsequent reporting we satisfied ourselves that we could write about this program --- withholding a number of technical details --- in a way that would not expose any intelligence-gathering methods or capabilities that are not already on the public record.
from: http://www.secondaryscre.../12/somethings_happ.html
Something's Happening Here
And the technology they are using isn't quite clear.
I'm becoming more and more convinced by little notes being hit by President Bush, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales and the Deputy Director for National Intelligence General Michael Hayden that the extra-legal NSA wiretaps ordered by the president are using some new technology. (See article for more quotes).

Comment 198 Stillstanding - Unlike WTC building #7 which was not hit by a plane unattached across the street and fell 10 hours later. WTC Tower#2 which fell 1st followed by WTC Tower #1 are the ONLY steel concrete buildings in history to fall from a fire controlled demolition style to the ground.

Now do yourself, your family and anyone you know by purchasing the intelligent documentary DVD LOUDER THAN WORDS 2ND EDITION dedicated to the people who died on 9/11 so you can learn about the coverup and elusive TRUTH about what we do know about the orchestrated Bush holiday. www.loosechange911.com

You all come back now and remember 6/01/2006

"Voting your conscience", when you know doing so will result in the election of GW Bush is irresponsible and *unprincipled* beyond belief. This childish crap about "getting principles" when it comes to voting in a presidential election is idiotic. (If you didnt know, I know that you were told repeatedly and stubbornly and refused to accept the rules of engagement. Or were you stoned in your dorm rooms those days?), We have a two party system right now. Voting for Nader resulted in the election of GW. (Of course, voting for Perot elected Bill Clinton so I cant complain too much.) Nader could have made a deal with Gore and changed the DEM party from the inside, which I agree it needs, instead of allowing his egomania to control his decisions. Either Gore or Kerry would have made much better world leaders than GW. Still clinging to the the ridiculous notion that "Both parties are exactly the same and being controlled by The Corporations" is non sensical, naive, foolish and, as we've found out, deadly. Two things bother me the most. Gore turning on Clinton to try to win TN (which he LOST along with Arkansas for betraying Clinton--Florida would not have mattered if Gore won Arkansas--Bush would not have been able to maniuplate the election in Arkansas) and the naivete of the Nader voters. Those are two things that the Left could have done to prevent GW Bush from getting elected. If EXPECT the enemy to behave that way, you engage them and respond with equal force...you dont roll over and hide under your childish "principles". You could have lived to fight another day. Instead, you "voted for your principles" and 100,000 people died at the hand of this madman.

Posted to Roger Ailes Blog

Wednesday, May 31, 2006

Grand Old Police Blotter: Dealer Noe Deal Edition
How do you recognize a Bush Pioneer? His pasty white face clashes with his orange jumpsuit.

Yet another Bush Pioneer confesses to his crimes against the public:

TOLEDO, Ohio - A coin dealer and prominent GOP fundraiser at the center of an Ohio political scandal pleaded guilty Wednesday to federal charges he illegally funneled about $45,000 to President Bush's re-election campaign.

Tom Noe, once a powerful political figure who also raised money for Ohio Republicans, still is charged with embezzlement in an ill-fated $50 million coin investment that he managed for the state workers' compensation fund.

The investment scandal has been a major embarrassment for Ohio's ruling Republicans and given Democrats a better shot at winning state offices this year, including the governor's office, which has been under GOP control since 1991.

Investigators do not know whether Noe used money from the state coin fund for campaign contributions.

posted by Roger
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Anyone have an idea what time the article will be out? I've been watching for it all day. Thanks!

I am hopeful that the public response will grow and Bush will be ousted.
However I think it very likely that Bush has long ago prepared his plan for dictatorship. The Republicans must be already prepared for the public turning against them. They must be resolved in what they are achieving so easily.
It will probably take a great deal more than public discontent to stop them and by the time resistance is mobilised it will be virtually impossible to stop them.

They (republicans) would have known that public outcry would come eventually. They are like a disease that lies dormant till all its weaponry is in place then strikes. As they pretend to be moderate they are quietly tightening the screws. Once the screws are tight enough they will show their true faces.

I am hoping though that they are unbelievably stupid and are not prepared. But somehow despite the public backlash Bush and his cronies just have complete disreguard for what the voting public actually want. I believe them to quite capable of just about anything. (bad)
Nothing was going to stop Bush stealing 2002 or 2004. It will take a great deal to stop him now.

The election issue is, I think, one that one just has to keep gnawing at from different directions. For example, as important as Ohio 2004 is and Florida 2000, who would have thought that the breakthrough might turn out to be New Hampshire 2002?!

But if it can be shown that Abramov provided the funds that paid for the vote-suppressing phone attack on the Dem get- out-the-vote effort in NH in 2002, it will be very hard or impossible to deny that election stealing goes all the way to or near to the top of the national GOP.

Here's a question I've been wondering about for a long time. How often in history has the sos in a state also run the presidential campaign in that state? It's such a blatant conflict of interest that it's hard for me to believe that it was ever done before, but maybe it's been done a lot and one just never knew because who would even think about that?

But if Harris and Blackwell are the first to do it or among the few ever to do it, then I think it is something that needs to be emphasized. It's like someone being a lawyer and a judge in the same case - it's crazy on the face of it. The fact that someone would do it can readily be construed inherently as a declaration of intent to cheat. Unless it's been done a lot.

So I wonder, how often has the sos in a state also run a presidential campaign in the state?

StillStanding said:
I wonder if he will include as background the fraud of 1960, where the Dems stole Illinois and the election for JFK?

As someone who was born in Illinois and who still lives in that state, I'm really tired of hearing this one. The final electoral vote count was 303-219. Illinois had 27 electoral votes at that time. Had they been handed to Nixon, he still would have been short. Remember, Kennedy was a pro-union Catholic and Chicago, the major population center, was heavily made up of pro-union Catholics. What a surprise that Kennedy carried Cook County!

An account of the 1960 election can be found at:

http://www.slate.com/id/91350/

Here is an excerpt:
"With Nixon distancing himself from the effort, the Cook County state's attorney, Benjamin Adamowski, stepped forward to lead the challenge. A Daley antagonist and potential rival for the mayoralty, Adamowski had lost his job to a Democrat by 25,000 votes. The closeness of his defeat entitled him to a recount, which began Nov. 29.
Completed Dec. 9, the recount of 863 precincts showed that the original tally had undercounted Nixon's (and Adamowski's) votes, but only by 943, far from the 4,500 needed to alter the results. In fact, in 40 percent of the rechecked precincts, Nixon's vote was overcounted. Displeased, the Republicans took the case to federal court, only to have a judge dismiss the suits. Still undeterred, they turned to the State Board of Elections, which was composed of four Republicans, including the governor, and one Democrat. Yet the state board, too, unanimously rejected the petition, citing the GOP's failure to provide even a single affidavit on its behalf."

There are a number of statistical studies of the 2004 exit polls. Here is a link to one of them:
http://www.buzzflash.com...oll_discrepancy_v00k.pdf

http://www.rollingstone....e_2004_election_stolen/4

Dems are tired of hearing about the "fraud" in 1960, but NOT sick of hearing about the "fraud" in 2000 or 2204. Gee whiz, I wonder why?

The saga of Florida 2000 looks a WHOLE lot like Chicago 1960.
Kennedy stole the 1960 election from Nixon in the same way that Gore is trying to steal the 2000 election from Bush.

In the 1960 presidential race Richard M. Nixon lost by a hair to John F. Kennedy.

Two states with razor-thin margins for Kennedy could have swung the election to Nixon: Kennedy carried Texas by only 46,000 votes, and he carried Illinos by a mere 9,000 votes.

Illinois was then, and is now, dominated by Democratic machine politicians the kings of which are the Daley family of Chicago fame.

Democratic Campaign Chair, William Daley, is the son of the late Chicago Mayor Richard J. Daley who was instrumental in "stealing" the 1960 election from Nixon. Bill Daley is also brother to the current Chicago Mayor, Richard Daley, Jr.

In the aftermath of 1960 virtual non-election, investigators were alarmed by the fact that on election eve the Republicans were leading in Illinois but Daley’s operatives were withholding the results of a large number of precincts for some worrisome reason.

Then, when Kennedy was just four electoral votes shy of winning the presidency, all of the missing Chicago precincts mysteriously reported at the same time, turning the tide in favor of Kennedy.

There were 68 million votes cast in the 1960 election. The margin between the Republicans and the Democrats (Nixon and Kennedy) was a trifling 113,000 (less than 2/10 of one percent!) in favor of Kennedy.

A subsequent investigation of vote fraud in Illinois and Texas revealed the following:

Fannin County, Texas had only 4,895 registered voters. BUT 6,138 votes were cast, 75% of which went to Kennedy.

Angelina County, Texas: In one precinct, only 86 people voted yet the final tally was 147 for Kennedy, 24 for Nixon.

But Texas refused to conduct a recount. The Texas Election Board consisted entirely of Democrats, and the Board certified John Kennedy the winner in Texas.

Illinois: News reporters witnessed so much voter fraud by the Democrats that the Chicago Tribune stated "the election of November 8 was characterized by such gross and palpable fraud as to justify the conclusion that [Nixon] was deprived of victory." (As quoted by the Washington Post.)

The Republican National Committee filed a lawsuit challenging the Chicago results. Not coincidentally, the lawsuit was assigned to the courtroom of a judge known to be friendly to Daley and the Democratic party, Circuit Court Judge Thomas Kluczynski. After predictably dismissing the Republican suit, Kluczynski was rewarded by "President" John F. Kennedy with an appointment to the federal bench.

Earl Mazo was a reporter for the New York Herald Tribune in 1960. He investigated charges of Chicago voter fraud in the 1960 Kennedy / Nixon elections. Mazo found a cemetary in one Chicago precinct where the names on the head stones were registered voters who had actually voted!

Reporter Mazo also visited the Chicago address where 56 Kennedy voters listed their address. What he found was an abandoned, demolished house.

After numerous Democratic judges dismissed Republican charges of voter fraud, Kennedy was inaugurated.

Following Kennedy’s inauguration, the U.S. Department of Justice performed an inconclusive investigation into the accumulated evidence of voter fraud. The head of the DOJ was none other than U.S. Attorney General Bobby Kennedy, brother of you-know-who.

This summary is based on the story "Another Race to the Finish" by Peter Carlson, published in the Washington Post, 11/17/00, Page A01

STILLSTANDING IS A PAID TROLL!!! he's been showing up at Truthout.org and harassing people there too.

A laundry list of election improprieties in Ohio,..

Ohio : list of election improprieties

StillStanding #209

Fran #207 explained it clearly.

Your denial is showing thru and thru.

One of the urban myths is that those who did the exit polls, which predicted a Kerry win, considered whether or not the official tally was wrong.

That is pure myth:

"Inaccurate Election Results

Edison/Mitofsky did not even consider this hypothesis, and thus made no effort to contradict it. Some of Edison/Mitofsky's exit poll data may be construed as affirmative evidence for inaccurate election results. We conclude that the hypothesis that the voters’ intent was not accurately recorded or counted cannot be ruled out and needs further investigation" (link here, bold added).

Mitofsky considered the discrepancy to be because republicans were more shy than democrats, and therefore did not talk to the exit pollsters.

Mitofsky never even considered the possibility of election fraud.

That is why it should be investigated. It never has. Why investigate? Because:

"Exit polling is a well-developed science, informed by half a century of experience and continually improving methodology" (ibid, bold added).

We need to explain why the science that has been used in elections around the world for 5 or so decades, and continually improved, and always reliable, predicted a Kerry win.

But Ohio where the head of the republican election scenario was also the secretary of state, governing elections and recounts, was a disaster contrary to science, and clothed with conflict of interest.

There's no question Kennedy stole Illinois in 1960, with the collusion of his father and Mayor Daley. In fact, he joked about it at a black-tie dinner shortly after the election, saying in his best Harvard accent, "I, uh...ahsked my fathah not to steal, uh...one moah vote in Chicago that we needed (Pepsodent smile)." Big roars from the audience, all of whom were enraptured by this smart-ass from Boston with the Hollywood manner. None of them ever guessed that Kennedy's cavalier attitude toward election fraud would hurt the country, and his Democratic party, badly 40 years later.

Stillstanding is right about Illinois. Texas isn't as clear-cut, though. If both Illinois and Texas were in fact stolen, then Nixon was cheated out of the White House in 1960. It's possible, but hard to prove one way or the other at this point.

Now, Stillstanding, please answer this question: How many elections are the Republicans allowed to steal before they've evened the score for 1960? Don't you think 2000 was enough?

RLM #214

Of course there is doubt. Fran #207 presents a valid argument, which certainly raises a doubt.

Lets be clear about the difference between doubt and conclusive evidence, and choose our words carefully so as to maximize precision.

Supersoling - Welcome back, I missed you!

StillStanding - Could you please explain how the Kennedy/Nixon election is significant enough to affect us now?

How many who were elected in 1960 are still in office today?

Personally, I don't even REMEMBER 1960, I was kinda busy that year - potty training and learning to walk and eat solid food!

Now, as far as the increase in troll activity on this blog - oh yeah, you can bet we hit a nerve. Notice that not a single one of them has anything to say to prove us wrong about what happened in Ohio on election day in 2004. The facts are clearly laid out for them, yet they don't dispute the facts - instead, they go for personal attacks (a sure sign they are responding with pure emotion, not logic), or they try to justify election fraud that put into office an incompetent megalomaniac who could arguably be THE WORST PRESIDENT EVER by saying, "But they did it too, thirty six years ago!"

Don't know about y'all, but I NEVER let a child get away with that excuse if they do something wrong, and I'm sure as HELL not going to accept it from adults who are supposed to know better.

I'll say it again, it really DOES feel good to be getting the attention, ESPECIALLY from those who support the criminals occupying the White House. If we were insignificant, they'd ignore us, like most of them did in the beginning.

They're like seagulls - they fly in, make a lot of noise, s**t all over everything, then fly away. They have absolutely no effect on what we're are doing here, other than annoying and distracting us.

Stillstanding 209: U are like the BUSHIT ADMINISTRATION. sTILLSTANDING because while most American are starting to smell the stench of this lying murderous corrupt criminal group which stole the last 2 presidential elections to win, we still got aceholes like you to deal with as well.
1. Our environment is in a crisis. Destructive US environmental policies against all living species favor the greedy oil elite in control.
2. Selling off our US PUBLIC WILDLANDS
3. Plans to gut the Federal Endangered Species Act
4. Plans to delist the isolated population of Yellowstone Brown Bears of which the NRDC submitted 57 reasons against this wrong headed move. and the American Bald Eagle.
5. Giving tax cuts for the rich.
6. unAmerican torture camps on foreign lands.
7. Their war of lies based on false intelligence and lies tied in with 9/11 30,000 dead civilians more target Americans die in this war everyday
8. Desecrating our Constitution
9. Creating their own set of rules above our US laws
10. Doing nothing about the New Orleans before, as it happened and now in the aftermath.
11. Spying on US citizens
12. Threatening brave Americans who speak out against their corruption.
13. Total media blackouts or their spin in opposition to the underlying truth on issues which face Americans and the world we live in.
14. PAY ATTENTION! The list of corrupt bastards in this illegal fascist regime can go on and on even if they only get a pat on the wrist or a promotion for telling/supporting a BUSHIT ADMINISTRATION LIE.

#196 Charlie

Yea but getting a pardon doesn't mean he & the rest can't be hunted down.

The GOP killed the Fairness Doctrine under Reagan and immediately set up a massive radio disinformation operation, handing multi-station-ownership "waivers" as bribes and then cudgels to force the corporate media to go along. Then they spent 15 years raising an army of 10-20 million ignorant rednecks who believed that because they heard it on the radio, it couldn't be untrue (Kathleen Hall Jamison of the Annenberg School at UofP documented this "false certainty" during Hillarycare).
This and the underfunding of education effectively removed critical reasoning during elections, as eulogized by Walter Cronkite after 04 who said we had lost our democracy as a result. It is replaced by the defiant preening faith-based ignorance of 500 pound rednecks driving around in cars the size of small houses, scorned by the entire rest of the world as the warmonger pigs that we are, living on borrowed money and time.
Cheering on this destruction of a decent society is the hard right, as evidenced by the nasties who have defecated right here. It should be a project of some of the screwed soldiers returning from Iraq to hunt these creeps down and settle the score. Let's provide a website with maps.

#89 Dan Pride

I know.
I've been suspicious of those Malvo sniper shootings that occurred during the debate re the Iraq war too.
What struck me & got me thinking about an ulterior motive for the killings was when the FBI profilers were flabbergasted when they found out the shooter was black.
They said none of their profiles indicated he could possibly be black & it just didn't fit.
I then read about Malvo's family life etc. & it still seemed odd.
I wonder if they checked his bank balance for a big payment or something?

#209 StillStanding

Why are some "tired of hearing about the fraud in 1960 elections but not in 2000 or 2004" you ask?

BECAUSE JACK KENNEDY WAS A WONDERFUL PRESIDENT THAT INSPIRED THE COUNTRY & MADE IT BETTER, UNTIL YOU & YOUR DIRTY GOP COHORTS MURDERED HIM.
That's why.

WHILE BUSH IS A RETARD WITH NO CONSCIENCE THAT'S BRINGING THE COUNTRY DOWN INTO FASCISM.

I like to answer questions from a pig.

The story will get some MSM attention. The question is how much? RFK jr is someone with a "name" and will be granted credibility. Given the tone of the article, the "average Joe" may hear about it.

But in order for it to resonate, two things have to happen (apart from a new bombshell). Another media outlet of substance will have to release a significant, independent report on the facts of the issue, probably within the next 2 weeks. This would allow the issue to be more than the "Rolling Stone/RFKjr story" and would keep it from fading into the noise of other news. Secondly, another "name" will have to comment on it. For example if someone knows any prominent Dems, they might suggest to them to consider making a public comment if the story begins to move. Something like "...These are very serious concerns raised by the article. They deserve to be investigated thoroughly..."

The trolls coming out to divert the story only serve to demonstrate the importance of a story gathering momentum. If it doesn't get on the average Joe's radar and stay there, it will have no significance.

Speaking of investigations, I am becoming convinced that congressional investigations and impeachment hearings may not be the only answer to dealing with these issues. Given GOP rhetoric, Dems seeming reluctance to investigate and the approaching 2008 election cycle, I think the best solution may be the use of an Independent Prosecutor. He would be able to cut through the "noise" and continue through 2008.

If given the proper latitude he would not only be able to go after involved administration officials, he could investigate state party officials (like Blackwell, Harris, etc.) and corporations who are involved in these activities. The potential collusion of these parties and harm to the public interest may justify this latitude.

To pull off this fraud requires significant help from state and local officials. An aggressive investigation in the most controversial states of 2004 would check future cooperation of other state and local officials. Right now, they are willing to participate because the likelihood of prosecution is very low. Changing that perception would go a long way in reducing fraud at this level. Also a real investigation of Diebold, et. al. would move the discussion from "computer glitches" to felonious intent. It would serve as the best argument to move vote talling from private to public interests.

If this issue ever gets traction in the MSM, a serious "Fitzgerald-like" independent investigation should be the call. It would rise above much of the rhetoric and politicization of the issue.

So many lies, so typical of the left.

There is absolutely nothing to suggest that Kerry was gaining in the last 24 hours. Indeed, Bush's lead in Florida widened from 2-3 points to 5-6 points IN THE KERRY CAMP'S INTERNAL POLLING (see Evan Thomas's account in Newsweek).

You people have active imaginations, but you tremble at the prospect of seeing real numbers. Visit the Ohio Board of Elections site for Cuyahoga County. Slog through the precinct-by-precinct results. Find any anomalies? Nope, you sure as hell did not. Was the rate of spoiled ballots unusually high? Uh-uh, it was lower than in Democrat strongholds such as Detroit, Chicago, and Philly.

And, no, Ken Blackwell CANNOT deny requisitioned voting machines to a county. Nobody thinks he can.

William A. Anthony, a Democratic electional official in Franklin county, asked "Why would I want to disenfranchise my own people?" Mike Hackett, the supervisor in charge of allocating voting machines for that county, A DEMOCRAT, requested about 2,800, when he needed over 5,000. He explained that he didn't want to waste the money--after all, it's only one day.

Most of you are willfully blind to the implications of Kerry's huge margins in the early, leaked exit poll results. Slamming is the ONLY plausible explanation. Perhaps you think that Mississippi was really "too close to call." Maybe Kerry really had a twenty point lead in both New Hampshire and Pennsylvania, states he won by 1 and 3 points, respectively. Sorry, gang, your side got caught cheating. Instead of calling me childish names, see if you can concoct some convoluted, Rube Goldberg explanation of how the infallible exit polls could be so SPECTACULARLY, ABSURDLY WRONG.

Comment #223 Independent Investigation is a good call.

Comment #221 Charlene - please don't make such a huge generalization about the JFK assasination. I understand your anger because mine will always be greater however, we don't know who all killed President Kennedy because it became a GOVERNMENT COVERUP not for the American people to know.

IF IT SMELL LIKE BUSHIT, SOUNDS LIKE BUSHIT AND LOOKS LIKE THE WORK OF BUSHIT..

Guess who was running the security system in the WTC Towers a couple years before 9/11..why it was George's brother Marvin Bush. LOUDER THAN WORDS 2ND EDITION. www.loosechange911.com

CHECK IT OUT!

Bush cheated in 2000 and bribed the court, Gore and the entire democratic party rolled over and played dead. Not even one Democratic senator stood up to support the representatives who wereprotesting the florida vote. Bush cheated even more in 2004. Kerry could have spoke up and made the case for Ohio election fraud easily then. Now conveniently just befroe election time RFK junior " discovers what most decent investigators have known since December 2004, that the Ohio vote was blatently rigged,
Now people how many Democratic Senators and congressmen out there do you think were not aware of this already?? And Commenter # 15 sugggest that we third Party supporters have " wasted" our votes that could have gone to Gore or Kerry??? Please people!! Just how brain dead are you all?? The Rs and the D's have been rigging elections for years!! The D's especially in recent times, When are you all out their going to abandon that bunch of crooks in the two party mafia?? How many crimes and how much bribery do they have to do before you dump them and go to work in the third party of your choice?? Do you really think they are going to reform themselves and stop being criminals?? If that is what you really thihnk then you should be at least consistant, You shouild eliminate the criminal penalties for bribery muirder for gain and theft for ordinary criminals,and just lecture them to straighten themselves out, since you don't want to put any of the politicians in Jalil for this unless of course you are a Democrat and they are Republicans or vice versa.
You Don't get it!! The two Party system is a con job on the American public, Full of sound and fury and signifiing nothing at all for the people except a smokes screen for the international billionaires to line their own pockets with our wealth. John Bambey Reform Party.

to realize just how entrenched we are--as a functioning nation--in the abyss of corruption, watch the documentary THE CORPORATION. even more of a wake-up call than fahrenheit 9/11! in fact, MUCH more.

as for the continuance of our pathetic political system, as well as the pandemic backwardness of our world in general (super-lopsided as it is on the dark/ignorance pole of Life's "relativity's scale"), is that humanity needs to be taught HARD lessons about the value of experiencing Itself as more of a unified whole, and NOT a chaotic agglomeration of egocentric individuals unable to have reasonable socio-political debates without the all-too-typical reaction of fear--> hatred --> war. in other words, to become what some of us on the left refer to as Enlightened or Self-realized.

this is not to say forums such as this don't have their importance (in this case, VITAL); but that we should also bear in mind there might in fact be a purposeful and even inescapable reason for all this blatant shit goin' down.

RLM,

You don't regret your vote for Nader but I do regret your vote. GWB was clearly unqualified for the position and Nader had no chance.

National elections are times for citizens to become realists. I know that you are free to vote for Daffy Duck if you want, but someone as intelligent as you should know better.

You may not regret your vote but do you regret the results of the past 64 months?

Comment #224 Dude you just don't get it. This is blog is not about DEMOCRAT vs REPUBLICAN. So i'm repeating the comment i made earlier to you.
Comment 179 Ronald Wriek - READ UP BIG BOY

How the GOP stole America's 2004 election and is rigging 2008, by Bob Fitrakis and Harvey Wasserman: $12
The "Woodward & Bernstein of the 2004 Election"
-- Rev. Jesse Jackson

A Special Investigative Report Revealing Massive Voter Theft, Fraud and Illegalities in Ohio's Presidential Balloting

The theft of the 2004 election has been catalogued, footnoted and thoroughly documented in more than 180 bullet points compiled by the Ohio-based investigative reporters in their shocking new compendium. The special digest may serve as the touchstone for all future coverage of the 2004 campaign and vote count in the lead-up to 2008.

www.freepress.org

I emailed Dr. Fitrakis and he got back to me and said he's been working with Bobby Kennedy Jr. on what you will read in the Rolling Stone tomarrow.

Born in Chicago, i am aware about the Democratic fix that help Jack win years and years ago in different timeS. Make no mistake, i am not advocating election fraud. We have history to show what Nixon brought.

The beginning of the LOUDER THAN WORDS DVD which i have recommended to all Americans and citizens of the world starts out with the Macnamara incident. This is where the US Secretary of Defense Robert McNamera had a plan to stage a Cuban riot so the US military could retaliate by attacking Cuba. President Kennedy withdrew this plan and removed him from office.

U HAVE TO WAKE UP! This is 2006 and PEOPLE LIKE YOU MUST LOOK AT what has happened to this country and our fragile environment suffering from HUMAN POLLUTION in the wake of the BUSH STOLEN ELECTIONS.

The Bush administration is the great divider because the only mission he accomplished in my eyes is that he divided this country.

30,000 dead Iraqi civilians.
EVERYTHING the BUSH administration has touched has had a wrong headed destructive impact against some world people, Americans, and or all other species for the personal gain of the oil barrons in control.

In light of any conventional wisdom leaders in the Bush administration like Rove, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and Gonzalez have managed to twist our CONSTITUTION and bend our SYSTEM OF CHECKS AND BALANCES to take and maintain this illegally seized control .

We can start to save our fragile eggshell world and become a world leader once again when we IMPEACH AND JAIL this most dangerous destructive group of people in US history known as the Bush administration.

Think about this:

We all knew the election was fudged.
Now it can be shown and proven, I really believe it can.

Therefore:

Gore "is" President

We don't need an impeachment.
Let Mr. Gore finish his term starting tomorrow.

Makes me giggle just to think about it.
Thank you Rolling Stone.
Thank you Mr. Kennedy
Thank you Brad.
Thank all gillion of my fellows who posted here.
How do we make this up to the rest of the world?

If, in every precinct in the country where voters
are forced to vote on electronic vote stealing
machines, one person walked in first thing in the
morning with a ball peen hammer.................

DON'T FEED THE TROLLS!

I'm afraid I've been wasting my time and everyone else's as well. I just read the Kennedy piece and apparently Fitrakis sold him all the codswallop that got him booted by the Kerry campaign. Kerry's people had a lawyer named Jeff Ruppert in the Warren County lockdown site. He reported that several Democratic officials were present and assisting with the counting. He said that absolutely nothing of interest happened. Maybe he's a lawyer who doesn't like to file lawsuits, but maybe Fitrakis really is a self-promoting loon.

Merry Fitzmas. Regarding the explanation for those incredible (exactly the right word) Kerry leads in the early exists, don't all speak at once.

Truth Seeker, I'm surprised that you are not getting it. You are not a troll. The election was stolen, thus a vote for Nader was inconsequential. End of story. Leave it alone.

Brad - Can you repost that photo of a destroyed malfunctioned electronic voting machine layed out by a voter in a recently state primary?

THANK YOU R.S. There is a certain release i can't explain after reading the Robert Kennedy Jr. article like vindication of very dedicated Americans who wanted to do whatever it takes at all costs to save this democracy and the world. Superman is a cool but you men and women are for real. We still have so much work to do. Thank you all.

What I found upsetting about John Kerry's reaction near of the end of the story. He said "he didn't want to upset the Republicans because of what they might do."

I ask you who is running this Democracy???

"WE THE PEOPLE" ARE RUNNING THIS DEMOCRACY. Our elected officials do not reign with a wrath with some sort of perpetual rule over us. That's why it's called a DEMOCRACY.

If our presidential elections have provided fraudulent results and the media has openly lied and distorted the truth, then "we the people" need to make extradinary efforts to correct the way we hold elections to ensure our votes are counted.

We must also put some controls in place so the sole voice of the mass media is not owned by corporations and run by our government. Maybe we should all own the mass media not an elite group of people.

Why should "we the people" suffer through the remaining term of a man elected by a rigged vote?

1. Register to vote previous to election day.
2. Record the votes on a paper ballot.
3. Allow the votes to be transparent and ensure an accurate count even if it takes a few weeks.
4. Ensure a uniform proceed for all US election precincts.
5. Allow enough time for a reasonable recount if need be required.
4. Do not allow TV to give predictions or result about other states which voted earlier. This could influence voter turnout in other states which vote later.
5. Votes can no longer be entrusted to be counted in a shroud of secrecy by these voting companies run by convicted felons. "We the People" must be in charge of counting our votes.
6. Declare this last Presidential election UNCONSTITUTIONAL when it has been proven that it does not accurately reflect the "will of the people" due to fraud and obstruction and demand a new presidential election. Remember "We the People" are in charge not a corrupt group of CRIMINALS.
7. Severely limit or eliminate corporate campaign contributions. Corporations can no longer be allowed to own our holders of political office. We now have a Congress full of corporate owned robots. We must put an end to this RULE.

Ronald Wieck you are weak pussy and the only one being sold a bag of shit is anyone who believes 1 word of your attempt to discredit the truth about the theft of 2004 Presidential election. Get in the ring and I will fight any day.

Grizzly Bear Dancer: You're making me cry. It's such a privilege to be able to come here to be with people who love their country and want to make it the best place on earth. Please, sweet soul, don't feed the trolls! We have to muster a positive will against this filth with its poison grip on our home. I've been thinking all evening. We have to make this happen now and our power slogan should be LET'S ROLL! Really, honey, please, please don't waste your heart on glib personality disordered swine. Let's roll! Let's roll! Let's roll!

“I THINK IT’S QUITE REVEALING that some people who think that the elections in ’00 and ’04 were stolen are the same people who think that the terrorist attacks of 9/11 were an ‘inside job’. It’s more proof of the crazed nuttiness of these paranoid theories and the trouble they will have appearing credible to ANYONE WITH COMMON SENSE.” [Stillstanding #198]

I THINK IT IS QUITE REVEALING that Rove operatives repeatedly resort to name-calling/intimidation tactics whenever someone questions or doubts the government version of the truth. Upon examining and analyzing the facts of the 2004 election and 9/11, ANYONE WITH COMMON SENSE would realize the government stories do not add up whatsoever.

“All great truths begin as blasphemies.” George Bernard Shaw

“The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it and ignorance may deride it, but in the end there it is.” Winston Churchill

“A skeptic is a person who, when they see the writing on the wall, claims it is a forgery.” Morris Bender

“Controversy is only dreaded by the advocates of error.” Benjamin Rush

# 163, still standing? What do stand for? still standing, still standing....... No matter how many times i say it or write it, still standing. i can't understand what you are still standing for. you don't make sense.

Do you mean, you will be the last bush sucker standing. It's getting closer. Bush ratings are very low. There not many of you still standing, still standing.

JUST A OBSERVATION, did you pick still standing as it may relate to general custer. I see, like custer you want be standing long.

rradio, will you give details. You know, detail such as those given by RK JR. and many more.

You don't make sense, otherwise.

OK Chris Dodd, what the hell are you going to do about it? George Bush breaks tradition, law, and every other manner of doing business and we all look shocked but do nothing about it. So, let's do something about it.

I think we should be clear on one point. Electoral fraud is a crime, whether a Kennedy or a Bush benefits from it. I could not disagree more vehemently with Charlene, whose distinction between the election frauds of 1960 and 2000/2004 was based on her liking of Kennedy and her dislike of Bush.

That's wrong, wrong, wrong! It gives Republicans every right to say, "You liberals are hypocrites, screaming about election fraud now but saying it was O.K. for Kennedy to steal Illinois."

No, it wasn't O.K. And if John F. Kennedy was ever embarrassed by anything (which I doubt), he should have been red-faced over that disgusting speech in which he joked about the collusion between his old man and Richard Daley, two of the biggest slimeballs of the 20th century. I would invite my fellow bloggers here to consider that JFK contributed mightily to the cavalier attitude toward election fraud that exists today, allowing trolls to say, "Get over it, loser..." simply because Republicans now do a better job of stealing elections than Democrats do.

It's unfortunate that RFK, Jr.'s article will inspire replays of that JFK speech, because the right wing will use it to discredit him ("Look what your uncle had to say about election fraud, junior!"). It isn't a joke, it's a crime. The good news is that RFK, Jr. seems to understand this in his bones.

Kerry's weasel words about not contesting the election in Ohio are BS. He folded immediately once the pressure hit. His campaign would not even support a recount at first. He would not support John Conyers investigation. To even consider running again is crazy. This country needs someone who will stand up and fight and not say I'm sorry I ran against Bush, the architect of the biggest military blunder in history. It said a lot when he would not even attack the Swift Boaters until it was too late.

ELECTRONIC VOTING FRAUD WILL BE ALIVE AND WELL UNTIL WE GO BACK TO PAPER BALLOTS WITH A PAPER TRAIL. STILL A MOOT POINT THOUGH WHEN YOU CONSIDER THAT IT REALLY DOESN'T MATTER WHICH PARTY YOU VOTE FOR WHEN BOTH PARTIES ARE CONTROLLED AND WORK FOR ONE MASTER.....THE ILLUMINATI AND THEIR INTERNATIONAL BANKING CARTEL.

#230,
Fine with me, as long as it's Gore & not Kerry!!!

Hey Grizzly Bear, 99 is right, just ignore them (I know, I break that 'rule' too, though! and I shouldn't)

It's a waste of time & energy. Dance with US! Let them be wallflowers.

I posted this earlier...
"So even if, by some extremely unlikely turn of events, the msm runs with this & we begin to see it splashed across the front pages & tv screens as it should have been five years ago (or two, if you want to put aside 2000) and it becomes unavoidably clear that massive fraud was perpetrated...that massive fraud is not prosecutable? Ever?

Or is it not prosecutable unless & until an impeachment & conviction takes place? Because I understood that the president & vice-president, if impeached/convicted, would then be legally vulnerable to indictment & prosecution.

I realize I'm implying here that election fraud is provably connectable to the white house & that that's another issue, but hypothetically....?"

Can anyone weigh in on that? If someone already has, I missed it.

I think Anj and CD are not merely confusing Patrick and Bobby Kennedy. This looks like some deliberate right-wing attempt to confuse the rabble by crossing their Kennedys. Remember in 2000 how the Bushinistas trashed McCain in South Carolina by claiming he had fathered a biracial child out of wedlock? (Truth: John and Cindy McCain adopted an international child, and SC's own Strom Thurmond did father a biracial child by the family maid he may or may not have raped.)

Ricky, Savantster got it right. Now no Bush will ever win again. Since Jeb may be the last "electable" one, this dynasty won't outlast the Kennedys, Rockefellers, etc. To really get someone frightened, try these on: President Jenna Bush. Treasury Secretary Neal Bush. FDA Commissioner Noelle Bush.

So far, there has been exactly one response to my explanation of Democratic slamming of the exit polls: a moron who threatens physical violence.
Some of you may actually get the idea. THERE IS NO OTHER EXPLANATION. Either Democrats slammed the exits or the laws of probability were suspended. You can choose to ignore the elephant in the parlor or you can attempt to come to terms with Kerry's enormous leads in ALL the close battleground states. And don't forget his remarkbale showings in uncontested Southern states where Bush, in reality, was crushing him.

In response to #248: That is an explaination. I wonder why it has never happened before?

There are too many odd patterns in the vote shown in Ohio not to be alarmed by this. 16000 people in a precinct voting for Bush AND "for" gay marraige; Large numbers of people voting for Bush and a Left wing Judge; Abnormally large numbers of people voting for independant candidates; Bush getting abnormally high vote totals considering the voting history of that district.

Why aren't you at least interested in someone finding out about these discrepanies? It reaks of fraud to me & is absolutely enraging.

Where is the article?? I want to read it!

Zimmy makes a good point in writing that these discrepancies should be investigated thoroughly. I investigated them, spending hours poring over precinct-by-precinct results at the Ohio Board of Elections site. You can do the same, and you can check the archives of the Cleveland Dispatch and the Cleveland Plain Dealer for the comprehensive stories they ran on the various allegations. Here is a useful chart:
http://www.cleveland.com...litics/conspiracies.html

It is simply untrue that Bush received "abnormally high vote totals considering the history of that district." I defy anyone to find such a district. The conclusion of several researchers at MIT was that the anomaly of the 2004 election was the absence of anomalies. Both Bush and Kerry did well where they were expected to do well.

For Ronald Wieck: I promised myself I wouldn't waste another word responding to you. I lied. I can't help myself.

Talk about conspiracy theories! Your argument, if I understand it correctly, is that the discrepancies between exit poll results and tabulated votes are accounted for by a Democratic plot to rig the exit polls in advance to favor Kerry, while the tabulated votes favored Bush.

If this is in fact what you're claiming, please consider what it means. Democrats would have to have known in advance that Bush would earn enough electoral votes to win, but not enough to win without Ohio being in his column. Further, that a group of Democrats were willing to commit fraud in order to shed a negative light on an otherwise honest election. This group must have been large enough to create wide discrepancies between exit poll results and tabulated votes in 10 of 11 battleground states.

That is truly a far-fetched conspiracy theory, to put it mildly.

In addition to spoiling ballots, the punch-card machines also created bizarre miscounts known as ''ballot crawl.'' In Cleveland Precinct 4F, a heavily African-American precinct, Constitution Party candidate Michael Peroutka was credited with an impressive forty-one percent of the vote. In Precinct 4N, where Al Gore won ninety-eight percent of the vote in 2000, Libertarian Party candidate Michael Badnarik was credited with thirty-three percent of the vote. Badnarik and Peroutka also picked up a sizable portion of the vote in precincts across Cleveland --- 11M, 3B, 8G, 8I, 3I.(178) ''It appears that hundreds, if not thousands, of votes intended to be cast for Senator Kerry were recorded as being for a third-party candidate,'' the Conyers report concludes.(179)

But it's not just third-party candidates: Ballot crawl in Cleveland also shifted votes from Kerry to Bush. In Precinct 13B, where Bush received only six votes in 2000, he was credited with twenty percent of the total in 2004. Same story in 9P, where Bush recorded eighty-seven votes in 2004, compared to his grand total of one in 2000.(180)

I grew up in Ohio, but left to go to school & now live elsewhere. I site the article's sitations assuming that if they were incorrect, they will be attacted.

"In addition to spoiling ballots, the punch-card machines also created bizarre miscounts known as ''ballot crawl.'' In Cleveland Precinct 4F, a heavily African-American precinct, Constitution Party candidate Michael Peroutka was credited with an impressive forty-one percent of the vote. In Precinct 4N, where Al Gore won ninety-eight percent of the vote in 2000, Libertarian Party candidate Michael Badnarik was credited with thirty-three percent of the vote. Badnarik and Peroutka also picked up a sizable portion of the vote in precincts across Cleveland --- 11M, 3B, 8G, 8I, 3I.(178) ''It appears that hundreds, if not thousands, of votes intended to be cast for Senator Kerry were recorded as being for a third-party candidate,'' the Conyers report concludes.(179)

But it's not just third-party candidates: Ballot crawl in Cleveland also shifted votes from Kerry to Bush. In Precinct 13B, where Bush received only six votes in 2000, he was credited with twenty percent of the total in 2004. Same story in 9P, where Bush recorded eighty-seven votes in 2004, compared to his grand total of one in 2000.(180)"

This is only a small sample.

Have those posting here disputing the validity of the article's concern actually read the article itself?

The documented statistics are undeniably damning.

I complained to the election board in 2004 after having 0 votes recorded for the Presidential candidate I voted for. (I'm in Texas, In a district that is heavily the polar opposite of my political leanings so it didn't matter who I voted for Presidentially, so I voted for David Cobb.)

3 days later some votes were registered for all of the more popular independent write-in candidates in my precinct, as I didn't tell them which one I voted for, only that I was concerned that who I voted for for president showed 0 votes. (They asked me if I voted for Nadar) - I don't know if this is normal or not. It shouldn't be that hard to sum electronically tabulated votes and I have no faith that my concern wasn't addressed by fixing the tallies.

I haven't had a chance to read everything here, but I am wondering if it is legal to conduct your own exit poll. I figure if Thousands of people take the day off work, sit at a desk and conduct thier own private exit polls in the 2006 election, Officials may think harder about fixing counts. Perhaps I'll don feathers & war paint or Pirate regalia.

Sorry if I don't understand the general idea of this blog.

rONALD WIEcK U R A WEAK PUSSY. I'd like to do a level 10 terrorist attack on your face and Sheron Eaton is an invisible person who never existed. Ater she was fired and needed surgery, i bet she wished she was invisibel. Since U wish to be blind to Blackwell repulsive vulgar display of power as Secretary of State of Ohio AND Cochair to the Bushit/Cheney reElection campaign than you can go fck yourself. The massive humanistic fraud documented in this R. S. article and the 106 page report by US Representative John Conyers Jr. from MI is also coincidence - bastard

We might be able to get MSNBC to bring this story up on there new show "The Most." Everyone should send an email to themost@msnbc.com asking them to talk about the article.

Comment 253 and 254 reveal how sophisticated the fraudsters were (Not) Jimmying software or mechanically switching a presidential vote from one candidate to another on a certain number of machines in a precinct is a relatively simple exercise then after the election switching it back is also simple, The very idea that Petrouka would pick up forty some percent of the votes in any district, let alone a Black one is beyond reasonable belief. The fact that the Kerry Machine let this go is equally damning for the Democrats because it says that they approve of the vote fraud as a general technique as long as they are permitted to make use of it in the future, Any of these posters who do not believe that this is all part and parcel of "politics as usual" in America need to wake up to reality. The reality where the politicians, the corporate crooks, and the Mob all wallow at the same trough, Reforming politics will take more than impassioned Blogs on the Internet. John Bambey Reform Party USA

Apart from one fool who babbles incoherently, I seem to have stimulated some readers to pose thoughtful questions. Start with a quote from RFK Jr.'s article:

"The exit polls even showed Kerry breathing down Bush's neck in supposed GOP strongholds Virginia and North Carolina."

Okay, Kerry was not competitive in these states. Polls showed Bush winning them easily, and that's exactly what he did, by 12% in North Carolina and 8% in Virginia. Kennedy's statement is bizarre, as to any numerate person it permits only one conclusion: The exit polls were wrong. Period. You can't use a defective watch to prove that everyone else's watch is incorrect.

My allegation of slamming by Democratic operatives is weightier than a mere conspiracy theory because no other plausible explanation fits the facts as well.
If all we know is that Ohio was very close, a slight Bush lead, in pre-election polls and Kerry led 51-49 in the final exit poll, we don't know enough to figure out what happened. But we know much more: Kerry led by twenty points in an early exit that was leaked by Democratic operatives. You might argue that the sample was small, making the unusually large margin a statistical freak. But such freakishness was occurring everywhere, even in lopsided Bush landslide states. Notice that by the end of polling, the results were normalizing, but Kerry retained the boost he got by jacking up his early numbers.

Here's how slamming works: Suppose we are going to sample 100 voters (in a key swing state like Ohio, the number might be five or six hundred). We are going to tabulate results at evry 20% level. Now, we collect 16 surveys, which reveal 8 Bush voters and 8 Kerry voters, a reasonable result given the closeness of the race. Four Democratic operatives mingle with the crowd at the indicator precinct and volunteer to answer our survey. Our first tabulation, with 20% of the sample collected, is 12-8 for Kerry, an astonishing 60%-40% margin. Until the polls close, we collect another 80 surveys, which break down 41 Bush and 39 Kerry, closely mirroring the pre-election polls. The final exit reflects 49 Bush voters, 47 Kerry voters (so far, we are matching the state polls), AND 4 slammers. The final tally of 51-49 is close, but note how the 4 slammers changed the result.
Am I spinning a conspiracy theory? The problem is, how do you account for the absurdly inflated early leads for Kerry, well, EVERYWHERE? Did a massive flood of Democrats show up at the polls in every state at precisely the same time? Am I being clear?

As for the myth about Petrouka and Badnarik getting enormous vote totals in certain precincts of Cuyahoga County, check for yourself. Why take my word for anything? Go to the Cuyahoga County site of the Ohio Board of Elections and see if you can find these extraordinary precincts. See if they exist.

I have to confess an error. After I wrote that the story about Peroutka and Badnarik getting unusually high vote totals in one Cleveland ward was a myth, my brain started buzzing. I remember reading that there was something to it. I checked out the returns for Cleveland and discovered that in the Second Ward, the totals were:

Badnarik-48 Bush- 307 Kerry-8467 Peroutka- 83

One precinct provided 44 of Badnarik's 48 votes (Bush got only 18 votes there). I will have to talk with someone at the Cuyahoga Elections Board to find out the official story. The tiny numbers involved certainly don't suggest fraud--indeed, what Republican fraud could be possible in such a heavily-Democratic precinct. People who think otherwise have never worked as inspectors.

speadsheet verifying data for Cuyahoga

I don't know if that worked. I will admit that one has to consider the significance of this all against the totals. It still doesn't seem right that it happened.

http://copperas.com/cuyahoga/cuyahoga.zip

Sorry. I am not used to this system of placing links. With one exception, I normally don't hang out on blogs and they use a different formatting.

Hey you Ronald WEAK PUSSY u piece of shit - your pea brain is buzzing huh. Well why don't you have a comeback for any of my remarks or did you miss those facts in your analysis U squealing bitch.

Hey WEAK pUSSY YOUR BRAIN IS BUZZING U SQUEALING LITTLE BITCH. u seemed to avoid any analysis of the few points in my last post so i will repeat them.

1. Bushit Level 10 terrorist lockdown.
2. Sheroll Eaton story fixing the vote tally to match the recount number.
3. 106 page report by John Conyers Jr. about the massive humanistic fraud.
4. The reprehensible efforts of Kenneth Blackwell's vulgar display of power.

i'm listening asshole. The truth about how the Bushit administration rigged OHIO does not revolve around 1 fact about what tv said the exit poll data reflected the night before you stupid morlock.

"BANG THE GONG!!!"

Gang the bong!

Anyhow, we all knew this happened in 2004 (if not, you were in denial).

So nice to get some folks with some power involved in caring about this sort of thing...

Ronald Wieck Pussy - Can you smell Professor Freeman's farts?

#243 Robert

I was careful NOT to say it is ok to steal an election, because it isn't.

However, the troll did not ask why Dems think it was ok for Kennedy to steal an election but not Bush--or even if they do think that.

He asked why democrats do not COMPLAIN about Kennedy's 1960 steal but keep COMPLAINING about Bush's steals in 2000 & 2004.

I answered his question correctly.
Nobody complains because Kennedy was smart & a force for good & Bush is stupid & bringing us down.

(Not that that makes it ok. It doesn't. But that's why no one complains.)

Have YOU ever complained about Kennedy's steal in 1960? (Until right now?)

Watch what you think you see in someone's words.

I will disregard my better judgment and respond to Grizzly Bear Dancer. Encouraging rudeness is never a good idea, but...

I assume you are very young--if you're not, you have a serious problem. You might consider professional help. Still, you raise a couple of points that I consider interesting.

The Warren County lockdown (if that is what you're referring to) is not the least bit controversial.
Here is the summary that appeared in The Cleveland Plain Dealer's chart examining various vote fraud claims:

"It happened, but Jeff Ruppert, a lawyer for the Kerry-Edwards campaign was inside and saw nothing unusual. 'It was as clear and open as it could possibly be,' he said. Witnesses also included Democratic members of the election board and several Democrats hired to help count votes."

You're welcome to believe that with millions of dollars and thousands of lawyers at his disposal, Kerry chose not file a lawsuit because he just likes George Bush so much. The truth is, Fitrakis was peddling bullshit and Kerry wasn't buying. He trusted Ruppert's assessment. If there was any substance to the charge, you would have heard about it. Guaranteed. Bobby Junior is, to repeat, a dim bulb.

The recount in New Hampshire was extremely thorough. It produced almost no changes in the original tally: fewer than 50 (!) out of almost 700,000 votes. Bush won Ohio by 120,000 votes. What were they recounting? When Jimmy Carter won Ohio by 10,000 in 1976, Gerald Ford didn't even ask for a recount. Ohio law requires bi-partisan teams of commissioners in every county.
How is the alleged fraud supposed to happen?

Conyers is an attack dog. His job was to discredit Ken Blackwell, who is the Democrats' worst nightmare--an articulate, capable black Republican. A potential governor of Ohio, Blackwell must be demonized and destroyed at all costs. If you don't believe me, try to recall the disgustingly vile racism that leftist cartoonists have heaped on Condoleeza Rice. Watch how Steele in Maryland and Lynn Swann in Pennsylvania get treated. It's always open season on black Republicans and no blow is too low.

Conyers' report contained nothing of substance. If it did, the thousand Democratic lawyers stationed in Ohio waiting to pounce would have let you know.

One thought that seems alien to some of you: Many of us would not care to win if it required cheating.

[Grizzly Bear Dancer], Do you think RW knows more than he is willing to admit?

"the anomaly of the 2004 election was the absence of anomalies."

This does not fit in well with a prob/stat, or perhaps a better way to say it would be fractal mathematical view, in which anomolies in large systems should occur - They tend to balance themselves out in the aggregate.

I'm not saying there is any supporting evidence of it, but "the anomaly of the 2004 election was the absence of anomalies" may indicate a predetermined outcome. I only discovered the oddity in some of the statistics a few days ago from the interview on MSNBC's interview, so I am not as well informed as either GBD or RW.

I guess I try and think to much while typing. The previous post was not there when I posted. #267 in the event that it happens again. I am new & was not fond of the name-calling, but didn't feel it was my place to mention it. (Perhaps it's payback for what Kerry had?)

I am not a Republican or Democrat. 2 brands of the same can of beans. I work too forkin' hard to be forced to be eating frickin' beans for so many years

I have no idea why there is such a vehoment defense of this idea that the data should be thoroughly gone over. If there is no substance, it will backfire horribly. (Case-in-point, Rush Limbaugh might be responsible for Clinton's re-election, who knows?)

If the Bush Administration weren't so horrible in so many ways, This might be easily dismissable as a political ploy. I often have a great hurt in the depth of my soul from what has happened under their watch. I wish it would have been Edwards/McCain vs Bush/Palpatine.

I meant such a vehoment defense that the data should not be looked at again.

#269
I enjoyed your post.
The part of this that is so painful to me is that like you I am horrified by Bush administration. What they have done to our great nation is inexcusable. Look at all the horror we have endured under his watch. I guess in part I wish this could be true so that someone competent could take the wheel and start steering the country back to our former glory. Like you I am not a democrat or a republican. I would not join a political party. I just hate seeing the damage these people are doing to America. They break everything they touch.

If you don't like name calling, don't go to the Tucker Carlson post above, it is an animal house and totally out of control.

Charlene,
Not to mention the fact that 1960 was 46 years ago and not many people here voted in that election.

Charlene, if you review my postings on Bradblog going back to Nov. 2004, you will find several references to the 1960 election. In every one I criticized Kennedy severely for making light of the fraud that enabled him to win Illinois. His cavalier attitude then is a big part of the problem today. I have been entirely consistent on this point.

I also contradicted several trolls who claimed that Kennedy won the election because of Illinois. He would have won the Electoral College even if Illinois had gone to Nixon.

My husband and I have always said that Karl Rove would do anything to win and I have never been one to believe in things like this, but I have to say in this case and the previous election he should not be Pres. and why hasn't he been impeached, I don't understand our gov't at all anymore. Clinton lied about cheating on his wife and they tried to impeach him and this man has lied over and over and people have died because of it and yet nothing. Rove and Cheney leaked a name of a CIA operative and still nothing. That's treason right? What's going on in our country? I'm afraid that all of Bush's actions has changed our country, our founnding fathers must be rolling over in their graves. Constitution, what's that?

To Ronald Wieck - i am not a pacifist. I appologize to you for the personal attack because i do not know you. U R just a name even if it is only something you go by attached to your posts. All you represent to me is a disinformation spin whether it be as another paid Bushit spinster or someone who cannot read the writing on the wall or any of the other 180 points documented and evidenced in the book by Dr. Fitrakis and Harvey Wasserman about the 2004 STOLEN ELECTION. THE 2ND US POWER GRAB STOLEN ELECTION.

Some of your posts udderly disgust me to the point that i cannot take your misrepresentation of the real facts. Instead of looking at the big picture of which i see BLOOD you see a punch card stamped BUSH.

Like many others at this site, i was aware of these RIGGED ELECTIONS when THEY occured and the combination of my youth and anger without any apparent recoarse pains me every moment as a patriotic American.

The FACT that we have a mass media with people such as Tucker Carlson makes me want to get up and fight. Instead of paying attention and listening to what Mr. Kennedy has to say, he disrespectfully interupts him. Instead of doing any sort of investigative journalism, he bullies from his wrong headed point of view without asking intelligent questions in an effort to rudely dispell what Robert Kennedy Jr. Attorney at Law had to say (WHICH SHOULD BE OF INTEREST TO ALL AMERICANS WHO BELIEVE IN THE IDEALS OF DEMOCRACY.

We are all AMERICANS. The criminal thugs in who stole control of our country since 2000 are the worst lying murderer ever to run the head of state.

The US Executive branch used power through manipulation to destroy the country started with 9/11 (loosechange911.com). The Bush administration then used this leverage further to justify their killing machine in world places such as the Middle East without consequence of the irreversable effects.

The destructive inpact on the fragile ENVIRONMENT unleased by these greedy oil barron elites and illunimatis to all living species in is a crime beyond any biblical Aragedon story fortelling the END.

These people must be held accountable for their crimes in an INTERNATIONAL court of law.

Since i am an American brought up old school like many who visit the Bradblog, i will work to see that these humans are IMPEACHED AND REMOVED FROM POWER ASAP. This is our country and I am at WAR with these greedy lying RUSTERS.

To Grizzly Bear Dancer--I accept your apology. There's no reason to get angry about this stuff. Elections come and go; next time, your side is likely to do well.
I can give you my take on Bush. I voted for him both times, simply because I don't trust the Democrats on matters of national security. I disagree strongly with Bush on several domestic issues, although I am persuaded that his tax cuts worked as advertised to stimulate the economy. Bush gets no credit whatever for the current boom, but that's largely his own fault. He can't expect a hostile mainstream media to make his case for him.

Regarding the 2000 result, try viewing it from the other side's perspective. Five days before the election, Bush held a five-point lead. A Democratic operative released decades-old information about a DUI conviction and the media ran with it. Think about this: Bush has always acknowledged doing things he wasn't proud of during his drinking days. If it were possible to show that he still drinks, that would stamp him as a hypocrite and would certainly qualify as news. What is the point, however, of dredging up an incident from the seventies? In what sense is it "news" to show that Bush drank during the period that he already identified as a time when he drank? Do you see why this was a low blow? The story, in any case, cost Bush his lead.
On Election Day, the networks insisted that all Florida polls had closed when, in fact, they remained open in the heavily-Republican Panhandle for another hour. That stunt cost Bush 15-20 thousand votes by Republican estimates; 7-10 thousand by Democratic strategist Bob Beckel's.

In Palm Beach County, John Fund documents more shenanigans that robbed Bush of another 12-15 thousand votes. What follows provides a good example of what actual vote fraud looks like: the Republican senatorial candidate, a guy named Bill McCollum, lost by over 300,000 votes. Bush ran ahead of him in every county in the state, except Palm Beach. Was McCollum, for some reason, especially popular in Palm Beach? No, Bush also ran behind the combined vote for the Republican congressional candidates in that county. Here's the interesting part. While Bush's vote total was suspiciously low, Gore's total was NOT correspondingly high. In other words, Gore got the votes he could have been expected to get, as compared to other Democratic candidates for lower offices, while Bush got fewer than he should have.
Where did those votes go? Answer: into the "overvote" pile. There were TEN TIMES as many overvotes as there should have been. Police officers reported that Democrat poll workers were observed thrusting a long thin metal object through stacks of paper ballots. If you insert the object (think of it as a big pin) through the "Gore" tab, you do no damage whatever to a "Gore" vote. If you punch a "Gore" hole in a ballot that has been punched for another candidate, you create an overvote and invalidate the ballot.
Do you start to understand why Republicans get so angry when they hear about Florida. As they see it, Democrats are upset because, having stolen so many votes from Bush, they didn't steal quite enough.
As for the recounts, the Supreme Court decided by a 7-2 vote that the Florida Supreme Court overstepped its authority. The 5-4 decision was on the specific remedy.
Finally, two consortia of newsgathering organizations, the second of which included Bush-hating papers such as the NY Times, the LA Times, and the Washington Post, conducted recounts in the four Democratic counties cherry-picked by the Gore campaign and concluded that Bush would have won if the counting had not been halted. Paul Krugman has acknowledged this in his shrill, dependably anti-Bush column.

I don't love Bush. His job, in my opinion, was to defeat al Qaeda, and he did it. He and his associates won't admit it, of course, but he largely accomplished what he set out to do.

#273 Robert

I'll believe that you did complain about Kennedy's 1960 steal in the past.
And I agree with you that Repubs will get out that Kennedy clip & use it to their advantage. (It's worth it just to see Jack Kennedy again for me. He represents a time of high hopes.)
But are you going to admit you jumped to your own conclusions re what I said & called me "wrong, wrong, wrong" & a "hypocrite" because you misunderstood?

Well?
I'm waiting...

#272 Jo-Joy

You're right.
Your's is the biggest reason no one speaks of it--because it was 45 or so years ago. Most aren't even aware of the rumors that he stole it. Well, we don't actually know for sure--but it was hinted at the time.
And they did kill him.
So they did make him pay.
George Bush should pay too.

No, "they" didn't kill JFK. Lee Harvey Oswald, a communist, killed JFK. It's inconvenient, I understand, but that's the truth.

For those who would like to thank RFK Jr for his courage, please visit www.ThankYouRFK.com and sign the guestbook!

It's great the Air America and Rolling Stone are coming out with the TRUTH. But, neither of these are reaching the masses. The vast majority of people still get ALL of their information from the established mass media, like Fox, MSNBC, etc. where the "TRUTH" is distorted, twisted and serves the neocons agenda.

Democrats need to play their game. There's plenty of VERY RICH democrates out there who need to buy out Murdoch's hold over our mainstream media. Murdoch and the rest, after all, are capitalists who have their price.

No, Charlene. I don't think I misunderstood you at all. If I thought I had, I'd apologize to you.

You responded to a person who was trying to equate 1960 with 2000 and 2004. You explained away the failure of people on Bradblog to complain about 1960, while complaining vehemently about the last two elections, by saying that Kennedy was a wonderful president and Bush is terrible.

I repeat...that's wrong, wrong, wrong. We should all complain about every crooked election, regardless of whose ox is gored, and never base our complaints (or lack of them) on partisanship. Kennedy thought it was cute to make a joke out of his father's collusion with Mayor Daley, and he did get big laughs from an audience of celebrity worshippers who idolized him. But this ticked a lot of people off at the time...and justifiably so.

This post-ing will be trun-cated be-cause my last thr-ee post-ings have been block-aded by Brad's spa-m fil-ter for so-me da-mn rea-son. I kn-ow you are work-ing o-n the pro-blem, Brad.

For Char-lene: No, I did-n't mis-un-der-stand you. And I ne-ver cal-led you a hyp-o-crite. Ev-ery-one is in-vit-ed to read wh-at I pos-ted, that a dou-ble stan-dard to-ward el-ec-tion fr-aud giv-es the rite wing an ex-cu-se to call lib-er-als (not Char-lene or an-y nam-ed per-son) hyp-o-crites (plural). Char-lene, you ab-so-lute-ly did ex-plain a-way the fail-ure of blogg-ers here to com-plain eq-ual-ly about 1960, 2000, and 2004 on the grou-nds that Ken-nedy was a gre-at pres-i-dent and Bush a ter-ri-ble one. A-gain...that is wrong, wrong, wrong.

For Ronald Wieck: Lo-ok a-gain at the Za-pruder film. Wat-ch Ken-nedy's head get blo-wn a-part by a pro-jectile com-ing from 2 o'clo-ck rel-a-tive to the mo-tor-cade, spray-ing his bra-in mat-ter onto Jac-kie, sea-ted at 8 o'clo-ck. Do this, and if you can sti-ll tell us Os-wald was a lone ass-ass-in, you are eit-her a com-plete fool or are de-liber-ate-ly engag-ing in mis-in-for-ma-tion.

It's pointless to rehash the Kennedy assassination. Most views are shaped by emotion and are not susceptible to rational persuasion. I was a conspiracist myself for years. Posner's book changed my mind, although my beliefs had been undermined by the conspiracy's stubborn failure to unravel. Franklin's observation that three people can keep a secret only if two of them are dead is pertinent. The ABC News Special hosted by that stalwart conservative Republican Peter Jennings removed all doubts: Oswald fired the shots (100% probability), and he acted alone (95%).
Incidentally, your estimates of trajectories are a little hazy. See Posner's book, 'Case Closed.'

Not that I want to jump into the argument here( I have no opinion on the Kennedy assassination) however after reading the last couple of posts, I googled up this site which gives a pretty good pro-con argument and also a good list of whose-who in the whole story. This is good for those of us who don't know what the last couple of posts have to do with anything. I did find this interesting. Less than 33% of the people polled think Oswald acted alone. About the same number who think Bush is doing a good job. Hmmm...coincidence?

http://en.wikipedia.org/...y_assassination_theories

“Even though Lee Harvey Oswald is on this list only an estimated 17% to 33% of Americans believe that he acted alone. Investigations, scientific testing, and re-creations of the circumstances of Kennedy's death have not, in the American public's view, settled the question of who plotted to kill the president. A 2003 ABC TV News poll showed that only 32% (plus or minus 3%) of Americans who expressed a view believe that Oswald acted alone in the Kennedy assassination. [1] Online polls [2] show even lower percentages of 25% and 17%. Polls also show that there is no agreement on who else may have been involved.”

#282 Sir Robert Lockwood Mills III, Esquire

Only a pompous ass refuses to apologize when he's proven wrong.
(Especially when I let his nibs get by without having to prove he ever spoke of Kennedy's alleged steal of the 1960 election before right now--which was central to his holier-that-thou argument.)

2 things;

Jack Kennedy, unlike you, was a witty guy with a good sense of humor. He told a lot of jokes. The joke in question that he told re his alleged stealing of the 1960 election does not indicate he's admitting anything.
It was a joke.
You claim Kennedy's "cavalier attitude then is a big part of the problem today". That's BS, Robert. His little joke has nothing to do with today so don't try to pin that on him.

Finally, before you go & get all full of yourself Robert, I have a question for you.
Would we all be here on Bradblog complaining that Bush stole the election if Bush were smart & doing good things for the country, like Kennedy did?

Or, is it exactly as I said, that we are here complaining he stole the election because he's stupid & doing bad things?

Char-lene, I won't ans-wer your per-sonal att-ack with a sim-ilar-ly per-son-al re-sponse. My fri-ends know me as a wit-ty guy, ev-en if you don't. Ma-ny oth-er pos-ters here and else-where have com-pli-ment-ed me for hum-orous things I've writ-ten.

I have no i-dea if YOU wou-ld be com-plain-ing about the 2004 e-lec-tion if Bush we-re "smart and do-ing good thi-ngs for the coun-try. But I wou-ld. That's why I went to Flo-rida at my own ex-pense BE-FORE the e-lec-tion, to serve as a poll-watch-er, and whe-re I wit-nessed vote flip-ping and un-der allo-cation of vot-ing ma-chines. This has been a non-po-lit-ical, non-part-isan pur-suit for me, and I won't all-ow your per-son-al in-sults to chan-ge any-thing I've done or plan to do.

You did not pro-ve me wrong. You did ex-pose your-self as a part-isan by ex-cusing a doub-le stand-ard re-gard-ing the 1960 elec-tion and the last two.

I re-mem-ber that speech of Ken-nedy's very well. He ma-de it at a ti-me when many peo-ple were ang-ry ab-out what had hap-pened. You can call it a jo-ke if you like...but one does not "joke" a-bout elec-tion fraud, es-pec-ially when your po-lit-ical oppon-ents are up-set and have rea-son to be.

Try to imag-ine if Bush went a-round "jok-ing" about the last two elec-tions, and a-bout how Katherine Har-ris and Ken-neth Black-well wor-ked with Karl Rove to rig them. Just think a-bout that, ple-ase. And try to con-trol your tem-per, too.

For Ron-ald Wieck: Fair e-nough. I won't re-hash de-tails of the Ken-nedy ass-ass-in-ation with you.

But ple-ase ans-wer one quest-tion for me, as a cour-tesy (I think I've been cour-teous to you). If you we-re fac-ed with a choi-ce of rely-ing on your own eye-sight, ver-sus read-ing a book writ-ten by a per-son who might have an ag-enda (Pos-ner), which ave-nue wou-ld you cho-ose?

Un-less Za-prud-er's film was pho-ny (no-body has all-eged this), it is ab-so-lute-ly im-poss-ible for Lee Harvey Os-wald to have fir-ed the shot that blew Ken-nedy's head a-part...assum-ing, that is, that the laws of New-tonian phys-ics are vi-able and that Os-wald was in-cap-able of be-ing in two pla-ces at the same time. All the other ev-idence (in-cluding the ab-surd sing-le bullet the-ory) pales in-to in-sig-nif-icance next to Za-pruder's film, which does'n't ex-on-er-ate Os-wald but di-rect-ly im-pli-cates un-known par-ties.

For Ronald Wieck: One fi-nal com-ment, if I may. You pos-ted that you'd be-gun to doubt that any con-spiracy was in-volved in J.F.K.'s mur-der ev-en be-fore read-ing Pos-ner, on the grou-nds that it wou-ld have un-raveled by now. This is the "Why has-n't some-one come for-ward to spill the beans?"
argu-ment, of-ten used to dis-pel the i-dea that the 2004 elec-tion was rig-ged.

If the Ma-fia was in-volved in kill-ing J.F.K., which I be-lieve is the case, no-body could poss-ibly have come for-ward and sur-vived. Every-one in-volved in the cri-me knew this. In 1963 there was no such thing as a wit-ness pro-tection pro-gram. If you blew the whis-tle on a Car-los Mar-cello or a Santos Traff-icante, you we-re a dead man. Per-iod.

Re-garding elec-tion fraud, Ray-mond Lem-me told Clint Cur-tis he had evi-dence of cor-ruption in Florida that went "all the way to the top," mean-ing at least to Jeb Bush. Ray Lemme was "sui-cided" two weeks la-ter. I'd urge you to ed-ucate yourself a-bout this case, then re-consider the id-ea that if time pass-es with-out some-one com-ing forward, it sug-gests no con-spiracy occ-urred.

#287 RLM

YOU'RE the one that attacked ME, over an old axe you evidently love to grind.

One wouldn't want his nibs to waste his wit or humor here--save it for "friends".

The quote was, "Dems are tired of hearing about the 'fraud' in 1960, but NOT sick of hearing about the fraud in 2000 or 2004. Gee whiz, I wonder why?"

I wouldn't be here complaining if Bush were doing good things for our country, like Kennedy did. Nor would anyone else. Bradblog would probably not be here either if Bush were doing good things---there would be no scandals to talk about & no urgency to correct them.

Of course, you take pride that YOU would be here somewhere complaining.
You might be, but no one would be listening.

Since you're afraid "the Republicans" will say it's a double standard---tell them the time to complain was 1960.

WE, by contrast, are not going to kill Bush, no matter how much he deserves it, simply because he's not doing what we want.
Cheney would be left & he'd continue doing exactly what Bush is doing anyway. Ha Ha. (That was a joke.)
Well & because impeachment will get rid of them both plus their cronies the proper way.

The monied elite murdered Kennedy because he was going to get us out of Viet Nam & they wanted to keep it going so they could continue to make money off of it.
Johnson, unlike Cheney, agreed to take up their cause if he were President.
Johnson was the career master at power wheeling & dealing. He also hated everything about Kennedy. Yet he still agreed to be Kennedy's seemingly impotent second banana. This was odd behavior from a man that lusted after the Presidency his entire career & was not the type to tolerate sitting on the sidelines.
What he had been up to became clear in Dallas.
The monied elite also began the Iraq war with Bush as their front man & they intend to keep it going too. Anyone who seriously stands in their way will probably also be killed. No joke.

You accuse me of being "partisan". That's rich because I've been REPUBLICAN most of my adult life. Yea--you didn't know that, did ya?
Less government is always better than more.
But today's Republicans are not doing that.

Robert Lockwood Mills observes that he has been courteous and deserves a response. He is correct on both counts.

I had originally felt that the Mafia murdered JFK, as their motive was clear and assassination is, after all, what they do. The evidence presented in Posner's book, reinforced by the ABC special, is so strong, however, that I can't ignore it while claiming to value reason and logic. Oswald did it.

The stolen election claims for 2004 strike me as ridiculous. I've studied the results for a year-and-a-half, corresponded with every author of a paper on the exit polls, spoken over the phone with Warren Mitofsky--there's simply nothing there. Bobby Jr. gave it away in his article. He wrote,"The exit polls even showed Kerry breathing down Bush's neck in supposed GOP strongholds Virginia and North Carolina." But he really wasn't. Pre-election polls showed that Kerry was not competitive in either state, and he wound up losing Virgina by 8 points, North Carolina by 12. Whether we like it or not, Kennedy's statement can only mean that the exit polls were wrong. This is the reason that nobody paid any attention to the Rolling Stone article.

I've never understood how the myth that JFK would have avoided involvement in Vietnam got started. He was a tougher Cold Warrior than Johnson. His rhetoric was more bellicose (remember his inaugural address?) and he had stated several times in the Senate that Vietnam would be the next big test for the West. I know that Schlesinger and Goodwin have produced reams of revisionist history on the subject, but I can see absolutely no reason to think that JFK didn't intend to resist North Vietnam's ambition to conquer South Vietnam. Recall that before his sharp swing to the left in 1967, Bobby Kennedy was the guy who wire-tapped Martin Luther King.

RLM # 288

You sort of answered your own question.

The laws of Newtonian physics are NOT viable in 2006. Kennedy probably just had a really bad headace.

RLM:

That's strange that you're the only one having trouble with the filter. What a hassel!

If you have windows, have you tried a "system restore" from the "help menu" back to before the problem started?

I think that's beyond my ken, Larry. All I know is that three consecutive postings of mine were blocked by the spam filter for whatever reason. This is the first non-truncated one I've made since.

Several earlier postings were blocked, but never in succession. I notified Brad in each case, and he was able to detect a "bad word" in each one. In one case the bad word I used was actually O.K. by itself, but the system blocked it because it was part of a longer word that isn't O.K.

As far as J.F.K.'s murder is concerned, I'm genuinely astonished at how many intelligent people still believe Oswald acted alone, when the Zapruder film proves beyond all doubt (not just reasonable doubt) that he could not possibly have fired the fatal shot.

For argument's sake, let's suppose someone had taken home movies of Lincoln's assassination from inside Ford's Theater. The film showed Booth, directly behind Lincoln's chair, but it also showed Lincoln's head being blown open by a shot that drove his brain matter sideways through the air onto Mary Lincoln's dress. Would anyone watching the film argue that Booth could have fired the shot?
Of course not. He was directly behind Lincoln, and bullets don't change course in mid-air. A shot fired from six o'clock cannot possibly strike someone at nine o'clock and spray detritus to three o'clock.

Before anyone replies, I know there were no movie cameras in 1865. And I know Booth, and Booth alone, shot Lincoln. And I know Mary was seated on Abe's right, whereas Jackie was on J.F.K.'s left. But the principles of physics didn't change between 1865 and 1963. There is simply no rational explanation for the fact that millions of people have seen the Zapruder film and still think Oswald was a lone assassin. I suspect many of these folks are also sending their e-mail addresses to Sierra Leone, hoping to claim their share of $150 million left to them by a murdered freedom fighter.

#294
Whoever is blocking his nibs just can't take any more of his wit & humor either.

I find it odd that anyone would continue to maintain that the Zapruder film "proves" something it manifestly did not. Various investigators have recreated the shooting, duplicating Oswald's position and all of the relevant angles. They have concluded that there was no "magic" bullet. Moreover, the task was a relatively easy one for someone of Oswald's abilities.

Well, look at it yourself, Ronald. Trust your own eyesight. Don't trust me or any of the "various investigators" you refer to. Just look at it. There's no issue of a magic bullet. Kennedy's head was blown open by something, and it wasn't magic, it was a gunshot. Nobody disputes this. The only question is, "Where did the fatal shot come from?"
The film clearly shows it came from the grassy knoll and nowhere else. Who cares what someone writes, when the truth is right there in plain sight for all of us to see?

In the modern lexicon, "Do you trust what you read, or do you trust your lying eyes?"

The ABC video is available for less than twenty bucks (visit the website). I find it a useful supplement to Posner's book as it employs state-of-the-art graphics to illustrate its conclusions. The Zapruder film is analyzed and, no, the shot most definitely did not come from the grassy knoll. I thought that by now everyone had abandoned that theory.

Theory? Theory? If the fatal shot came from somewhere other than the grassy knoll, then please explain how J.F.K.'s brains got splattered all over Jackie, who was seated to his left. If you think that's a theoretical statement, please look at photos of Jackie on Air Force One...she was still covered with blood from inside her husband's skull.

Do you accept that the blood on Jackie came from the final and fatal shot? Do you not believe the fatal shot was fired at the moment the Zapruder film demonstrates that it was? Even the Warren Commission accepted that fact. And it is beyond anyone's cavil that Oswald, at that very moment, was in the Book Depository Building, at precisely a 6 o'clock position relative to the motorcade. Damn it to hell, there is no possible way that a shot from 6 o'clock could have struck J.F.K. at 2 o'clock and driven his brains to 8 o'clock, unless a projectile reversed course in mid-air or struck something ahead of the motorcade and ricocheted backward at a bizarre angle. That's a theoretical possibility, but so remote that I've never heard it advanced. If ABC or Posner believed that, we'd know it by now.

As far as your thought that everyone had abandoned that "theory," the last poll I read showed that something like 68% of the American people do not believe Oswald acted alone. That poll was taken long after Posner's book was published and (I believe) long after the ABC show. Frankly, I'm surprised it isn't 98%.

Why would you believe ABC and Posner when you can see the Zapruder film for yourself? I didn't see the program, so maybe you can tell me if any dissenter was allowed to challenge ABC's findings on air. If not, it's nothing more than an opinion piece, like a court case with no cross-examination. Posner's book expresses his views; it doesn't present a balance, as can be gleaned from its presumptuous title, "Case Closed" (in other words, don't bother to argue with me, you fools).

You seem to prefer these two highly suspect sources to the naked eye and to Newtonian physics. I cannot fathom why.

For some reason, you describe an independent journalist and a left-leaning news network as "highly suspect sources." What are they suspected of? They simply reject a belief that you hold for purely emotional reasons. Nothing in the trajectory of Oswald's shots violates Newtonian physics. Why not read Posner's argument for yourself and watch the ABC special? If you still have specific criticisms, the time to present them is after you've familiarized yourself with the relevant material.

Come again? ABC news is left leaning?

Pull the other one.

Well, ABC News is somewhat to the right of Kim Jong Il. When Jennings said he inherited his anti-Americanism from his mother, he probably wasn't playing to a conservative crowd.

Ignore This Again: 1960 Election

As someone who was born in Illinois and who still lives in that state, I'm really tired of hearing this one. The final electoral vote count was 303-219. Illinois had 27 electoral votes at that time. Had they been handed to Nixon, he still would have been short. Remember, Kennedy was a pro-union Catholic and Chicago, the major population center, was heavily made up of pro-union Catholics. What a surprise that Kennedy carried Cook County!

link here

Fran #207 ... good post ... some ignored it so I re-posted it ...

Posner and ABC are suspect because their conclusions fly directly in the face of clear filmed evidence to the contrary. I won't question their motives except to remind you that Posner's book is titled "Case Closed." If someone wants to contribute to a contentious debate, the last thing one does is to pretend he and only he has all the answers. I make no such claim. Nor have you.

You say "Nothing in the trajectory of Oswald's shots
violates Newtonian physics." If your base assumption is true (that Oswald was a lone assassin), then the above statement cannot be true...assuming only that the Zapruder film was not doctored with before being shown, something no one has ever alleged to my knowledge.

Once again, Mr. Wieck: The Zapruder film, taken from the area of the grassy knoll (I hope you agree with that statement), shows CONCLUSIVELY that the shot that blew J.F.K.'s head open struck him on the right-forward side of his head. It lifted his scalp and drove the brain matter within to the left and slightly backward...in other words, along the exact path of a shot that could have originated from the grassy knoll area only.

Whatever shots Oswald might or might not have fired, he could not have fired that shot, because he was directly down range from the motorcade at that moment (this fact is not in dispute). A shot from Oswald's position in the Book Depository (I hope you'll agree that's where he was at the fatal moment) cannot have struck J.F.K. where the last shot did unless it first ricocheted off something.

To say, "None of Oswald's shots violate Newtownian physics..." uses an assumption as proof, the assumption being that Oswald was a lone assassin. That's exactly what the Warren Commission did...it began with this assumption and built a case around it, a case that was proven false by the Zapruder film. Now we have sane people trusting a book and a TV special to solve a puzzle that their own lying eyes can solve in 30 seconds. What in the world is going on here?

I'm posting this separately because it speaks not to the J.F.K. assassination, but to your debating technique, Mr. Wieck.

You state that I hold to my belief that Oswald was not a lone assassin for "...purely emotional reasons." That's beyond presumptuous. How in hell would you know what motivates me? Would you appreciate it if I said, "Ronald Wieck is off his rocker, a prisoner of his own emotions."????

One thing I've discovered from Internet blogs is that people who don't have the facts on their side (in this case, filmed evidence that contradicts their argument) often resort to personal statements in lieu. To suggest that I'm motivated by emotion and not a desire for truth is a perfect example of this.

Your criticism is fair. You seem to be intelligent, so I will proceed on the assumption that you seek the truth.

I just finished a rereading of 'Case Closed.' The breadth of Posner's research is staggering. Unlike the conspiracists, who are extremely selective in presenting evidence and who are not above distortion and outright falsification, he appears to have considered everything. I have yet to meet someone capable of coming to terms with the conclusions Posner reached who seriously thinks he got it all wrong. The book is that powerful.

I suggested that your beliefs about JFK's assassination were based on emotion to provoke you to read 'Case Closed.' I agree with the columnist--I forget who it was--who wrote that the only reason there is a large cottage industry surrounding the murder is that the left didn't get the villain it wanted. If Oswald had turned out to be a rightwing nut, we wouldn't have heard nearly as much speculation about the killer and his motives.

THAT LOUD SHUFFLING SOUND YOU ARE HEARING IS THE SOUND OF JFK AND DADDY ROLLING OVER IN THEIR GRAVES. A KENNEDY WRITING AND COMPLAINING ABOUT ELECTION FRAUD? WHAT'S NEXT, TED KENNEDY'S ADVICE ON PUBLIC MORALITY.
YOU HAVE GOT TO DO BETTER THAN THIS. THE PEOPLE WHO OPPOSE YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO ANYTHING AT ALL TO CONVINCE PEOPLE THAT YOU ARE A BUNCH OF NUTS. YOU JUST GAVE THEM ABOUT 6 MONTHS WORTH OF GOOD MATERIAL TO MAKE ALL OF YOU LOOK LIKE PERFECT ASSES. (YES, THERE IS SUCH A THING AS PERFECTION.) BUSH MAY HAVE STOLEN THE ELECTION(S) OR HE MAY NOT HAVE. IF GORE OR KERRY HAD SMARTER SUPPORT ORGANIZATIONS, DO YOU THINK THEM ABOVE DOING THE SAME THING FOR THEMSELVES. BY THE TIME A PERSON REACHES SUCH HIGH PUBLIC OFFICE, DO YOU NOT THINK THAT PERSON HAS BENT, BROKEN, AND SMASHED ABOUT EVERYTHING THAT WAS ONCE GOOD ABOUT THEMSELVES, IF THERE WAS ANYTHING. IF MORE PEOPLE ACTUALLY GAVE A DAMN, WOULD ANY ELECTED OFFICIAL LAST LONGER THAN A FEW YEARS BEFORE BEING TOSSED OUT ON THEIR ASSES FOR BECOMING A TOTAL SLIMEBALL. IN THE TIME IT TOOK ME TO READ YOUR BLOG AND THE RFK JR. ARTICLE, THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE ACROSS THIS GREAT LAND BOUGHT HUMMERS AND BITCHED ABOUT FUEL PRICES, GOT MARRIED, GOT DIVORCED, HAD SEX WITH SOMEONE, BLEW UP A TERRORIST, CLUBBED A BABY SEAL, PLOWED OVER A RAIN FOREST, AND SPENT TIME TYPING ALL THIS TO NO ONE IN PARTICULAR----- AND NOT ONE PERSON READ THAT ARTICLE AND GOT PAST THE TITLE AND AUTHOR AND TOOK ANYTHING HE HAD TO SAY SERIOUSLY. YOU HAVE TO DO BETTER THAN THAT. IF SOMEONE ACTUALLY READ ALL OF THIS, DROP ME AN EMAIL. SINCERELY, KING OF APATHY.

The Zapruder film is the focus of much of the ABC video and is extensively analyzed in Posner's book. It simply does not show what you suggest. I urge you to get a copy of 'Case Closed.'

The yawning MSM silence about RFK Jr's comprehensive June 15 Vote Disappearing article in RollingStone made me yet more head-banging-against-so-many walls aware that we are in the frog-in-cold-water rise of totalitarianism in USofA.

This was a Paul Revere article --- alarums should have been raised all over the country in editorials. Yet the gigantic HoHum prevailed in such a multitude that this anti-evidence of keeping us down on the farm cowed and sheeped makes me weep as I watch freedom slosh not even noisily down the drain. Oh woe is we.

There's openvotingconsortium, a high level computer gigageek and concerned citizens group which is fighting for open source code for computer voting that keeps me from thinking All Is Lost.

ps. For those unfamiliar with the Poor Frog in Cold Water: if you throw a frog into boiling water, it will leap out in the searing horror of the offense to its living system. However, if you put a frog into cold water and slowly and steadily raise the heat, the Poor Frog will end up cooked with out much wiggling. So here we are in nazi-lite, a totalitarianism of executive aggrandizement and liberties being disappeared or diluted in the almighty (ahem) name of 'security.' Caveat citizen.

{ed note: Disinfo deleted.}